Alpha Protocol

[Lemur]

Yeah, judging by the reviews I've read, you could summarize it all as: "Deus Ex this ain't." Too bad, really. I was ready to smack down $40 for a decent RPG.

[frogbeastegg]

I have to admit that returning to see this thread is not the happiest experience. How many people here have played it? One? How many are panning it without playing it based on paid reviews? Looks like nearly everyone.

I could have told you months ago that this game would be panned by paid reviewers. It has all the classic hallmarks - not pretty, requires time to see the gameplay develop, not by one of the adored big names like Rockstar, no huge advertising budget. That limits the game to a 7/10 or 3/5 at best on most sites, and lo and behold that's close to what it's got on that list posted earlier.

Everywhere I look the paid reviewers are doing their usual, and a whole host of actual players who are loving the game. Finding flaws, yes, but loving it and playing through it more than once to see the other options. There's a 45 page long mostly positive thread over on the very critical quarter to three forums, and a second thread devoted solely to spoilers. That puts it about even with Mass Effect 2 and Dragon Age. Same kind of reaction on the other forums I've looked at.

People are experiencing vastly different stories based on their choices in this game: who lives, who dies, who's friend and who is foe, where they do and don't go, the very style of standard gameplay itself, it all changes based on player decisions. All styles of play are viable, from run and gun to stealth with minimal (no?) killing.

So I've brought a copy. The only reason it took me so long was I needed to wait for a price drop; now I've got a house to pay for I can't justify full price games. I'm going to start it today and I expect a typical Obsidian experience: average gameplay, some wonkiness and bugs, and an outstanding RPG.

I will say that the console version appears to be the way to go unless you have a pad for your PC. Some of the mini games don't work so well with a mouse and keyboard.

[johnhughthom]

I don't think it's possible to play without killing anybody, there are a few boss battles where I'm pretty sure you need to kill them.

[Monk]

I have to admit that returning to see this thread is not the happiest experience. How many people here have played it? One? How many are panning it without playing it based on paid reviews? Looks like nearly everyone.

I could have told you months ago that this game would be panned by paid reviewers. It has all the classic hallmarks - not pretty, requires time to see the gameplay develop, not by one of the adored big names like Rockstar, no huge advertising budget. That limits the game to a 7/10 or 3/5 at best on most sites, and lo and behold that's close to what it's got on that list posted earlier.

Everywhere I look the paid reviewers are doing their usual, and a whole host of actual players who are loving the game. Finding flaws, yes, but loving it and playing through it more than once to see the other options. There's a 45 page long mostly positive thread over on the very critical quarter to three forums, and a second thread devoted solely to spoilers. That puts it about even with Mass Effect 2 and Dragon Age. Same kind of reaction on the other forums I've looked at.

People are experiencing vastly different stories based on their choices in this game: who lives, who dies, who's friend and who is foe, where they do and don't go, the very style of standard gameplay itself, it all changes based on player decisions. All styles of play are viable, from run and gun to stealth with minimal (no?) killing.

So I've brought a copy. The only reason it took me so long was I needed to wait for a price drop; now I've got a house to pay for I can't justify full price games. I'm going to start it today and I expect a typical Obsidian experience: average gameplay, some wonkiness and bugs, and an outstanding RPG.

I will say that the console version appears to be the way to go unless you have a pad for your PC. Some of the mini games don't work so well with a mouse and keyboard.

When i heard Obsidian was involved i knew exactly what would happen. Gameplay would be decidedly meh, but the story and rpg itself would be fine and that seems to be the consensus. I think I'll grab it for future playings. For now i'm busy with another (very) flawed but enjoyable RPG - The Witcher. I must be honest, I may or may not finish that one

[rajpoot]

I wrote a small passage about this game on the wiki, and in Gamespot. Don't go by what the 6/10 reviews say. This game shouldn't be compared to other recently released RPGs...specially not Mass Effect 2. Because this is nothing like Mass Effect 2.
The game advertises itself as an Espionage RPG. The 'espionage' part is limited to the fact that the player character is a agent in a sort of spy agency. The stealth mechanics of this game are quite shallow, and rather unsatisfactory. Furthermore, like the reviews are saying, being stealthy isn't needed at all, unless one wants a few perks. This game can easily be played like a shooter after a certain point. The only problem with doing that though, is that in the early portions of the game, hitting the target is hard. To be good at shooting, one needs to invest in the skills, or else the whole assault rifle magazine empties and the enemy will still be standing.
And yes there are a few bugs. None of them game breaking though (And to be honest I didn't encounter a single bug throughout).
So basically this game isn't bad. Infact I enjoyed it a lot. It's a good RPG. Just not a decent stealth game or a decent shooting game. The story is fine, and has a few twists but where it shines is that the players decisions have real effects in how events play out later in the story. That part of decision-effect is done quite well. Better than it was done in the ME series and DAO infact.
The characters are nothing special, and actual interaction with characters, like dialogue and stuff, is limited. That's a drawback. Still the voice acting is fine and that makes some of the characters shine.
The only real disappointment for me was the ending. I found it rather unsatisfactory and lacking.

While everything I wrote above is quite haphazard (), but trust me when I say that this is a game worth playing. Had this been released a few months back...maybe before ME2....then the reviews would've been better. But anyhow, the game's good enough deserves a sequel. A sequel which will come only if this one sells. So please. Get. This. Game.

Edit:
The decision-effect system is actually more akin to what the Witcher has than any other. Like what is done in ME has some minor effects in ME2. In Alpha Protocol though, all the decisions that are made will have an effect before the game ends.

I'll give it 8.5 on 10.

[seireikhaan]

I was turned off when I saw gameplay footage of the player engaged in a shootout with an enemy, who promptly decided, mid fight, that climbing a nearby ladder would be fun. Turns its back, holsters gun, and the player calmly pegs them mid climb. I don't demand the AI be super amazingly cunning, but some common sense is a necessity.

[rajpoot]

I was turned off when I saw gameplay footage of the player engaged in a shootout with an enemy, who promptly decided, mid fight, that climbing a nearby ladder would be fun. Turns its back, holsters gun, and the player calmly pegs them mid climb. I don't demand the AI be super amazingly cunning, but some common sense is a necessity.

That kind of enemy behaviour is actually a rare quirk. Far as I know stuff like that happens when the player is too far away from the enemy....far away enough to be considered out of sight by the AI. In such a situation they stop shooting and start moving in an attempt to get closer to the player\get a better position to shoot from. Happened to me when I was in a firefight and ran to the foot of this ladder, out of the LOS of the enemy at top. So he started climbing down.....

Most of the comparisons in that respect have been based on the dialogue system, since they both share a 'pick tone from menu and wait to see what happens' design. AP has a time limit so you can't sit there for ages deciding which is the most beneficial option. Also - supposedly - there are no wrong options. Some people prefer the AP style as it brings tension and a natural flow to dialogue, others don't like the pressure.

The other have been based around NPC loyalty (doing 1 set mission versus needing to work and play to that character's likes), and the effect of player choices (not that much versus quite a lot).

IMO this individual approval deal, with a numbered scale to mark approval, is a lot better than the system in ME2. Approval system here is a lot more like what it was in DAO. So basically they've picked the dialogue wheel from ME series, and used it with a DAO style approval system. Though, I don't like the time limit thingy either. Nor the fact as to how the number of conversations is so limited and places where conversations trigger, pre-set.

[frogbeastegg]

I didn't get chance to play it at all yesterday. Visitors and so on. This evening, I hope ...

This game shouldn't be compared to other recently released RPGs...specially not Mass Effect 2. Because this is nothing like Mass Effect 2.

Most of the comparisons in that respect have been based on the dialogue system, since they both share a 'pick tone from menu and wait to see what happens' design. AP has a time limit so you can't sit there for ages deciding which is the most beneficial option. Also - supposedly - there are no wrong options. Some people prefer the AP style as it brings tension and a natural flow to dialogue, others don't like the pressure.

The other have been based around NPC loyalty (doing 1 set mission versus needing to work and play to that character's likes), and the effect of player choices (not that much versus quite a lot).

I was turned off when I saw gameplay footage of the player engaged in a shootout with an enemy, who promptly decided, mid fight, that climbing a nearby ladder would be fun. Turns its back holsters gun, and the player calmly pegs them mid climb. I don't demand the AI be super amazingly cunning, but some common sense is a necessity.

Sadly I've seen comparable stunts in many games, past and present and of varying overall quality. Maybe all AI developers have a secret place in their heart where they wish to emulate the old Lemmings games?

For now i'm busy with another (very) flawed but enjoyable RPG - The Witcher. I must be honest, I may or may not finish that one

Did you get the enhanced edition or the enhancement patch for the basic version of the game? They add quite a bit of polish.

I was disappointed when they dropped the console port. The combat system in the game always felt like it suited a pad better than a mouse.

[Monk]

Did you get the enhanced edition or the enhancement patch for the basic version of the game? They add quite a bit of polish.

I was disappointed when they dropped the console port. The combat system in the game always felt like it suited a pad better than a mouse.

Enhanced Edition; it isn't technical problems that hold the game back. It's the simply awful presentation, terrible characterization and voice-acting that can't sell an emotion for anything. As clunky as the combat system is, i actually liked it and i found the story itself to be interesting. But what I can't cope with is a dull, lifeless voice coming from everyone who i'm supposed to sympathize with. They just seem so bored, constantly undermining any sense of urgency I have.

Few more details in the "What are you playing?" topic, as to avoid derailing this thread further.

[frogbeastegg]

I installed this to my 360 last night and decided that it's best not to play it - my console is making the "I'm about to die!" noises I remember so well from the last time it broke. There's a good trade in deal against the new model that's out on the 16th of July so I've decided to barely play it between now and then, hopefully keeping it alive, and trade it. Works out at £80 for a brand new console with a larger HD, halved power consumption, redesigned innards which will be less prone to 360 death syndrome, and to add the cherry to the cake it will be around 5 decibels quieter than my current jumbo jet console.

Damn. I'd been looking forward to this.

[Lemur]

How many people here have played it? One? How many are panning it without playing it based on paid reviews? Looks like nearly everyone.

Sorry to disappoint, Ms. Frog, but I've been a loyal Obsidian customer in the past—can't think of a title of theirs I don't own—and I been burned. Until I hear from experienced RPG hands that Alpha Protocol is the cat's pajamas, the bee's knees and the bishop's handshake, I'm steering clear.

I look forward to reading your impressions, however.

[frogbeastegg]

Sorry to disappoint, Ms. Frog, but I've been a loyal Obsidian customer in the past—can't think of a title of theirs I don't own—and I been burned. Until I hear from experienced RPG hands that Alpha Protocol is the cat's pajamas, the bee's knees and the bishop's handshake, I'm steering clear.

Then go look for some players impressions. Really, go. It's getting a lot of love out there from people who also recognise the flaws. Try here for enough impressions to sink a ship, or rock, paper, shotgun's what I think article.

If you wait for a paid reviewer to say it's good you'll be waiting forever. Sites like IGN and gamespot (home of the Kane and Lynch scandal, lest we forget) were never going to give it a good review. Never. They'll play it for several hours and then pan it because it isn't pretty or made by one of the big names who get away with releasing generic, bland pap.

I have zero faith in any professional review site these days. Haven't for a long time. I go straight to the horse's mouth: players and people reviewing for the love of it. Since I dumped the paid reviews and adopted this approach I haven't picked up a single game I disliked, compared to before where I'd get one every now and then I hated or was apathetic about. Many of the recent games that I've been somewhat disappointed with - say a 7 or 8 out of 10 on the frog scale - have also been those the press made the most fuss out of.

I look forward to reading your impressions, however.

It's going to be several weeks before I can play it. If my xbox dies before trade in day it becomes worthless. :sad frog: