Star Fox- Lylat Wars [Concluded]

[Renata]

Final question, because we're approaching the point at which it must be asked. How much do you trust your investigations? There's an option to your survival that I hadn't brought up yet, which is that you're still alive as an investigator because you are no threat. That is a HUGE contradiction if the enemy really is down to hiding among only three people. You may already have 'cleared' the Big Bad.

Though granted I wouldn't expect Psychonaut, Khaan, OR DiY to engage in the epic fail of sending in kill orders for someone already dead. What about those on your team? Any bad vibes?

[Beskar]

If you want to be accurate, none of the people I have investigated are Andross.

If any of the venomians were recruited later, then that is a different point in itself. But I am 100% certain in my results.

[Romanic]

If you want to be accurate, none of the people I have investigated are Andross.

If any of the venomians were recruited later, then that is a different point in itself. But I am 100% certain in my results.

How can you say that Beskar? The rules clearly state different:

Investigation roles are not 100% effective

Are you ignoring that fact on purpose?

I already said it, but here it is again: In a game like this, I am expecting that at least Andross will be protected from scan results, and maybe others.

Also, you said that there's only three suspects left, and we know there's at least three mafia left (Shogun, Gorgon, Andross). Odds are that at least one has slipped through your scanning process.

That's another scummy tell for you Beskar: Boasting that your scans are 100% effective when you should be aware that they are not.

Another scummy tell is willingness to reveal Cornerians whenever the occasion arises. You rushed to answer Renata's query to know who were the remaining Cornerians, as if you didn't care at all about them. Now, please answer this question as fast: Who are the member of the Star Wolf team?

Right, no need to answer. I know you won't.

3rd scummy tell: Peppy is the only Star Fox member left around, and you were pushing for him to reveal. Why? The way things are going, you should be aware that Peppy will be killed if he reveals.

4th scummy tell: Your role PM is forged. Many parts are not ATPG's, it's blatant. I was ready to keep silent on this, figuring that you were protecting important information for the town by doing so, but now I don't know anymore.


If you are really working with the Cornerians Beskar, you are doing a really bad job of it. Really, really bad. I've been lenient with you, but I don't believe you anymore.

Y'know, "Investigation roles are not 100% effective" could also mean that AA scanning you as neutral is

From now on, Falco will approve any lynch of Beskar. He's too much of a risk.

[Chaotix]

Please note that on these earlier days I was a different character.

During the Beefy lynch day I believe I was a Cornerian. And then shortly after that I died, probably killed by Star Wolf.

I think I stepped in for merciary... 3? 4 rounds ago? Day 8 sounds about right, without an in-depth look at Beskar's list. (Note- with all that color-coding, Beskar probably knows when I stepped in better than me.)


Oh, and Beskar is still scum. That is all.

[Nightbringer]

4th scummy tell: Your role PM is forged. Many parts are not ATPG's, it's blatant. I was ready to keep silent on this, figuring that you were protecting important information for the town by doing so, but now I don't know anymore.

Y'know, "Investigation roles are not 100% effective" could also mean that AA scanning you as neutral is

From now on, Falco will approve any lynch of Beskar. He's too much of a risk.

Can you explain what about his role pm is forged? That would make the argument much more convincing. We should also keep in mind that the "Investigation roles are not 100% effective" could easily be about investigators only being able to check whether people are neutral. Or only being able to check whether they are town, as we have seen them work all along.

[Choxorn]

Can you explain what about his role pm is forged? That would make the argument much more convincing. We should also keep in mind that the "Investigation roles are not 100% effective" could easily be about investigators only being able to check whether people are neutral. Or only being able to check whether they are town, as we have seen them work all along.

The Quicktopic link leads to an Epic Fail Pic, and the names of his partners aren't revealed. That's completely understandable, but still evidence that it's been forged.

[Romanic]

Can you explain what about his role pm is forged? That would make the argument much more convincing.

Besides the obvious part that Choxorn mentioned, the following part is forged:

Ability: You can investigate.

• Don't get too cocky, Star Fox. - You can select one target and scan them.

Blatant lack of details: Does not mention when he can scan, nor the kind of result he will get. That's not from ATPG, he's more conscientious.

Conclusion: Beskar is not a scanner.

That, per se, does not make Beskar an enemy of the Town, but there's been too many scumtells, and being caught in a lie is just one of them.

We should also keep in mind that the "Investigation roles are not 100% effective" could easily be about investigators only being able to check whether people are neutral.

To me, "Investigation roles are not 100% effective" means that you will not get the right scanning result every time, but how it works is unclear.

The scanning power he is claiming is too powerful compared to what we've seen so far:

Double A: able to scan for neutrals, getting a yes/no result if someone was neutral.
Romanic: able to scan for Venomians, getting a yes/no result if someone was Venomian.

Beskar: able to investigate, getting a faction as a result <---- Seriously?

And claiming that his scans are 100% effective. That's just does not work with game balance. Why would 2 Star Fox members have lowly scanning powers and Beskar such a strong one?

He's lying.

[Nightbringer]

Good explanation, I'll give Beskar a chance to explain before drawing any conclusions

[pevergreen]

Blatant lack of details: Does not mention when he can scan, nor the kind of result he will get. That's not from ATPG, he's more conscientious.

Quite possible, I also don't think that Don't get too cocky, star fox would be used

Why not use the actual line: "I can't let you do that Star Fox." ATPG has used lines from Lylat Wars in the writeups.

[Renata]

Those who did NOT vote Beefy this day, kindly explain your position? I see this almost the opposite of Beskar. It's much easier for the mafia to "get it right" in a situation like that than it is for a townie to do so.

Beefy187: (21) JHT, TheTheFlax, Beskar, Joooray, Nightbringer, Yaseikhaan, miotas, Secura, pevergreen, Skooma Addict, choxorn, Beefy187, Krill, DIY, Renata, ATPGood, landlubber, hello_hound, Frozen in Ice, shlin28, civplayah

Khazaar: (5) Double A, Diana, WEW, ArpeggiateTHIS, Nictel

Psychonaut: pevergreen
hellhound: Chaotix
Skooma Addict: Psychonaut
Double A: Khazaar
Khazaar: autolycus

Abstain: Nightbringer

Edit: Excluding WEW whom I think is town, that would be Diana, Chaotix, Psychonaut, Khazaar, Autolycus, Nightbringer (or maybe CDF).

[wideyedwanderer]

Those who did NOT vote Beefy this day, kindly explain your position? I see this almost the opposite of Beskar. It's much easier for the mafia to "get it right" in a situation like that than it is for a townie to do so.



Edit: Excluding WEW whom I think is town, that would be Diana, Chaotix, Psychonaut, Khazaar, Autolycus, Nightbringer (or maybe CDF).

Renata actually thinks I'm town? I'll answer the question anyway. I thought Khazaar was as good a suspect as Beefy, so I wanted to give Beefy some time to prove his innocence before voting for him, since he claimed Rob64.

I think Diana, Khazaar, and Nightbringer are either Venomian, or members of Star Wolf. I'd like to believe Autlucus' claim of General Pepper, but one thing I've noticed is that in the other games I've played with him, he's always been more active. This game, he doesn't seem so active...

Anyone else notice that we gave Beskar yet another chance, and once again, he blew it?

[autolycus]

It's true, I often am more active, although my average talkativeness is much lower here than over on CFC, and given that I seem to almost invariably be scum over there, that doesn't really indicate much. But I usually base much of my strategy off of behind the scenes communications, which none of us who aren't part of Star Fox or Star Wolf or scum can have. With respect to the day we lynched Beefy and my not being part of that, I don't honestly remember whether it was because I didn't think lynching someone who'd uncontradictedly claimed ROB was a good idea, or whether I just wasn't on between when Star Fox came out against him and the end of the day.

[Beskar]

Anyone else notice that we gave Beskar yet another chance, and once again, he blew it?

What did I blow? I didn't choose the kill choice. Again.

Falco will approve any lynch of Beskar. He's too much of a risk.

I am not a risk at all. Don't be a fool.

Beskar: able to investigate, getting a faction as a result <---- Seriously?

And claiming that his scans are 100% effective. That's just does not work with game balance. Why would 2 Star Fox members have lowly scanning powers and Beskar such a strong one?

He's lying.

No, I am not.

I am able to investigate with getting their ship as a result. Also, it works with game balance a lot, since both Star Fox and Cornerians get a truck full of power-roles, revivers, etc, and we basically have one for us and the entire venomians.




Also, stop trying to purposefully screw up the game and hand over the mafia a victory. Seriously. Even Double A proved I was a neutral so instead focus on the suspects. There are 5 people who are not investigated, Andross is one of those five and he needs to die ASAP or we all lose. Peppy needs to follow me, so we can make best use of the opportunity to get Andross.

[Romanic]

Also, #1) stop trying to #2) purposefully screw up the game and hand over the mafia a victory.

Nuh-uh.

#1) "Stop trying to screw up the game" implies that I did it at least once before. Please clarify how I've been doing it before. I've been lenient with you so far, and I'm surprised to hear this instead of an actual argumentation.

#2) "Purposefully" implies that I have a reason to screw up the game. I am Falco, confirmed innocent. What's my reason?

Bad choice of words really.

Don't blame me for speaking against you when it's all your fault. It would have been different if you acted pro-town and not so obviously pro-Wolf. For all I've seen you don't care about Star Fox or the Cornerians, and it speaks of hidden agenda like many others already pointed out.

If you are really pro-town, well, maybe you should have done some things differently, because a lot of us don't trust you anymore, including most of the Star Fox team.

I'd really like to see you lynched, just to see which color you will appear in the writeup. Gray for neutral, or Red for evil

Seriously. Even Double A proved I was a neutral so instead focus on the suspects.

That's barely a proof considering how useless scans have been so far in this game, we can see this from your own results: You've scanned a lot of players without a successful Androssian scan, and there's to your saying, five players who have not been scanned so far :

There are 5 people who are not investigated, Andross is one of those five and he needs to die ASAP or we all lose.

The three mafia would be left in the remaining five unscanned players?! Either you are lying to us, or the scans are not 100% effective.

[Nightbringer]

Nuh-uh.

#1) "Stop trying to screw up the game" implies that I did it at least once before. Please clarify how I've been doing it before. I've been lenient with you so far, and I'm surprised to hear this instead of an actual argumentation.

#2) "Purposefully" implies that I have a reason to screw up the game. I am Falco, confirmed innocent. What's my reason?

Bad choice of words really.

Don't blame me for speaking against you when it's all your fault. It would have been different if you acted pro-town and not so obviously pro-Wolf. For all I've seen you don't care about Star Fox or the Cornerians, and it speaks of hidden agenda like many others already pointed out.

If you are really pro-town, well, maybe you should have done some things differently, because a lot of us don't trust you anymore, including most of the Star Fox team.

I'd really like to see you lynched, just to see which color you will appear in the writeup. Gray for neutral, or Red for evil



That's barely a proof considering how useless scans have been so far in this game, we can see this from your own results: You've scanned a lot of players without a successful Androssian scan, and there's to your saying, five players who have not been scanned so far :



The three mafia would be left in the remaining five unscanned players?! Either you are lying to us, or the scans are not 100% effective.

Yes, he may not have used the best words, but targeting that isn't much better. As to him being pro-wolf... of course he is pro wolf, he is star wolf, but being pro wolf is the same as being anti andross, which is everyones objective. Star Fox is gone, maybe he let that happen, maybe not, but even if he did is a revenge kill worth letting Andross win? Maybe we should just worry about getting a neutral town victory, and a mafia loss. Even if everything you have been saying is true we still should not vote Beskar because we know he is not andross.

[Romanic]

Yes, he may not have used the best words, but targeting that isn't much better. As to him being pro-wolf... of course he is pro wolf, he is star wolf, but being pro wolf is the same as being anti andross, which is everyones objective. Star Fox is gone, maybe he let that happen, maybe not, but even if he did is a revenge kill worth letting Andross win? Maybe we should just worry about getting a neutral town victory, and a mafia loss. Even if everything you have been saying is true we still should not vote Beskar because we know he is not andross.

I'll blame that argument on inexperience, but being neutral is not testament of being on the side of the town. Neutral roles usually have different victory conditions than townies, otherwise they would be townies.

We know that the Venomians can win with the town (from the standard Venomian role PM), but we haven't read anything stating that Star Wolf can win with us, except Beskar's word.

If I were you, I'd be very cautious in assuming that Star Wolf can win with the Cornerians / Venomians.

[Romanic]

Yes, he may not have used the best words, but targeting that isn't much better. As to him being pro-wolf... of course he is pro wolf, he is star wolf, but being pro wolf is the same as being anti andross, which is everyones objective. Star Fox is gone, maybe he let that happen, maybe not, but even if he did is a revenge kill worth letting Andross win? Maybe we should just worry about getting a neutral town victory, and a mafia loss. Even if everything you have been saying is true we still should not vote Beskar because we know he is not andross.

WAIT A MINUTE! What do you mean by "a revenge kill" ?

Please do explain. Do you think I am trying to get a revenge on Beskar?

[Nightbringer]

What did I blow? I didn't choose the kill choice. Again.



I am not a risk at all. Don't be a fool.



No, I am not.

I am able to investigate with getting their ship as a result. Also, it works with game balance a lot, since both Star Fox and Cornerians get a truck full of power-roles, revivers, etc, and we basically have one for us and the entire venomians.




Also, stop trying to purposefully screw up the game and hand over the mafia a victory. Seriously. Even Double A proved I was a neutral so instead focus on the suspects. There are 5 people who are not investigated, Andross is one of those five and he needs to die ASAP or we all lose. Peppy needs to follow me, so we can make best use of the opportunity to get Andross.

Makes sense, and honestly, does ANYONE have proof of General Pepper being int he game. Someone would have evidence of his doing anything.

[naut]

Those who did NOT vote Beefy this day, kindly explain your position? I see this almost the opposite of Beskar. It's much easier for the mafia to "get it right" in a situation like that than it is for a townie to do so.



Edit: Excluding WEW whom I think is town, that would be Diana, Chaotix, Psychonaut, Khazaar, Autolycus, Nightbringer (or maybe CDF).

I know you can't respond, but my position here was voting for Skooma. THE MAFIA!

Thanks for your thoughts on the voting patterns. It's clarified for me who the mafia is. WEW is not, he was quick to jump on the Pinman vote, before it turned into a wagon. Chaotix has constantly been voting innocents, and obvious innocents at that.

Vote: Chaotix

EVERY REMAINING CORNERIAN/VENOMIAN/STAR WOLF MEMBER VOTE CHAOTIX.

Second. Autolycus's claim could mean he's forged a cover PM, maybe not. It shouldn't be ignored. Nightbringer's posts are scummy as all that is holy, and thus I'm willing to paper over this for now.

Thirdly Diana Abnoba is also Andross. Boom. Done and dusted.

[Nightbringer]

I know you can't respond, but my position here was voting for Skooma. THE MAFIA!

Thanks for your thoughts on the voting patterns. It's clarified for me who the mafia is. WEW is not, he was quick to jump on the Pinman vote, before it turned into a wagon. Chaotix has constantly been voting innocents, and obvious innocents at that.

Vote: Chaotix

EVERY REMAINING CORNERIAN/VENOMIAN/STAR WOLF MEMBER VOTE CHAOTIX.

Second. Autolycus's claim could mean he's forged a cover PM, maybe not. It shouldn't be ignored. Nightbringer's posts are scummy as all that is holy, and thus I'm willing to paper over this for now.

Thirdly Diana Abnoba is also Andross. Boom. Done and dusted.

So we're back to calling me scummy? i was just confirmed as neutral like 2 rounds ago.
Anyway, my whole case is we can't ignore autolycus. Ever since the heat got off him he has gone quiet again. He ran in to post a faked role pm when targeted then drops off the board once the heat is off, stinks of scum to me. We should also note that only after almost getting everyone to lynch autolycus is the night Beskar finally gets killed. Maybe he got killed because he was on the right trail and the mafia is just hoping everyone will give up on it with star wolf gone. In any case, i think papering over the matter is the last thing we want.

[Renata]

Post 451 slightly in Psychonaut/YLC's favor, though nothing definitive. Pinman went "role claim" to a comment of YLC's, complete with juggling smilie. Seemed like he was doing it just to buff his credentials as a Venomian ... drew attention to YLC/Psychonaut as a claimed Cornerian ... actually I'm not sure. Given what Pinman was trying at the same time, it's not impossible YLC might be going for the same in reverse. His posts were certainly over-the-top enough. Not all that different from his behavior in ABZF. Meh, null tell.

[Renata]

Autolycus' record is quite scummy -- third on about three bandwagons (heh) -- except Pinman's, in which he sat at a mafia-comfortable just-past-halfway -- and otherwise voted lurkers.

Pinman: (12) Arpeggiate, WEW, God Emperor, JHT, miotas, pevergreen, autolycus, DIY, Secura, TheFlax, Double A, Beskar

Beskar: (7) landlubber, Stuck in Pi, Yaro, Renata, Yaseikhaan, Frozen in Ice, Pinman

Stuck in Pi: (2) Beefy, Nightbringer
Wideyedwanderer: (1) Nightbringer
ArpeggiateTHIS: (1) Khazaar

No Lynch: (1) hell hound

abstain: (4) Diana, Seon, Skooma, ATPGood

(votes after midnight don't count)

Did Not Vote: (8) (Joooray, Krill, merciary, Nictel, Rob_the_Celt, splitpersonality, Winston Hughes , YLC)

The no-lynch here is good for hell_hound -- would be a crazy thing to do if he were on Pinman's team.

[Renata]

Will have to continue tomorrow.

[DELETE_THIS]

Day 8... It will always be remembered...