Morrowind and Oblivion

[rajpoot]

What's up with everyone loving the Dark Brotherhood quests so much?
I thought that the ones in Knights of the Nine were a lot better and unique....

[Raz]

The series used to have randomly generated area before Morrowind. Far as I know the wilderness and dungeon areas in Arena and Daggerfall were all random. The quests also were random.

Yes, but in Arena you could point yourself towards any city in Tamriel and walk onwards for eternity but you'd never actually reach the place. The only legitimate form of travel was the fast-travel. The randomness was there because of limitations, not to improve replayability.

[lars573]

What's up with everyone loving the Dark Brotherhood quests so much?
I thought that the ones in Knights of the Nine were a lot better and unique....

Simple really. In other RPG's with quest lines like the Dark Brother also have morality systems. Which would severely affect the overall game if you go whole hog into the DB style quest lines. The ES lack of a morality system means you can dive into the psychopathic villainy of the Dark Brotherhood and once it's over, no consequences. And Knights of the nine is supposed to be the polar opposite of the Dark Brotherhood. I actually enjoyed both. Solving the puzzle of what crusader relics to get in what order was a good challenge.

[Beskar]

Simple really. In other RPG's with quest lines like the Dark Brother also have morality systems. Which would severely affect the overall game if you go whole hog into the DB style quest lines. The ES lack of a morality system means you can dive into the psychopathic villainy of the Dark Brotherhood and once it's over, no consequences. And Knights of the nine is supposed to be the polar opposite of the Dark Brotherhood. I actually enjoyed both. Solving the puzzle of what crusader relics to get in what order was a good challenge.

ES has "infamy" which works similar to good/evil. So if you do bad things, you can end up getting barred from churches and the guards hating you. (plus people on general, with some, even liking you more).

Thing is about Dark Brotherhood, it is actually tailored assinations. Most games it is simply "kill x, go out". In Elder Scrolls, it is a mix of 'thief' and assassin's creed. You have to sneak about, do secret paths, try to play people off against eachother, etc. You even get paid more money and get rewards for going about the special ways.

Obviously, you could waltz in and go "MURDER TIEM", but there is absolutely zero fun in it. Which is probably why some people didn't like the quests. (as they did that)

[lars573]

Infamy is only accumulated if you get caught. And/or escape from the clink. Not like in Fable (which isn't really an RPG) or Fallout. Where if you do bad things your immediatly dealt an evil point.

[TevashSzat]

The big difference the two for me was that Morrowind just seemed much more epic and grand than Oblivion. There was so much stuff to do (ie just think of how many guilds there actually are in Morrowind compared to the 4 or so in Oblivion) and it always seemed like there was something new. Oblivion, although quite epic in some respects, just didn't give me that feeling and lacked content in a way compared to Morrowind.

[lars573]

All told Morrowind only had about 3 more guilds than Oblivion.

Both have these incommon
Blades
Fighters
Mages
Thieves
Assassins*

Unique to Morrowind
Imperial legion
Imperial cult
Great House
Vampire clan
Tribunal temple
East Empire company
Nord Villiage

Unique to Oblivion
Arena**
Knights of the Nine
Mad-gods court

*Two different guilds that amount to the same thing
**I could never be bothered with the Arena in Morrowind so it might very well count as common to both.

[johnhughthom]

**I could never be bothered with the Arena in Morrowind so it might very well count as common to both.

You can duel one character at the Arena in Morrowind, that's it.

You forgot the vampire clans in Morrowind and you have the three Great Houses down as one despite each questline being very different.

[lars573]

But you can't join all three, in the same game. Only one, so all though there are 3 it's effectively only one. It's really one of the few times in either of the ES games I've played where joining a faction closes off joining others. The Vampire clans are the other.

[johnhughthom]

Yes but that adds to the replayability of Morrowind, the very thought of playing through Oblivion again sends me to sleep.

[lars573]

Really? I've done that 4 times. If my Xbox worked I'd do a fifth.

[johnhughthom]

Really? I've done that 4 times. If my Xbox worked I'd do a fifth.

So you do multiple playthroughs? That pretty much makes your argument about only being allowed into one of three choices redundant. You can have three very different games in Morrowind, each with a lot of unique content, pretty much every playthrough of Oblivion is the same.

[God Emperor]

I completed the dark brotherhood along with the mages guild,here some time ago, and I had this feeling that about 50 % of the game was done:p

Though it makes no sense at all for me why the mages guild fights the necromancers, and further more, why it does not raise infamy for doing so.
The dark brotherhood was, I must admit, actually fun to play. Though I never got to use the poisoned apple :(

The Arena in Morrowind was used for more than one fight, but it is true, it was not a very active place

[lars573]

So you do multiple playthroughs? That pretty much makes your argument about only being allowed into one of three choices redundant. You can have three very different games in Morrowind, each with a lot of unique content, pretty much every playthrough of Oblivion is the same.

I was talking about Oblivion. If my Xbox 360 was working I'd play through Oblivion a 5th time. I've not done the Knights of the nine or the Shivering Isles but once.

And my Morrowind games are always very similar. Never do the thieves guild, stealth skills are too counter-intuitive in Morrowind. Great houses are not the best quest line, I don't like them. I've only ever done 2, Hilaalu and Redoran. I'll never go near Telvanni. And I'll never touch Hlaalu again. Redoran is the only one for me. I won't ever try and join the religous cults again either. Not after trying to join the Tribunal temple.

[God Emperor]

Concidering lore, It would make sense for your character to join the temple if he is in the house redoran :p