Global Climate Disruption.

[Pannonian]

Que? Jesus =/= God the Father!!!

It's the new Risasi heresy. When people are encouraged to interpret the scriptures in any way they wish, they come up with some darn strange readings. The son is the father. It's like Oedipus Rex transplanted to downtown hickland.

[Greyblades]

I suppose, seeing as jesus hadn't separated from god at the time of genesis we could technically say jesus created reality and time.

[Risasi]

Accounted in the Bible events span about 7000 years (if we believe the dating given in it), so definitely it is too chronologically protracted to speak of ALL of it written by AN eyewitness. Even the New Testament having been written by an (or several) eyewitness(es) is doubtful. And if we remember the complicated history of choosing what must be included into the Bible and the story of its compilation it dates back to about IV century a.d.

Hardly a history book written by those who saw everything with their own eyes.



Que? Jesus =/= God the Father!!!

God uses men as eye witnesses, and also dictates to them what to write. "Hey you! Write this down". He then would give them street cred by endowing great works of awe to these men.
I didn't say 7000, btw. To be accurate, so far, roughly 6000'ish years of human history have transpired. There is an unknown period of time which precedes this. It could be mere days or it could be thousands, millions, I suppose billions of years.
There is also 1000+ years of future history yet to be fulfilled, which is referenced in the scriptures. Then comes global warming.

You bring up a valid criticism worth an answer. There have been a great many false epistles, corrupted texts, etc. What to believe?...so most men discount it as a work of fiction and never look at it. "Fairy tales", they say. It is still the greatest single compilation of literature from the annals of history, yet it is largely ignored.
The majority texts from many different locales, written over a great period of time are in agreement. The original source languages are the inspired Word of God. Not the translations. Many translations are good, some just plain suck. I use a few different translations; KJV, NKJV, Rotherham, Geneva, ASV. But I also study the original words in their Hebrew and Alexander's Koina Greek. Aramaic and Chaldee are also found in there. Notice Latin is not in there. The tools to study these languages are readily available, thanks to technology. I never said tech or true science are worthless, just inferior to what God has to say.

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I suppose, seeing as jesus hadn't separated from god at the time of genesis we could technically say jesus created reality and time.

Careful, if you start thinking logically through this and investigating what the scriptures actually say, you might start believing as I do:

John 14:5-9; Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me. “If you had known Me, you would have known My Father also; and from now on you know Him and have seen Him.” Philip said to Him, “Lord, show us the Father, and it is sufficient for us.” Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you so long, and yet you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, ‘Show us the Father’?

[Papewaio]

Tangent, but I have to ask.

Why are so many ultra conservatives against stem cell research and human cloning? Clones are just identical twins with a large time offset (and aged cells).

See if God sacrifices his Son/Himself to remove the need of all future sacrifices surely stem cell research is in the same vein?

Jesus is a clone of God put into Mary the (surrogate) Mother.

So if God can do good things by sarificing a clone, why can't humans do stem cell research or raise (but not sacrifice) clones?

[Risasi]

I will gladly answer any questions you have. But rather than continue to junk up the climate disruption thread how about I create a separate one? I will label it something very tongue in cheek and you fellows can lambaste me to your heart's content. The only reason I even brought up bible is because it specifically affects how I view the whole "global warming" thing. So there is no reason to drift this thread any longer.

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P.S. I can't speak for every christian, but I can give you my viewpoint and perhaps that of "mainstream" christendom...or churchianity, whatever you would like to call it.
I'm not ultra-conservative. I'm also not mainstream, not anymore. And while I will happily talk to someone from a different denomination, I'm actually anti-denominational. According to the bible denominations should not exist. I'm rather a-political too. Example; I'm amused by the POTUS thread, but don't really care that much any longer who is elected.
I'm also not really religious, although many who don't know me well would probably be surprised to hear that. Just as an example I despise the "pontifex", all of his hocus-pocus, and everything his pederastic order stands for. So while offended by their hierarchy, I will gladly talk to the average joe roman catholic about their beliefs and the scriptures, or a mormon...or a muslim. In fact I have talked to a few, even a Kuwait citizen who used to frequent this board. I find all cultures very interesting and have operated in several.
My point is I like to dialog with people who are sincere and wish to debate. Even if our beliefs are not the same. I am merely a student of the bible and meet with other individuals in a local church, and we dialog and discuss about what the bible says. I think that's unique, but 50-100 years ago it was not.

Anyway, I'm a bit tired right now as it's late. And I have had a very long day dealing with corporate. I don't think I can do your question justice. I'll post tomorrow or the next day, how about that?

[Sarmatian]

You would... talk... to a... to a... Muslim??? And a Catholic and a Mormon? Really? As in, face to face? Like, at a dinner table or something?

I don't know about others, but I'm convinced.

[a completely inoffensive name]

You would... talk... to a... to a... Muslim??? And a Catholic and a Mormon? Really? As in, face to face? Like, at a dinner table or something?

I don't know about others, but I'm convinced.

Yes, but can he talk to a woman?

[Greyblades]

Tangent, but I have to ask.

Why are so many ultra conservatives against stem cell research and human cloning? Clones are just identical twins with a large time offset (and aged cells).

See if God sacrifices his Son/Himself to remove the need of all future sacrifices surely stem cell research is in the same vein?

Jesus is a clone of God put into Mary the (surrogate) Mother.

So if God can do good things by sarificing a clone, why can't humans do stem cell research or raise (but not sacrifice) clones?

I'm fairly sure the church has been arguing the degree of influence Mary had in Jesus' birth since it's beginning.

To me it makes more sense that Jesus is a child of both god and Mary (not a clone) under the logic that if god's intent was to have a vessel to walk about on earth without changing himself in any way he wouldn't bother with a mother.

[Gilrandir]

I didn't say 7000, btw. To be accurate, so far, roughly 6000'ish years of human history have transpired. There is an unknown period of time which precedes this. It could be mere days or it could be thousands, millions, I suppose billions of years.

That is why it is impossible to call the Bible "Memoirs of AN eyewitness". Too many eyewitnesses, consequently too many incompatibilities probably stemming from different agendas and intentions of those who wrote them and those who chose what is to be eventually "The Bible".

It is still the greatest single compilation of literature from the annals of history

I disagree. "The Silmarillion" rules.

John 14:5-9; Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me. “If you had known Me, you would have known My Father also; and from now on you know Him and have seen Him.” Philip said to Him, “Lord, show us the Father, and it is sufficient for us.” Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you so long, and yet you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, ‘Show us the Father’?

The Father has no visible shape. One can't see him at will, only when He wishes to. So Jesus is kinda Deputy God to communicate to on petty matters when it is not worth bothering the Boss. As simple as that.

Jesus is a clone of God put into Mary the (surrogate) Mother.

AFAIK, cloning and surrogate motherhood are different. The former doesn't require any intermediary organism to produce the offspring.

[Papewaio]

Dolly the sheep was not grown in a vat. Current technology still needs a surrogate womb for complex organisms.