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Thread: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

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    Senior Member Senior Member Idaho's Avatar
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    Default The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    I don't like to say I told you so... well I lie, I love it. It proves what a clever ginger I am.

    I wanted to go and find the two threads I posted this on, but I don't have time to find them. I tried and failed in my search.

    My prediction was that Murdoch would abandon the Labour party and put his media empire behind the Tories. But old digger isn't stupid. He expects to get payback. And the payback needed to come in the form of attacks on the BBC - his biggest rival. His websites are now behind a paywall, and the BBC website is the biggest rival both online and on TV.

    Murdoch praises government plans

    BBC Funding Frozen/Reduced

    Of course Murdoch wins on two counts. He's a notorious tax dodger, and the government have targetted their cuts specifically to hit the poorest, while leaving the richest relatively untouched. Odd really for a cabinet that consists of 20 millionaires, a number of whom are 'non-doms' (registered in foreign countries to avoid paying tax). Indeed the government brought in retail magnate Phillip Green to advise on cost savings. A man worth many many millions, made from stores in the UK, but who pays no UK tax.

    Meanwhile the banks will have to pay a £2.5bn a year tax. Seem like a lot? Well seeing as they got £850bn of our money over the last few years, it's chump change. Perhaps I should go and get £85 loans from them and see if I can pay it back at the rate of £2.50 a year?
    "The republicans will draft your kids, poison the air and water, take away your social security and burn down black churches if elected." Gawain of Orkney

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    Darkside Medic Senior Member rory_20_uk's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Targeted to hit the poorest... The old acclaim never looses popularity, does it?

    What exactly did the poor loose? I'm not talking about hand outs here - that isn't something that they ever earned, they were given - so let's not include the council tax waiver, the subsidised food, housing, children's allowance, free prescriptions, free travel... oh how the list goes on... Are they paying more taxes? Is there a poor tax?


    Let's see what was done:

    Child trust funds cut (oh yes, increased for the poor)
    Child benefits now with ceiling (of £26,000 - more than the average wage!)
    Incapacity benefit means-tested
    Elderly care means tested

    The banks did not get given money. The government bought shares at the nadir. Rather like a Hedge Fund would. They are now at the point of making a profit. They also made money providing insurance for debt which also gained the governement a profit

    Your "loan" of £85 would also mean you gave 70% of your car to them permanently in exchange. They then later as an afterthought asked for £2.50 a year in being so nice in buying the car.

    An enemy that wishes to die for their country is the best sort to face - you both have the same aim in mind.
    Science flies you to the moon, religion flies you into buildings.
    "If you can't trust the local kleptocrat whom you installed by force and prop up with billions of annual dollars, who can you trust?" Lemur
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    TexMec Senior Member Louis VI the Fat's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    nm
    misread the source
    Last edited by Louis VI the Fat; 10-22-2010 at 11:26.
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    Clan Clan InsaneApache's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Ahhh Idaho, guarenteed to get the juices flowing eh?

    Some people just refuse to 'get it'.

    I have to, upon pain of imprisonment, fund the BBC. If I want to watch telly, I have to buy a license from the BBC to do so.

    As for Murdoch, I can decide whether or not I want to buy/watch/read his particular brand of piffle. If I don't, I won't get sent to gaol, unlike the BBC.

    Now on to the issue of how may millionaires there are in the cabinet. I wonder how many millionires there are in the shadow cabinet?

    Meet the new Boss, same as the old Boss.

    Now then, all this talk of cuts and somesuchlike. There will only be cuts in the increase of budgets, not real cuts at all. Factor in the fact that government spending increased by 50% in the last decade, then account for the austerity measures and government expenditure in set to rise.

    Not my definition of a cut. Don't know about you lot.

    And this is your starter for ten. Who's economic genius put us in this situation?

    That is all.
    There are times I wish they’d just ban everything- baccy and beer, burgers and bangers, and all the rest- once and for all. Instead, they creep forward one apparently tiny step at a time. It’s like being executed with a bacon slicer.

    “Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists or not, diagnosing it incorrectly, and applying the wrong remedy.”

    To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticise.

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    Senior Member Senior Member Idaho's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by rory_20_uk View Post
    Targeted to hit the poorest... The old acclaim never looses popularity, does it?

    What exactly did the poor loose? I'm not talking about hand outs here - that isn't something that they ever earned, they were given - so let's not include the council tax waiver, the subsidised food, housing, children's allowance, free prescriptions, free travel... oh how the list goes on... Are they paying more taxes? Is there a poor tax?
    We currently have over 2m unemployed, and another half million are about to lose their public sector jobs. Direct effect will be poverty, secondary result will reduce wages = poor will become poorer.

    Unemployment benefits are to only last a set amount of time = poor will be under more pressure and will become poorer.

    Reduced public services = worse conditions/services for people who can't afford to pay

    Increased higher education costs = poor will have to make themselves poorer to afford to get out of poverty
    "The republicans will draft your kids, poison the air and water, take away your social security and burn down black churches if elected." Gawain of Orkney

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    Darkside Medic Senior Member rory_20_uk's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Unemployment benefits are to only last a set amount of time = more incentive / pressure to get a job! Jobs get taxed, more money to the state. Currently there's so little pressure to work it's not funny.

    Reduced public services = Perhaps increases in efficiency that have fallen in the last decade. Novel ways of undertaking activities. Might even stop doing pointless services. Can't afford to pay for what? Interesting how many things are viewed as essential that didn't exist even 50 years ago.

    Increased higher education costs = More incentive to think before getting on a degree and to value one's degree. Better campuses to compete with China / India / the USA and improve the intellectual capital. Loan paid back of the next 30 YEARS, only when earning a salary and then written off. Still subsidies for the poorest, and increase in investment in the poorest children in schools in real terms.

    An enemy that wishes to die for their country is the best sort to face - you both have the same aim in mind.
    Science flies you to the moon, religion flies you into buildings.
    "If you can't trust the local kleptocrat whom you installed by force and prop up with billions of annual dollars, who can you trust?" Lemur
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    BrownWings: AirViceMarshall Senior Member Furunculus's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    or to consider it in another light:

    1. as does anyone with functioning frontal lobes.

    2. practically everyone else got hit, why would the beeb escape?
    Furunculus Maneuver: Adopt a highly logical position on a controversial subject where you cannot disagree with the merits of the proposal, only disagree with an opinion based on fundamental values. - Beskar

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    Senior Member Senior Member Idaho's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by rory_20_uk View Post
    in real terms.
    "In real terms" is something that politicians say when they want to twist a statistic to fit their agenda.
    "The republicans will draft your kids, poison the air and water, take away your social security and burn down black churches if elected." Gawain of Orkney

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    Darkside Medic Senior Member rory_20_uk's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Cuts are often also twisted to include rises that are deemed to be lower than critics would like, and of course removal of handouts.

    An enemy that wishes to die for their country is the best sort to face - you both have the same aim in mind.
    Science flies you to the moon, religion flies you into buildings.
    "If you can't trust the local kleptocrat whom you installed by force and prop up with billions of annual dollars, who can you trust?" Lemur
    If you're not a liberal when you're 25, you have no heart. If you're not a conservative by the time you're 35, you have no brain.
    The best argument against democracy is a five minute talk with the average voter. Winston Churchill

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    BrownWings: AirViceMarshall Senior Member Furunculus's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    i'm pleased to say, that in real terms, the defence budget cut is only 7.3% rather than the 8.0% figure quoted, thank you beeb.
    Furunculus Maneuver: Adopt a highly logical position on a controversial subject where you cannot disagree with the merits of the proposal, only disagree with an opinion based on fundamental values. - Beskar

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    Senior Member Senior Member gaelic cowboy's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Did anyone see that CH4 Dispatches programme on those tax havens and there connection to the Tories through the hedge fund guys donating to the election.

    I couldnt stop laughing the Tories are only in and there up to there old trick again.
    They slew him with poison afaid to meet him with the steel
    a gallant son of eireann was Owen Roe o'Neill.

    Internet is a bad place for info Gaelic Cowboy

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    BrownWings: AirViceMarshall Senior Member Furunculus's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    colour me concerned.
    Furunculus Maneuver: Adopt a highly logical position on a controversial subject where you cannot disagree with the merits of the proposal, only disagree with an opinion based on fundamental values. - Beskar

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    Senior Member Senior Member gaelic cowboy's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Furunculus View Post
    colour me concerned.
    The FCO was gonna make them pay more tax in return for being allowed to increase sovereign debt.

    Suddenly the Tories are in and the FCO drops the plan behind the couch after they got millions in donations.
    They slew him with poison afaid to meet him with the steel
    a gallant son of eireann was Owen Roe o'Neill.

    Internet is a bad place for info Gaelic Cowboy

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    Darkside Medic Senior Member rory_20_uk's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by gaelic cowboy View Post
    Did anyone see that CH4 Dispatches programme on those tax havens and there connection to the Tories through the hedge fund guys donating to the election.

    I couldnt stop laughing the Tories are only in and there up to there old trick again.
    Politicians self-serving and corrupt? Who'd've thought it?

    In the Lord's a few have been suspended for acts that us mere mortals would have been forced to repay, fined, charged interest and possibly even a suspended sentence. There it was 1 Tory and 2 Labour, but probably many others were just as guilty.

    All parties have had soft loans, "interesting" interpretation over campaign expenditure - you name it, a politician has done it.

    These elite will spend on whoever they think is in power as they want influence. Most have no morals or loyalties that can't be bought and sold.

    An enemy that wishes to die for their country is the best sort to face - you both have the same aim in mind.
    Science flies you to the moon, religion flies you into buildings.
    "If you can't trust the local kleptocrat whom you installed by force and prop up with billions of annual dollars, who can you trust?" Lemur
    If you're not a liberal when you're 25, you have no heart. If you're not a conservative by the time you're 35, you have no brain.
    The best argument against democracy is a five minute talk with the average voter. Winston Churchill

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    Senior Member Senior Member gaelic cowboy's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by rory_20_uk View Post
    Politicians self-serving and corrupt? Who'd've thought it?

    Yea except this is brazen cheek at a time of cuts in the UK the hedge fund industry centered in a caymans etc etc donates to Tories and the plan only on the table weeks before gets dropped.

    The Caymans had to ask the FCO permission to buy sovereign debt so Labour said fine buy debt but bring in some kind of tax on financial services they refused and waited for the Tories to back there mates and got approval to buy debt.



    By the way what is it with you and the smoking smilies those things will kill you man
    Last edited by gaelic cowboy; 10-22-2010 at 13:21.
    They slew him with poison afaid to meet him with the steel
    a gallant son of eireann was Owen Roe o'Neill.

    Internet is a bad place for info Gaelic Cowboy

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    Old Town Road Senior Member Strike For The South's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Idahos a ginger?
    There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford

    My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.

    I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.

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    Senior Member Senior Member gaelic cowboy's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    There's a few of us about Strike
    They slew him with poison afaid to meet him with the steel
    a gallant son of eireann was Owen Roe o'Neill.

    Internet is a bad place for info Gaelic Cowboy

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    Senior Member Senior Member Idaho's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    Idahos a ginger?
    I am most certainly not! I've had some insults over the years in this forum, but that's well OTT.
    "The republicans will draft your kids, poison the air and water, take away your social security and burn down black churches if elected." Gawain of Orkney

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    Senior Member Senior Member Idaho's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by rory_20_uk View Post
    These elite will spend on whoever they think is in power as they want influence. Most have no morals or loyalties that can't be bought and sold.
    I just don't understand right-wingers. Someone on a council estate scams a few grand a year on benefits and it's the end of the world. Someone scams a few million in tax dodging or sharp practice and it's fair enough.
    "The republicans will draft your kids, poison the air and water, take away your social security and burn down black churches if elected." Gawain of Orkney

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    BrownWings: AirViceMarshall Senior Member Furunculus's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Idaho View Post
    I just don't understand right-wingers. Someone on a council estate scams a few grand a year on benefits and it's the end of the world. Someone scams a few million in tax dodging or sharp practice and it's fair enough.
    perhaps it is harder to be outraged about money that you never had, and would never be spent on you anyway, than money you paid in the hope that it might help someone else, only for it to disappear in fraud.............. :D

    besides which, i have sympathy towards anyone trying to dodge the 50% income tax rate, it is never moral for the state to tithe half or more of your income.
    Furunculus Maneuver: Adopt a highly logical position on a controversial subject where you cannot disagree with the merits of the proposal, only disagree with an opinion based on fundamental values. - Beskar

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    TexMec Senior Member Louis VI the Fat's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Murdoch will do anything he can to destroy the sanitary influence of serious journalism on Britain.

    Outside the UK, all his media outlets have been bitterly anti-EU ever since Brussels' anti-trust measures prevented him from doing to the European media what he's done to the Anglo press.



    ~~o~~o~~<<oOo>>~~o~~o~~


    Meanwhile, get with the times, Cons! In a timely article earlier today, one of the world's foremost economists, Krugman totally rubbishes the British austerity measures:
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Krugman
    In the spring of 2010, fiscal austerity became fashionable. I use the term advisedly: the sudden consensus among Very Serious People that everyone must balance budgets now now now wasn’t based on any kind of careful analysis. It was more like a fad, something everyone professed to believe because that was what the in-crowd was saying.

    And it’s a fad that has been fading lately, as evidence has accumulated that the lessons of the past remain relevant, that trying to balance budgets in the face of high unemployment and falling inflation is still a really bad idea. Most notably, the confidence fairy has been exposed as a myth. There have been widespread claims that deficit-cutting actually reduces unemployment because it reassures consumers and businesses; but multiple studies of historical record, including one by the International Monetary Fund, have shown that this claim has no basis in reality.

    No widespread fad ever passes, however, without leaving some fashion victims in its wake. In this case, the victims are the people of Britain, who have the misfortune to be ruled by a government that took office at the height of the austerity fad and won’t admit that it was wrong.
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    Britain, like America, is suffering from the aftermath of a housing and debt bubble. Its problems are compounded by London’s role as an international financial center: Britain came to rely too much on profits from wheeling and dealing to drive its economy — and on financial-industry tax payments to pay for government programs.

    Over-reliance on the financial industry largely explains why Britain, which came into the crisis with relatively low public debt, has seen its budget deficit soar to 11 percent of G.D.P. — slightly worse than the U.S. deficit. And there’s no question that Britain will eventually need to balance its books with spending cuts and tax increases.

    The operative word here should, however, be “eventually.” Fiscal austerity will depress the economy further unless it can be offset by a fall in interest rates. Right now, interest rates in Britain, as in America, are already very low, with little room to fall further. The sensible thing, then, is to devise a plan for putting the nation’s fiscal house in order, while waiting until a solid economic recovery is under way before wielding the ax.
    But trendy fashion, almost by definition, isn’t sensible — and the British government seems determined to ignore the lessons of history.

    Both the new British budget announced on Wednesday and the rhetoric that accompanied the announcement might have come straight from the desk of Andrew Mellon, the Treasury secretary who told President Herbert Hoover to fight the Depression by liquidating the farmers, liquidating the workers, and driving down wages. Or if you prefer more British precedents, it echoes the Snowden budget of 1931, which tried to restore confidence but ended up deepening the economic crisis.

    The British government’s plan is bold, say the pundits — and so it is. But it boldly goes in exactly the wrong direction. It would cut government employment by 490,000 workers — the equivalent of almost three million layoffs in the United States — at a time when the private sector is in no position to provide alternative employment. It would slash spending at a time when private demand isn’t at all ready to take up the slack.
    Why is the British government doing this? The real reason has a lot to do with ideology: the Tories are using the deficit as an excuse to downsize the welfare state. But the official rationale is that there is no alternative.
    Indeed, there has been a noticeable change in the rhetoric of the government of Prime Minister David Cameron over the past few weeks — a shift from hope to fear. In his speech announcing the budget plan, George Osborne, the chancellor of the Exchequer, seemed to have given up on the confidence fairy — that is, on claims that the plan would have positive effects on employment and growth.

    Instead, it was all about the apocalypse looming if Britain failed to go down this route. Never mind that British debt as a percentage of national income is actually below its historical average; never mind that British interest rates stayed low even as the nation’s budget deficit soared, reflecting the belief of investors that the country can and will get its finances under control. Britain, declared Mr. Osborne, was on the “brink of bankruptcy.”
    What happens now? Maybe Britain will get lucky, and something will come along to rescue the economy. But the best guess is that Britain in 2011 will look like Britain in 1931, or the United States in 1937, or Japan in 1997. That is, premature fiscal austerity will lead to a renewed economic slump. As always, those who refuse to learn from the past are doomed to repeat it.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/22/op...me&ref=general
    Ouch!
    Last edited by Louis VI the Fat; 10-23-2010 at 00:02.
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    Senior Member Senior Member Brenus's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    In the mean time, as the Tories were cheering at the announcement of the cuts, some of my colleagues started their redundancy procedure.
    To see the face of the 50 something years old, having to go home to tell the family that at the end of November, no more job. X-mass will be nice.
    In the mean time, the Mayor of London Boris Johnson will increase the Railways Fair around just 70%. Taxes will go up soon. The Social Benefit will give more than the Banks. But we are all together and all is fair…

    This demolition Coalition succeeded in making Maggie looking as a Social Democrat. The poor woman is actually in a hospital, but she would be proud, as soon she will recover.

    I am not in this charette… Perhaps next time, but it will be fair, of course…
    Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. Voltaire.

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    "You did, sarge", said Polly." You said you were in few last stands."
    "Yeah, lad. But I was holding the metal"
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    Ranting madman of the .org Senior Member Fly Shoot Champion, Helicopter Champion, Pedestrian Killer Champion, Sharpshooter Champion, NFS Underground Champion Rhyfelwyr's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by gaelic cowboy View Post
    There's a few of us about Strike
    I'm not alone! There are far too many gingers in the Backroom it would seem, proportionally speaking.
    At the end of the day politics is just trash compared to the Gospel.

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    Ultimate Member tibilicus's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    I think it was Francis Fukuyama who described world economic integration and liberalisation and capitalism as "the end of history", meaning that no other system could effectively take its place ever. It would appear it really is the end of history as any remnant of what was the post-war consensus/ social society is finally washed away for good.

    The thing is, I find it hard to be genuinely mad. Simply put, there is no alternative, despite what some might say. The current debt levels are as bad as the ones in the 1970s which effectively saw us become a bankrupt nation. Yes, universities will become unobtainable for some, single mums may now have to get jobs and we're all probably going to have to work a lot longer. We can either suffer a hit to public services and see the state shrink, or accept higher taxes. I know which choice I would prefer.
    Last edited by tibilicus; 10-23-2010 at 02:04.


    "A lamb goes to the slaughter but a man, he knows when to walk away."

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    Senior Member Senior Member gaelic cowboy's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by tibilicus View Post
    The current debt levels are as bad as the ones in the 1970s which effectively saw us become a bankrupt nation.
    Actually it's worse in a way as the debt this time is Private and Public.

    In a really crude sense both ends of the river are clogged and the water ie credit has drained away due to it being spent basically
    They slew him with poison afaid to meet him with the steel
    a gallant son of eireann was Owen Roe o'Neill.

    Internet is a bad place for info Gaelic Cowboy

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    Senior Member Senior Member gaelic cowboy's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr View Post
    I'm not alone! There are far too many gingers in the Backroom it would seem, proportionally speaking.
    Come to the darkside or should that be redside we have cake
    They slew him with poison afaid to meet him with the steel
    a gallant son of eireann was Owen Roe o'Neill.

    Internet is a bad place for info Gaelic Cowboy

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    Senior Member Senior Member gaelic cowboy's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by rory_20_uk View Post

    The banks did not get given money. The government bought shares at the nadir. Rather like a Hedge Fund would. They are now at the point of making a profit. They also made money providing insurance for debt which also gained the governement a profit
    They did get given money dont fool yourself into thinking they didnt.

    In any bust business I ever saw if someone buys it they get it cheap and they either close it down and sell off bits or they assume the debt and try to trade out of it. That did not happen in this case or anywhere for that matter take your pick Ireland USA UK you name it they all done it even Germany.

    What we have seen here is governments buying in at an inflated price way more than there actually worth in the hopes the economy will inflate the debt away. Hoping this will happen is sometimes a good idea any economist will tell you it is a viable option to take resources from the future to pay for today if it's invested right unfortunately for the whole world this did not happen.


    In the old days this idea would have worked as the customers of the bank would have been the debtors but now the banks have easily lent all there customers cash ages ago they now owe outside the bank inflating the debt away may not be so easy this time.
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  28. #28
    Darkside Medic Senior Member rory_20_uk's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    When private equity takes over a company, they have to have extremely rapid returns to satiate all the investors. So yes you buy then quickly sell the parts. Some are in the business of turning the business around.

    They bought RBS shares for c. 50p. They are now trading at a few pence under 50p. So yes, a slight paper loss. Compared to the cost of possibly all the major UK banks just folding?

    Bank profits are slowly recovering, mainly on the margins of saving / lending being in some cases 6% at the moment. In a few years time they'll be able to sell the shares in tranches probably at a profit.

    It compares rather well to Brown's selling of UK gold though.

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  29. #29
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    What's the problem, these cuts have to done unless taking a plunge into debt is reserved only as a term for trailer-trash who wanted the latest lg-HD TV
    Last edited by Fragony; 10-23-2010 at 16:25.

  30. #30

    Default Re: The Murdoch Dividend and the UK Government Spending Cuts

    As omeone who doesn't like any of the political parties I agree with some of the measures.

    Things like time limiting benefits are good as long as the jobs are created for people to go to, having to move to get a job isn't an excuse not to do it.

    Things like sacking 500,000 ish civil servants isn't good, most of that work will still need to be done and will now be done by expensive consultants at more than double the cost, places like HMRC should be expanded to catch all the tax dodgers. Also, all MP's should have to be UK citizens paying full tax.

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