Did Zeus never teach Athena to have some tolerance with Muslims?

[al Roumi]

but that is exactly the point.

while they are camped outside calais they are not in dear old blighty!

the border-hoppers are prevented from hopping the border, the channel on makes the legal enforcement more effective.

...but is France, or would the UK be, more awash with immigrants? Especially if the UK got more involved in EU external border policy and support, which it would have to have done.

[Furunculus]

...but is France, or would the UK be, more awash with immigrants? Especially if the UK got more involved in EU external border policy and support, which it would have to have done.

pardon?

[rory_20_uk]

...but is France, or would the UK be, more awash with immigrants? Especially if the UK got more involved in EU external border policy and support, which it would have to have done.

Are you seriously saying that IF the UK had joined somehow they'd be able to police the Greek / Italian / Maltese borders so well that the problem of illegal immigrants would all but disappear? That's a flattering statement to make, but sadly it's not the case.

Think of a submarine. All those separate compartments so if there's a leak somewhere, the boat stays afloat. Maybe we could employ this somehow in the EU... Some soft of borders that were internal to prevent immigrants traipsing across Europe. We could check some sort of paperwork that proved who a person was and where they were from against a sort of searchable electronic list. Those that weren't on it could be detained and removed.

Just an idea...

[al Roumi]

Are you seriously saying that IF the UK had joined somehow they'd be able to police the Greek / Italian / Maltese borders so well that the problem of illegal immigrants would all but disappear? That's a flattering statement to make, but sadly it's not the case.

That is what I was questioning, just how much of a disaster zone the UK would actually be if it had signed up to Schengen. Lets try to have some rational predictions, not "ZOMG ITS FALLOUT BOURTON-ON-THE-WATER!11!!!!"

I'm not saying that, with the UK's shining light of exacting border controls, the EU's border problems would be gone, but the issue might be better addressed if the UK were not content to simply entrench itself behind the channel.

[Louis VI the Fat]

External borders (between two displined countries of roughly comparable standards) are a major waste of time for people going about legal business, but scarcely an inconvenience for those with more malign intentions.

There are smarter instruments of catching criminals and preventing illegal immigration.

You can check the passports of everybody on the boat / car / train / plane, but at some point you need to realise that unless you transform your borders to an impregnable fortress like the Berlin Wall, you are really mostly just inconveniencing normal citizens with intrusive questions, cavity searches and hours of delay, while those with malign intentions simply cross the border at night in an unpatrolled forest / beach / country road.

[Fragony]

That is what I was questioning, just how much of a disaster zone the UK would actually be if it had signed up to Schengen. Lets try to have some rational predictions, not "ZOMG ITS FALLOUT BOURTON-ON-THE-WATER!11!!!!"

I'm not saying that, with the UK's shining light of exacting border controls, the EU's border problems would be gone, but the issue might be better addressed if the UK were not content to simply entrench itself behind the channel.

Projecting hysteria on percieved hysteria doesn't help, why are you lefties always using caps? We don't, so what's the point?

[al Roumi]

Projecting hysteria on percieved hysteria doesn't help, why are you lefties always using caps? We don't, so what's the point?

It helps communicate the fury better. Are you just wingeing because I copied a leaf from your book with hyperbolic and sensationalist satire?

[Fragony]

It helps communicate the fury better. Are you just wingeing because I copied a leaf from your book with hyperbolic and sensationalist satire?

No it's the fury that keeps amazing me, take a look in the mirror and wonder where you really stand

[al Roumi]

No it's the fury that keeps amazing me, take a look in the mirror and wonder where you really stand

Excuse the vest, it's pure irony (givent he post) that some would have it be known as a "wife beater".