I apologize to everyone.

[a completely inoffensive name]

Over this next quarter, I will have to read the entire book, "The New Jim Crow" by Michelle Alexander. So if all my arguments are straight regurgitation from the book, it's because I will be spending my time writing a paper every week on a different aspect of the books arguments.

I promise I will do better when I am not force fed this book after my quarter is over.

[Major Robert Dump]

Is that a new kind of bourbon or something?

[HopAlongBunny]

Force-fed whiskey? doesn't sound all bad but keep your regurgitation to yourself please.

[a completely inoffensive name]

If I was force fed whiskey I would die easily, since I don't drink.

I live and act like a devout Mormon in many ways, even though I am an atheist (I go out of my way to not drink coffee because I don't want to become reliant on the caffeine). My alcohol tolerance is approximately 0%.

[Montmorency]

Liquor tastes like soap to me.

[jirisys]

I live and act like a devout Mormon in many ways

Magical underwear nonwithstanding?

~Jirisys ()

[HopAlongBunny]

Magical underwear nonwithstanding?

~Jirisys ()

For those like me who wondered what that was about:

[Conradus]

Liquor tastes like soap to me.

I suggest changing the labels of your booze.

[HopAlongBunny]

I looked at the book on Amazon. Looks like a good one; if it had been on Kindle I would have bought it.

The intro sound like heavy conformation bias for me, so I don't know how much help I will be in any discussion, but I look forward to hearing about your exploration of the book :)

[Greyblades]

What's the book about?

[Beskar]

Liquor tastes like soap to me.

I always thought of alcohol tasting more as like Nail-varnish remover (Which has alcohol in it, go figure).

[johnhughthom]

You guys are aware that Johnson and Johnson is not a Bourbon brand?

[HopAlongBunny]

What's the book about?

Simplistically (from my scan of the intro): race/caste and how to keep everyone in their proper place.

[Strike For The South]

I have read the book in university setting.

PM me if you need anything

Or want noodz

[a completely inoffensive name]

The book is about the socioeconomic effects of the war on drugs on the african american community in America. Essentially, the double standards towards middle class white drug users and lower class black drug users is in effect a New Jim Crow that represses African Americans relative to whites and other ethnicities in that the longer jail times and tougher penalties given to blacks mean a relatively more unstable family life back home as black children go fatherless or longer periods of time, if they even get to have quality time with a father. This further perpetuates the state of poverty many blacks find themselves in, since the white father gets to stick around and care for his child, usually only paying a heavy fee or a small amount of jail time while the black father is locked away for most the of the child's upbringing.

I'm sure I am completely lacking the details that actually brings the argument together, but like I said, I have not actually read the book. I have only seen interviews the author has done.

I recall PanzerJeager wrote a lengthy post on his opposition to the claims the book makes somewhere a few months back. But **** me if I am going to find it in the pages of Backroom threads.

[a completely inoffensive name]

Magical underwear nonwithstanding?

~Jirisys ()

lol, no lucky underwear. But I do have a lucky shirt I have worn since middle school.

[Kadagar_AV]

I dare you to fact study how IQ between the races play a part, not to mention hormonal, adrenaline (aso) levels... Also throw in a meme argument or two "This is how green surroundings have told off kids for generations, this is how purple people have told off kids for generations).

If half the population is green coloured, more prone to rage, and generally more stupid, it also have a snowball effect... Someone green not prone to rage and quite smart will be shorthanded on the open market, where others see him/her just as "green". This makes the cultural bias larger than the actual physical difference.

But yeah... I'm not sure if that road of science is acceptable in your university settings ;)

[a completely inoffensive name]

I dare you to fact study how IQ between the races play a part, not to mention hormonal, adrenaline (aso) levels... Also throw in a meme argument or two "This is how green surroundings have told off kids for generations, this is how purple people have told off kids for generations).

If half the population is green coloured, more prone to rage, and generally more stupid, it also have a snowball effect... Someone green not prone to rage and quite smart will be shorthanded on the open market, where others see him/her just as "green". This makes the cultural bias larger than the actual physical difference.

But yeah... I'm not sure if that road of science is acceptable in your university settings ;)

Glad to see the spirit of Cecil Rhodes still hasn't died. And America is apparently the racist country.

[Major Robert Dump]

The book is about the socioeconomic effects of the war on drugs on the african american community in America. Essentially, the double standards towards middle class white drug users and lower class black drug users is in effect a New Jim Crow that represses African Americans relative to whites and other ethnicities in that the longer jail times and tougher penalties given to blacks mean a relatively more unstable family life back home as black children go fatherless or longer periods of time, if they even get to have quality time with a father. This further perpetuates the state of poverty many blacks find themselves in, since the white father gets to stick around and care for his child, usually only paying a heavy fee or a small amount of jail time while the black father is locked away for most the of the child's upbringing.

I'm sure I am completely lacking the details that actually brings the argument together, but like I said, I have not actually read the book. I have only seen interviews the author has done.

I recall PanzerJeager wrote a lengthy post on his opposition to the claims the book makes somewhere a few months back. But **** me if I am going to find it in the pages of Backroom threads.

I am curious why it would not compare middle class whites with middle class blacks, and lower class whites with lower class blacks.

I understand full well that money tends to get people off when in court, and that designer drugs are more indicative of the middle class, etc..... but this Jim Crow talk hints of some national conspiracy. While I certainly believe marijuana and heroin laws very much started out in that spirit in the early 1900s, I find it hard to swallow any more, particularly with the number of minority judges we have these days

However, I would be curious to know if the incarceration rates between poor white trailer trash meth users is really that much different than the rates of poor black crack users. Same with poor white weed convictions vs poor black weed convictions.

Assuming this is still an epidemic, how do we fix it? Do we implement the reverse of mandatory sentencing, and say anyone of race X must receive a prison sentence -30% as harsh as whitey gets for the same crime. Is that not the spirit of quotas, and of the reasoning that the oppressed cannot truly become equal until the former oppressors suffer as bad as the formerly oppressed did?

[Kadagar_AV]

Glad to see the spirit of Cecil Rhodes still hasn't died. And America is apparently the racist country.

Elaborate?




EDIT: As an example, I for one - if I had two equal candidates to join my sprint team or marathon team - would go with a black guy before a white guy.

Why?

Because the odds are with me on the negroe progressing more.

[Fragony]

I dare you to fact study how IQ between the races play a part, not to mention hormonal, adrenaline (aso) levels... Also throw in a meme argument or two "This is how green surroundings have told off kids for generations, this is how purple people have told off kids for generations).

If half the population is green coloured, more prone to rage, and generally more stupid, it also have a snowball effect... Someone green not prone to rage and quite smart will be shorthanded on the open market, where others see him/her just as "green". This makes the cultural bias larger than the actual physical difference.

But yeah... I'm not sure if that road of science is acceptable in your university settings ;)

It's rather controversial for obvious reasons http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Global_Bell_Curve

I haven't read it mind you

[jirisys]

Because the odds are with me on the negroe progressing more.

El negro quiere bailar.

http://journals.witpress.com/paperin...=400&width=600

~Jirisys ()

[Kadagar_AV]

El negro quiere bailar.

http://journals.witpress.com/paperin...=400&width=600

~Jirisys ()

Thanks for the link pointing at the physical side of things, and the quote on the cultural factor :)

[a completely inoffensive name]

Elaborate?

EDIT: As an example, I for one - if I had two equal candidates to join my sprint team or marathon team - would go with a black guy before a white guy.

Why?

Because the odds are with me on the negroe progressing more.

The minute you brought up IQ scores with a serious face was when I really stopped taking your argument for anything other than racism. Why did you even bother substituting black with green in your original analogy? Just say what you are thinking.

[Fragony]

The minute you brought up IQ scores with a serious face was when I really stopped taking your argument for anything other than racism. Why did you even bother substituting black with green in your original analogy? Just say what you are thinking.

Bringing up IQ is of course racism as it suggests differences between races, but what if that is simply true. Why wouldn't it be true for humans if it's true for dogs

[Kadagar_AV]

The minute you brought up IQ scores with a serious face was when I really stopped taking your argument for anything other than racism. Why did you even bother substituting black with green in your original analogy? Just say what you are thinking.

Why I substituted black with green? To show the cultural factor, You for one immediately assume I talk about blacks when I mention a human subgroup prone to anger and stupidity.

Why are we pretending like these physical and cultural differences doesn't exist? Am I in todays world supposed to BOTH consider myself intellectual AND think all human races are equal in every regard, all actual facts aside?

[a completely inoffensive name]

Bringing up IQ is of course racism as it suggests differences between races, but what if that is simply true. Why wouldn't it be true for humans if it's true for dogs

Different breeds of dogs have been experiencing very strong artificial selection by humans for different traits for thousands of years. No one has been doing the same for humans.

[Hax]

Define "race".

[a completely inoffensive name]

Why I substituted black with green? To show the cultural factor, You for one immediately assume I talk about blacks when I mention a human subgroup prone to anger and stupidity.

Why are we pretending like these physical and cultural differences doesn't exist? Am I in todays world supposed to BOTH consider myself intellectual AND think all human races are equal in every regard, all actual facts aside?

No one is pretending these cultural differences don't exist. That's the point of the book is to try and show why these cultural differences exist. What's incredibly perplexing is how eager people are to start calling the blacks and the browns naturally dumb when books like The New Jim Crow make it a point to show just how much the physical differences we may perceive are in fact a result of cultural oppression and chains that whites continue to support.

It's racist white Europeans that try to pass the buck on why Africa is so fucked up. When you abandon a continent with arbitrary drawn lines that run right through multiple tribal lands and say "here's democracy! Now it's all on you if you fuck up!", you should not be surprised if 50 years later, there is still violence and power struggles.

It's racist americans that try to pass the buck on why so many African Americans are in jail. When you finally dismantle a system of active segregation and suppression but neglect to actually you know, change the tone of entire of body laws that still exist besides the Civil Rights Act and then say, "Look we let you vote now! Any problems you have is your fault now!"...yeah you should not be surprised when 50 years later there are still systemic issues within the african american community. And no, idealistic liberal laws that tried to force blacks and whites to be buddy-buddy did nothing to change the tone of the general body of laws that we all live by. Blacks were actively repressed socioeconomically up until 50 years ago and the laws have always punished the poor the hardest. So even though you are now no longer kicking a man while he is down, you are still sitting on his head and asking him why he is struggling so hard to stand up.

[Fragony]

Define "race".

Easy, in general whites, blacks, asians and arabs.

The world IQ-map shows the obvious differences. Asians are the smartest and blacks the dumbest. You don't have to like that but it's true