Quick Question About Makedonian Reforms :)

[Valion]

Hello

I wanted to ask, is the Makedonian Reform the same as the Romani? In the way that you can no longer recruit old units when the reform happens?

Thanks!

[Arjos]

The makedonian one adds a new unit, you will not lose any unit...
This reform takes place when the Romani build a Huge City in the Italian peninsula, so make sure not to destroy them before that...

[QuintusSertorius]

Just gives them the reformed phalangite (as in wearing mail armour) to spam, uh recruit.

[Ca Putt]

and at the same time the KH get their own phalangites(tho If your Maks they'll probably be dead by then ;) ) and some eastern factions get their late bodyguard. its all the nilla marian reforms.

[Valion]

Thanks for answering! but i decided not to play the Makedonians since they were "too" Phalanx Heavy ;)

And i like playing with Hoplites so i'm gonna play KH this time and Cool the KH also get their own Phalangites? they'l make good anvil and give my spartans a break :D

[Ludens]

And i like playing with Hoplites so i'm gonna play KH this time and Cool the KH also get their own Phalangites?

Yes, following the same trigger as the Macedonian reformed phalanx. The KH phalanx unit is comparable to the standard Pezhetaroi (+1 armour, but a bit less morale).

[Valion]

Yes, following the same trigger as the Macedonian reformed phalanx. The KH phalanx unit is comparable to the standard Pezhetaroi (+1 armour, but a bit less morale).

Come to think of it KH doesnt have much to boast about in terms of units don't they? aside from Spartan Hoplites? but even then the amount of time to train a unit is kinda ofsetting :D

[Megas Methuselah]

Regular hoplites are really good, though. Just put them in guard mode, place them anywhere in the field, and they will hold their ground and rout anything that dares attack them. All factions have a good unit roster, you just have to... use their troops correctly...

Give them a place to stand, my friend, and they will move the world.

[Valion]

Regular hoplites are really good, though. Just put them in guard mode, place them anywhere in the field, and they will hold their ground and rout anything that dares attack them. All factions have a good unit roster, you just have to... use their troops correctly...

Give them a place to stand, my friend, and they will move the world.

Thanks for the advice! And yeah i've noticed Regular hoplites are really good and the Classical Hoplites are my favorite since they alsmost own anything that attacks them, well exept the Phalanx of course then i have to flank those moving boxes with spears or get my men impaled by toothpicks :D

What i really meant was does KH have any "Grand" Units aside from the Spartan Hoplites? you know those shiny overly polished units ;)

Btw the Spartan Hoplites(body guards of FM's) are Hardcore arent they? they just wont route even when surrounded! they actually owned the ones surrounding them, well given they have silver chevrons.

Playing Hellenes is so much fun!!! I cant wait to encounter and Impale my former loved Romani

[Brave Brave Sir Robin]

Epilektoi Hoplitai would be considered those shiny overly polished units. Heavy Hoplite Phalanxes are pretty nasty too with their AP sword.

[Valion]

I have a few questions How can i make a city rebel? Massalia has been conquered by the Averni and i dont want them to turn it into a Barbarian City >.< problem is it located in the other side of the mediterranean so sending an expeditionary force is still imposible for me at the moment since Makedonia is doing a good job keeping me bussy in Greece. and what makes things worse the Averni have allied themselfs with Roma and for some reason agreed to become a protectorate of Rome.

Epilektoi Hoplitai would be considered those shiny overly polished units. Heavy Hoplite Phalanxes are pretty nasty too with their AP sword.

Nice! I can't wait when i'l be able to get those, I'l then be able to blind my enemies with their awesomely shiny armor :D

[Ludens]

You can push a city into rebellion by stationing a good spy there. Unfortunately the A.I. has lower public-order thresholds for rebellions, so this often doesn't work. However, I get the impression that cities designated to defect to the player's faction are easier to tip into rebellion. In my KH games I usually ended up at war with the Ptolemies because Halikarnassos kept rebelling to me, even when I wasn't trying. I am not sure what the founder faction for Massalia is, but since it's a Greek colony it may be the KH.

[Valion]

Thanks i'm working on that right now :)
And just in case it doesn't rebell an expeditionary force is almost there anyway so i might just decide to take the city by force :D
I've experienced that with Halikarnassos as well, it forced me into a war with the Seleucids >.<

Oh and are the chances of winning the Olympic Games very low? it seems my FM's can never win! Man they must really suck with sports even though being spartans. Maybe the impaling of people isnt a sport haha

[Ca Putt]

just put some more spies in(once one spy is in it's easier for the others ;) ), if they havn't upgraded the governors res, Massilia is likely to defect to KH, even without spies.

[Valion]

just put some more spies in(once one spy is in it's easier for the others ;) ), if they havn't upgraded the governors res, Massilia is likely to defect to KH, even without spies.

The Spy things isnt working out well since Massilia is considerably garrisoned by the Averni, and thats what i'm worried about if they upgrade the governors res. but my expeditionary force has already landed and besieging the city., hopefully i can win :D

Oh and now i'm at war with the Epirote since they attacked Thermos, Man does everyone want to kill you when playing the KH?

[Ca Putt]

jup that's what happens if you stand up for factionalism and independance when everybody want's to have big homogeneous empires ^^ prepare to go to war with sauros, pontos, the ptolemaioi, carthage, romans and maybe the lusitanians so you can actually skip declaring war on your own^^. It's not like they all hat you, it's more like you hate all of them because they impair the freedom and independance of poleis that you call allies but sadly don't do trade with you, pay tribute and do not join you when called apon.
you're sorta the protectorate of the eleutheroi.

still one of my three favorite facs :)

look at it that way: all of these distant colonies are coastal cities. if you can afford a reasonable navy you're all set for huge profits from trade and the fastest army movement possible. this is very usefull when resupplying elites or looting coastal cities while the corresponding army is at the border.

[Valion]

Hahaha actually being the protectorate of the eleutheroi greek states is kinda nice!
it helps with the role-play :)

My navy is sitll the same, the 3 small ships you get at the start of the game! the admiral is a 3 star so the extra movement helps alot. And i just conquered Massilia, what surprises me is how easy it was! i only sent 4 Hoplitai Haploi of which only 2 were full and other 2 was half, 2 half Akontistai and 1 slinger + my retarded spartan FM that is Dull/Uncharismatic/Lang and Disloyal(i knew i'd find a use for him). outnumbered 1:3 they attacked me but as Megas Methuselah suggested i gave them a place to stand(top a hill) and they indeed moved the world! by poking the averni to death! Greek Hoplites Rule! Dirt Cheap too xD

I'm gonna enjoy playing the KH! and might try the maks and epirote afterwards.

[vollorix]

About Hoplites: While playing on Bi.exe i put them in the "shield wall" formation and march them toward enemy unit line; the results are devastating for enemy units. Levy Hoplites can handle medium troops, but Classical ones can even break a macedonian phalanx pushing through frontal, due to their heavy armour, i think. Now, the Greek phalanx is supposed to be offensive, not using the "sw" ability as a defensive feature like barbarian spearmen, but is it realistical to be able to penetrate the lines of phalangitai? I mean, with lower armour units suffer incredible causalities, or when you face elite phalagitai units, but factions like Romans do also have "sw" ability, and their heavy infantry is quite well armoured too - and we know, the Romans were able to defeat macs using the gaps in the phalanx caused by the terrain on the battlefield. Aside from that, it looks really awesome how a roman unit looks like while slowly marching toward the enemy in a "sw" formation!
Also, AI seems to know how to use "sw" ability, especially when it outnumbered. Just want to adjust my tactics and not abuse the engine too much^^

[moonburn]

valion id you can afford it station spys from arsé to kyrinaia and when cities like syracure massilia emporion or the greek city´s pf the bosphorus are conquered by foreigh forces just send your best diplomat there and they tend to rebel to your side only place i had problems with was sinope but then again the ai used a trully amazing fm as governor on the city so the promisses that diplomat takes to there might be quelled by the charisma of the fm

but seriously 6 out of every 10 times i get cities to rebel when a proper diplomat stands besides it wich can be anoying when you go and try to make an alliance with the lusos against rome and carthies and all of a sudden arsé rebels to you fallowed by emporion :p (when you´re the kh)

[Valion]

I also have some additional questions.

Why is it that FM's that show up for marriage proposals only have 2 names? like Tereus Geloios, while 3 of the starting FM's have 3 names. I know for example Areus Agiadus Lakedaimios roughly means Areus(name) Agaidaus(dynasty) Lakedaimonios(of Sparta?) but why doesnt Tereus Geloios have Lakedaimois aswell? is Lakedaimois only for the Royal Family of Sparta? if so why does the Athenian Chremonides Aithalidos have Attikos(of athens)? was his family the "royalty" of athens? curious coz new FM's i get that are Athenaios only have 2 names. I'm just curious how the greek Hierarchy worked because i remember in vanilla all greek FM's had "of sparta/athens/crete etc" along with their names. Oh and This is for role-play purposes ;)

Thanks!

valion id you can afford it station spys from arsé to kyrinaia and when cities like syracure massilia emporion or the greek city´s pf the bosphorus are conquered by foreigh forces just send your best diplomat there and they tend to rebel to your side only place i had problems with was sinope but then again the ai used a trully amazing fm as governor on the city so the promisses that diplomat takes to there might be quelled by the charisma of the fm

but seriously 6 out of every 10 times i get cities to rebel when a proper diplomat stands besides it wich can be anoying when you go and try to make an alliance with the lusos against rome and carthies and all of a sudden arsé rebels to you fallowed by emporion :p (when you´re the kh)

So what your saying is i should put spies in cities i want to rebel then send a diplomat beside the city and the city will rebell? or something like that? i'm not sure i fully understand but i'l give it a try :)

Anyway its past 2am here, been playing too much EB but hey its Xmas Break haha so thanks guys for answering all my questions and helping me enjoy playing a Hellenic Faction!

Cheers to you all!

[moonburn]

i meant place spies to observe when those city´s fall but ofc training them a bit won´t be too bad

according to my experience i don´t even need spies a diplomat is enough for those cities to rebel to my side as the kh