49 States have snow

[gaelic cowboy]

Not a drop to drink. Sounds pretty apocalyptic, how are YOU going to educate your parents about water shortages?(!)

See your problem is that your limiting your thinking about water in terms of what comes out of the average kitchen tap my good man.

The majority of the water on the planet is locked in natural stores like ice and oceans etc etc and this is mainly out of our abilltiy to use. Evaporation from the ocean or melting ice gives us water which falls on the land or flows down the mountain to fill the streams and aquifers, we then take what we need for agriculture and industry.

The more water we lock out of the cycle and the faster we use it the more likely we come to a place where billions upon billions of gallons of water is stored in oceans but is not evaporating fast enough to fill your domestic water tank. We could never use up all the water on the planet however we can use up all the water in the cycle which moves seawater from the ocean to the land as freshwater.

hence water water everywhere but not a drop to drink

[HoreTore]

Yeah industrial ages have always sucked

A famine caused by a water shortage usually has to do with a river drying up(changing its course), thus causing the people depending on the rivere for their agriculture to relocate. However, to relocate they will first have to start a war against the people living in those suitable locations. This has been going on since egyptian times.

However, modern times, industry and agriculture has increased this occurance. The cotton industry in one of Central Asias -stan's(can't remember which one atm) has dried up most of the water in the region, for example.

The two rivers in Iraq(tigris and the other one I can't remember the name of) is the main source of water in the multiple countries they pass through. However, they start out in Turkey. Turkey needs electricity. What will happen if Turkey decides to give them the finger and dam up the river to provide itself with water? Kenyas Rift Valley is another place with a terrible fresh water situation, there is basically one source of it, and who gets to decide what industry it should sustain? The rose export? Or local wheat production? Who gets to profit?

There are real conflicts tied to water consumption and shortages these days, and people are already positioning themselves according to future situations. To believe that this is a hyped situation is plain retarded.

Water is a resource. Resources is the number one reason for conflict. The more valuable the resource, the more likely the conflict. The value of water will rise tremendously in certain regions of the world, regions that already have a multitude of ethnic, religous and political conflicts.

You do the math.

[Fragony]

That is why we need to buy more SUV's, warms up the planet, evaporates water faster. Please, it's all bull. We have no control of such things. Durable energy is the biggest joke of all, to make even 10% of our energy 100%-ok we would have to mine the planet tenfold of what we do now, and there probably aren't even enough natural recources to begin with.

@Horetore, look up the green crescent, Tigris rocks

[gaelic cowboy]

That is why we need to buy more SUV's, warms up the planet, evaporates water faster. Please, it's all bull. We have no control of such things. Durable energy is the biggest joke of all, to make even 10% of our energy 100%-ok we would have to mine the planet tenfold of what we do now, and there probably aren't even enough natural recources to begin with.

It seems like a reasonable assumption warmer planet means more water but the majority of evaporated water just falls back into the sea again.

BTW I never said we have control over evaporation of water, I said were using the water moved from the oceans to the land faster and faster every day.

[HoreTore]

We have no control over such things? What the hell??

How can we NOT have any control over it....?

How can we not have any control over whether we allow the cotton or rose industry to use up all the fresh water? How can we not decide whether we want to build a dam?

Edit: yes frags, Tigris rocks. But not if Turkey decides to dam all the rivers that creates Tigris, all of which are located in Turkish mountains.

THAT is the source of the conflict.

[Fragony]

We have no control over such things? What the hell??

How can we NOT have any control over it....?

Well I'll leave that question to social science

[HoreTore]

Well I'll leave that question to social science

Social science....?

Hnestly frags, you don't think there's a source for conflict if, say, Tigris is dried up to produce electricity? You don't believe that there will be conflict when millions of people have their primary source of fresh water removed?

[gaelic cowboy]

Another problem is that millions of gallons of water falls as rain and snow in areas where no one lives.

I live in the West of Ireland and it rains a lot but the east of the country can experience shortages as there are too many people using too much water. This has been caused basically by not charging for it and through underinvestment in water infrastructure.

In rural areas most people pay for there water as they have to join a local scheme to pipe water to there house yet in urban areas they can get it for free and so they waste a lot of it.

[HoreTore]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aral_Sea

Have a read, frags, and start your education. The fourth largest fresh water lake in the world, now all but gone thanks to unsustainable agriculture.

Though I won't be surprised if you believe its a hoax.

[Fragony]

Social science....?

Hnestly frags, you don't think there's a source for conflict if, say, Tigris is dried up to produce electricity? You don't believe that there will be conflict when millions of people have their primary source of fresh water removed?

Wouldn't that be a pretty localised affair rather than a global problem, let's redirect the Eufrat anyway if they do, and pray no polar bears die in the process

[HoreTore]

Wouldn't that be a pretty localised affair rather than a global problem, let's redirect the Eufrat anyway if they do, and pray no polar bears die in the process

Of course its a local problem, who's saying it will be global?

But lots of regional wars will of course effect the entire world, you can't honestly believe that a war between, say, Israel, Turkey, Syria, Jordan and Iraq won't be noticed in the rest of the world? Right on top of one of the worlds largest oil deposits? Not to mention the millions of refugee that will run down the doors to Fragistan.

[gaelic cowboy]

Wouldn't that be a pretty localised affair rather than a global problem, let's redirect the Eufrat anyway if they do, and pray no polar bears die in the process

Tigris and the Euphrates flow though Turkey, Syria and Iraq they have a combined population of around 130 million people any instability caused by Turkey using too much water would have global effects.

[Fragony]

Of course its a local problem, who's saying it will be global?

But lots of regional wars will of course effect the entire world, you can't honestly believe that a war between, say, Israel, Turkey, Syria, Jordan and Iraq won't be noticed in the rest of the world? Right on top of one of the worlds largest oil deposits? Not to mention the millions of refugee that will run down the doors to Fragistan.

We are all in that in a different way, has nothing to do with the drying up of the credibility of climate-hoaxers, water shortages are just the next scare. Sea water is easily filtered by the way, not that we have to but still. Added benefit of harvesting deutorium

[rory_20_uk]

Desperation is the mother of advancement.

Expect to see a lot of development on such matters as design of desalination plants and more efficient re-usage of water (such as using grey water when appropriate). Yes, at the moment running desalination plants are hellishly energy intensive but they are slowly improving as more interest is placed in the area (unsurprisingly linked with people seeing a chance to make money out of it).

Generally where more water is required, there is plenty of sun. Solar power stations are getting more efficient and are just what is required to run the energy-intensive processes of purifying water.

It's the same the world over. In London it seems to have finally reached the point where it's cheaper to repair the leaks than just produce more clean water.

[gaelic cowboy]

We are all in that in a different way, has nothing to do with the drying up of the credibility of climate-hoaxers, water shortages are just the next scare. Sea water is easily filtered by the way, not that we have to but still. Added benefit of harvesting deutorium

Sea water is not easily filtered Frag desalination is a inefficient and energy intensive process which nature does for free.

[HoreTore]

We are all in that in a different way, has nothing to do with the drying up of the credibility of climate-hoaxers, water shortages are just the next scare. Sea water is easily filtered by the way, not that we have to but still. Added benefit of harvesting deutorium

It is? Really....

You should tell the Israelis that the answer to the question they have struggled with for 50 years is that simple.

Not to mention that water control was one of the reason for the 6-day war.... And nah, that war didn't affect the rest of the world at all. Errrr....

[Fragony]

Sea water is not easily filtered Frag desalination is a inefficient and energy intensive process which nature does for free.

Yeah, it does, so what are you so worried about. Turkey isn't cutting the Tigris, and there is no such thing as manmade global warming. All we are capable of is digging wells and building dikes, we are a fly on an elephants butt, dumbo doesn't notice it at all

[HoreTore]

My neighbor has a stone wall seperating his property from mine. I'll go have a chat with it, I bet it will be more fulfilling than this "discussion".

In other words, I'm out.

[gaelic cowboy]

Yeah, it does, so what are you so worried about. Turkey isn't cutting the Tigris, and there is no such thing as manmade global warming. All we are capable of is digging wells and building dikes, we are a fly on an elephants butt, dumbo doesn't notice it at all

Nature desalinates water for free but were using the evaporated amount to quickly therefore it's a separate issue to global warming.

plus desalination uses energy to produce freshwater and we all know energy costs money, we end up paying twice for our water once to make the water and the second time to transport it too your tap. In a future where energy will cost more tomorrow than today we are saying we should create another energy intensive industry.

far far better to let mother nature do the job for us

[Beskar]

Fragony, go and water your plants with sea water. Then return after a week once your plants have died and go "Oops, I didn't release there was a difference between fresh water and sea water". Better yet, go to places where water shortages are a big issue, but they are 'surrounded by water'. There are reasons why many countries have distillation plants.

Also note: Distillation is ten times more expensive than water from natural sources. So unless you feel that at least paying a water bill ten times your current rate. The average water bill is £170 or so, so expect to see £1700. Then everything else will also go up in price, such as Food (requires water), the production of manufactured guns, pretty much, everything else will also go up in price.

Vast majority of the water on the planet is undrinkable. There are only limited amounts of fresh water sources which can be used.

It is not a 'green conspiracy' in the slightest, it just a demonstration of your ignorance. So attacking people who want to ensure that the costs involve stay down and make sure water continues not being a major issue are the ones you are attacking.

[Fragony]

No conspiracy it's a religion, already said that

@GC, what makes you think we can allow nature to do so, nature doesn't listen to climate-legislation, it just does it's thing with or without us

[gaelic cowboy]

No conspiracy it's a religion, already said that

@GC, what makes you think we can allow nature to do so, nature doesn't listen to climate-legislation, it just does it's thing with or without us

So you reject the idea that water is being used too quickly then, well thats fine your entitled to your opinion but it's wrong.

Water shortages on a global scale are not created by any warming effect or climate change or by greenpeace praying to the god of CO2 they are caused by the rate of depletion of freshwater being above the natural rate of renewal.

I'm an engineer and I can tell you that water shortages and reducing the consumption of water are of huge concern to industry.

[rory_20_uk]

[Fragony]

So you reject the idea that water is being used too quickly then, well thats fine your entitled to your opinion but it's wrong.

I'm an engineer and I can tell you that water shortages and reducing the consumption of water are of huge concern to industry.

It certainly is a 'concern' of a certain industry, just not the kind that builds anything. Latest jazz of the eco-nostra nothing more, and the flaggalants kneel down, I could say there is a bit of a relevant connection between Al Gore's electricity-bill and the values of the catholic church, wait I do

[gaelic cowboy]

It certainly is a 'concern' of a certain industry, just not the kind that builds anything. Latest jazz of the eco-nostra nothing more, and the flaggalants kneel down, I could say there is a bit of a relevant connection between Al Gore's electricity-bill and the values of the catholic church, wait I do

Unbelievable Israel spends millions on research on its water problem but it according to you it does not exist. Dublin experienced water shortages this winter due to reservoirs depleting too quickly cos when it's cold in Ireland we generally get no rain same as the UK.

It's not about climate change how many times do I have to say it.

[Fragony]

Unbelievable Israel spends millions on research on its water problem but it according to you it does not exist. Dublin experienced water shortages this winter due to reservoirs depleting too quickly cos when it's cold in Ireland we generally get no rain same as the UK.

It's not about climate change how many times do I have to say it.

No it isn' about climate change it's about human nature, mankind adores the idea of damnation, each and every time. Whenever there was an outbreak of the plague the flaggalants showed up. Even the plague got bored by that, it's gone

[gaelic cowboy]

No it isn' about climate change it's about human nature, mankind adores the idea of damnation, each and every time. Whenever there was an outbreak of the plague the flaggalants showed up. Even the plague got bored by that, it's gone

Yes and human nature is to use as much water as we like, but the reality is we don't need to use as much of it as we do.

Alarmists are talking about a different subject there talking like water will run out, it wont, but the rate we use it can be greater than natural processes allow the refill of our reservoirs.

There is plenty water but it's in places no one lives like the antarctic or it's undrinkable like the ocean, our ability to access this water is limited by our ability to harness energy to process an transport it to our taps.

[Fragony]

We will just have to drink soda instead if the water runs out.

But it isn't about water. It's about rapture, it's about teh apocalyps, it's about a maya calendar. Acid rain that should have killed us all in 2000, children who don't know what snow looks like in 2010. I will readily admit that I didn't know where these snowball-Damiens were but I'm pretty sure that snowball was an ad hominum

[Beskar]

We will just have to drink soda instead if the water runs out.

Have fun with your sodium carbonate...

[The Stranger]

We will just have to drink soda instead if the water runs out.

But it isn't about water. It's about rapture, it's about teh apocalyps, it's about a maya calendar. Acid rain that should have killed us all in 2000, children who don't know what snow looks like in 2010. I will readily admit that I didn't know where these snowball-Damiens were but I'm pretty sure that snowball was an ad hominum

NONONONONONOO IT IS ABOUT HITLER HIDING IN THE MIDDLE OF THE EARTH MAKING A MESS OUT OF THIS PLACE STILL WHILE HE CHILLS WITH LIPPE SMOKING SIGARS!!!