Mongol Novice

[Brandy Blue]

After trying RTW for a while, I felt I had to get back to STW. Sure RTW is fine but its not the same as STW/MTW. So last night I stayed up later than I should to start a campaign.

Anyway, for the first time I am playing the Mongols. I was pretty impressed with their horse archers. I sent them on ahead to harass the enemy while my infantry toiled accross the field. Well the AI decides to send out its missle units to get in a shooting fight, and so I send some of the horse archers to attack them hand to hand. I hold the rest in reserve and let them shoot up the enemy a bit. The AI decides to send in its Yari Cavalry. So I let my reserve horse archers shoot them up and their Taisho decides to run for it and their army disintegrates. One of my horse archer units persues the enemy near some trees, and a yari samurai unit comes out of ambush. So I withdraw the HAs from around it and shoot it until it routs. Then two other yari samurai units emerge from another ambush and get the same treatment.

By the time the infantry get their, the whole match is over. Maybe HAs are even better than I remember, or maybe the Mongols get better ones?

[Togakure]

Mongol Light Cavalry are faster than the Japanese CA. They also melee better, iirc, especially if you hit a flank or from the rear. I find them so effective that against small to medium-sized armies, I'll often send nothing but MLC against them (excepting rugged, mountainous maps like Echizen, or heavily forested ones, like Yamato). Yari Cavalry however, can catch and destroy them, so if YC are present I make sure I send enough to double or triple team them, draw them out, and take them out before dealing with the rest.

I'll often separate out the MLC and use them for my expansion (exclusively). I then use the Korean Spearmen (which aren't very good in battle) as garrison after the MLC secure the province, to maintain order. This allows me to expand at a rapid pace (which is important, as the number of Mongol reinfocements is based on the value of the provinces taken), and hold the provinces as well. This is particularly effective early in the campaign, when the Japanese are in disorder. I make sure I have a balanced army when I engage the big Japanese armies led by the 4- and 5-star generals when they finally make their way west from Central Japan.

EDIT:

For the 1.02 patch (Warlord Edition; Mongol Invasions), here's a comparison of CA and MLC:

CA, MLC:

Charge: 10, 11
Attack: 0, 2
Defense: 1, 2
Armor: 3, 4
Morale: 2, 4
Ammo: 28, 28
Speed*: (8, 23, 27), (8, 24, 28)

*Speed=March, Run, Charge

MLC are suuperior across the board, pretty much.
As far as I know, both use "Mounted Longbow" from the projectiles.txt file, so there is no difference here.

Yari Cav. Comparison:

YC, MLC:

Charge: 15, 11
Attack: 1, 2
Defense: 2, 2
Armor: 3, 4
Morale: 4, 4
Ammo: 0, 28
Speed: (8, 24, 28), (8, 24, 28)

They're strong units. Iirc, the opinion that they are too strong has been put out here more than once in the past.

[Brandy Blue]

Well that explains why things went so easily. Thanks for the info.

[Togakure]

You're welcome. I dug a bit, edited the post, and added some more precise information.

[Brandy Blue]

Thanks for the extra information. Looks like they don't stack up too bad against yari cavalry if they can avoid getting charged. I did get the feeling that their morale was better than the Japanese cavalry archers. I've only had time to try two battles so far, but the Mongol cavalry did everything I asked of them except once. I would have expected CA to break more often just from being locally outnumbered and too far from the general.

You mentioned something about Mongol reinforcements, but I did not receive any so far. Is there something I have to do, or do they just show up when they are ready?

[Togakure]

My pleasure. Mongol reinforcements show up periodically, in a random province along the north coast. Sometimes they show up near your front lines, sometimes well back in your established territory. If you haven't taken enough provinces (not exactly sure what "enough" is), you will get very few or no reinforcements, hence the importance of expanding regularly. I've noticed too that you don't get much for re-taking provinces that you've taken before and lost. Finally, I seem to remember that if I spent a lot of the pillage money on Watchtowers etc., my reinforcements were fewer. Hence, I tried to expand rapidly, hold new territory, and spend as little as possible in order to maximize my Khan's pleasure, and his subsequent generosity when sending more troops.

The nature of the reinforcements varies, but as you push further into Japan, the more powerful units like Mongol Heavy Cavalry will show up, as well as more frequent Korean Guardsmen and Thunderbombers. I seem to remember the heavy cavalry showing up as my front line expanded to Izumo or thereabouts (near Aki).

The Japanese cavalry don't match up well to the Mongol cavalry on an equal Honor footing. However, the Mongols lack good generals initially, and the Japanese start with a couple of 4- and 5-star generals (2-3-star = +1 honor bonus to all troops; 4-5-star, +2, 6-star+, +3) . Given that each point of honor bonus yields +1 Attack, +1 Defense, and +2 Morale, Japanese cavalry under a good general can outperform Mongol cavalry. As the game progresses, they can also build better dojos etc. and thus produce better cavalry. The Mongols cannot improve their units except by gaining fighting experience. Hence, I make it a point to train up at least two, and eventually three or more 4-star+ generals as quickly as possible (by using them as often as possible to lead attacks).

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Thanks for the extra information. Looks like they don't stack up too bad against yari cavalry if they can avoid getting charged.

From the stats it looks like that, but the yari cavalry get a spear bonus against cavalry similar to how yari samurai do. I can't remember what it is but I think it's half as good, +4 attack or something instead of +4 attack/+4 defense like the yari samurai get.