Results 1 to 30 of 433

Thread: Gay Parenting

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Beirut View Post
    Wanting a child to have a mother and father is not alchemy. It is not a witch burning. It is not slavery, bigotry, or akin to telling Rosa to give up her seat. It is common sense. The same common sense that tells people to get a job, be responsible for their conduct, and not to be a criminal. Though I'm sure there are New Age pretzels ready to be chewed on that say, with great eloquence and perhaps even backed up by scientific study, that responsibility and good conduct are old fashioned.

    Well, call me old fashioned.


    Denying the legitimacy of same-sex parenting also has nothing to do with 'responsibility' and 'good conduct' either, despite your ridiculous equivocation.

    The truth is that it is just an outdated opinion that has been completely invalidated through scientific research. May I suggest that you bring some verifiable facts with you next time as this isn't working for you.

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 



    Quote Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr
    Well some points from the study...

    "o Teenage boys raised by lesbians are more sexually restrained, less aggressive and more nurturing then boys raised in heterosexual families."

    Well clearly all that is bad, why not just castrate them?

    "o Adolescent and young adult girls raised by lesbian mothers appear to be more sexually adventurous and less chaste. Sons of lesbians display the opposite – boys are choosier in their relationships and tend to have sex at a later age than boys raised by heterosexuals."

    Bad again.
    Interesting. I read both points as positives. I don't see the value in raising boys to be lecherous, aggressive, and uncaring and girls to be socially conditioned to accept the double standard. I suppose gender roles are subjective.

    Here are some other points:

    o It is more common for both lesbian moms to be employed, to earn similar incomes and to cut back on their hours of paid work in order to nurture young children. Some research indicates that egalitarian parenting contributes to child well-being, Stacey said.

    o Same-sex couples proved better at managing disagreements and anger than did comparable heterosexual married couples. Research suggests that parental conflict may be one of the most significant sources of difficulty for children, Stacey said.
    Now, I could spin these two points to argue that gay parents are actually better than straight ones, but it is probably better to look at the broader conclusion.

    According to the study:

    One area the researchers found no differences in was the mental health of children or their quality of relationship with parents. Children brought up by lesbians and gay men are well-adjusted, have good levels of self-esteem and are as likely to have high educational attainments as children raised in more traditional heterosexual families.
    I don't know what the 'typical dynamics' of a heterosexual relationship are, but the study suggests same-sex parenting yields well adjusted children with no noticeable relationship dysfunction.
    Last edited by PanzerJaeger; 02-11-2011 at 02:54.

  2. #2
    TexMec Senior Member Louis VI the Fat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Saint Antoine
    Posts
    9,935

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Go get 'em, Panzer!


    Both the mayor of Paris and of Berlin are very openly gay, have been for a decade now. Times have changed. This one we are winning.


    (although the gay mayor of Paris is most unpopular with the you-know-who, one of whom tried to butcher him with a knife in broad daylight, loudly shouting homosexuals needed to die )
    Anything unrelated to elephants is irrelephant
    Texan by birth, woodpecker by the grace of God
    I would be the voice of your conscience if you had one - Brenus
    Bt why woulf we uy lsn'y Staraft - Fragony
    Not everything
    blue and underlined is a link


  3. #3
    Arena Senior Member Crazed Rabbit's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Between the Mountain and the Sound
    Posts
    11,074
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    There are two important points to me:

    One, that there is a shortage of parents of any type adopting kids.

    Two, the gender of the parents seems to matter less than the fitness of the parents.

    However, I still oppose forcing any religious orphanages to allow gay couples to adopt kids.

    CR
    Ja Mata, Tosa.

    The poorest man may in his cottage bid defiance to all the forces of the Crown. It may be frail; its roof may shake; the wind may blow through it; the storm may enter; the rain may enter; but the King of England cannot enter – all his force dares not cross the threshold of the ruined tenement! - William Pitt the Elder

  4. #4
    Tree Killer Senior Member Beirut's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Quebec, Canada
    Posts
    8,168

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by PanzerJaeger View Post
    The truth is that it is just an outdated opinion that has been completely invalidated through scientific research.
    Scientific research shows that a mother and father are not best for a child?



    This is hands down the silliest, most deranged debate I'ver ever been in. I've debated guys who thought ten-year olds should carry knives to school for protection and others who thought God was made out of spaghetti and meatballs, but never have I come across a group of people saying a human child is not best served by having a mother and father.

    What's next; have Fido nurse the baby because more teats means more love?
    Unto each good man a good dog

  5. #5

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Beirut View Post
    Scientific research shows that a mother and father are not best for a child?



    This is hands down the silliest, most deranged debate I'ver ever been in. I've debated guys who thought ten-year olds should carry knives to school for protection and others who thought God was made out of spaghetti and meatballs, but never have I come across a group of people saying a human child is not best served by having a mother and father.

    What's next; have Fido nurse the baby because more teats means more love?
    This is inane.

    orgahs: Juices can be healthy and substitute for water in human diet.
    beirut: Never in my life have I seen people claim that people aren't best served by drinking water! everyone knows you have to drink water to live, how silly!

  6. #6

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Sasaki Kojiro View Post
    This is inane.

    orgahs: Juices can be healthy and substitute for water in human diet.
    beirut: Never in my life have I seen people claim that people aren't best served by drinking water! everyone knows you have to drink water to live, how silly!
    Thank you so much Sasaki. He can't handle thinking his views on what is best for a child could be flawed because dare I say it? Nah. Needless to say, what else does he have to get around this? Strawman. Strawman. Strawman.


  7. #7
    Boy's Guard Senior Member LeftEyeNine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Yozgat
    Posts
    5,168

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Lads.

  8. #8
    Tree Killer Senior Member Beirut's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Quebec, Canada
    Posts
    8,168

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by a completely inoffensive name View Post
    Thank you so much Sasaki. He can't handle thinking his views on what is best for a child could be flawed because dare I say it? Nah.
    If you can say it, I can take it.

    Quote Originally Posted by a completely inoffensive name View Post
    Needless to say, what else does he have to get around this?
    I'm a parent and I care more about kids than about adult ideologies that seek to profit through kids. That's what I have.

    Quote Originally Posted by a completely inoffensive name View Post
    Strawman. Strawman. Strawman.
    Dorothy. Dorothy. Dorothy.
    Unto each good man a good dog

  9. #9
    Liar and Trickster Senior Member Andres's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    In my own skin.
    Posts
    13,208

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Beirut View Post
    Scientific research shows that a mother and father are not best for a child?



    This is hands down the silliest, most deranged debate I'ver ever been in. I've debated guys who thought ten-year olds should carry knives to school for protection and others who thought God was made out of spaghetti and meatballs, but never have I come across a group of people saying a human child is not best served by having a mother and father.

    What's next; have Fido nurse the baby because more teats means more love?
    Nobody said homo's are better suited for parenthood than hetero's

    People merely said that there's no difference and that sexual orientation is irrelevant when it comes to being fit for parenthood.

    You've been obtuse for this entire thread now.
    Andres is our Lord and Master and could strike us down with thunderbolts or beer cans at any time. ~Askthepizzaguy

    Ja mata, TosaInu

  10. #10
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    The EUSSR
    Posts
    30,680

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Andres View Post
    Nobody said homo's are better suited for parenthood than hetero's

    People merely said that there's no difference and that sexual orientation is irrelevant when it comes to being fit for parenthood.

    You've been obtuse for this entire thread now.
    Of course there is a difference otherwise we wouldn't call it gay parenting but just parenting, you are kinda giving away that you know that when you do. Not that it's bad, but there is a difference. I agree with my favorite Scottish relinut, it's a farce. It's all ok, but don't expect me to play along and see it for full. Studies mean zip by the way, maybe results count when comparing it again over 30 years, at the moment they have something to prove so they will try harder to be excellent parents. Means nada

    edit: also agree with Beirut, get these 'scientific' reports out of my face, it's plane common sense.
    Last edited by Fragony; 02-11-2011 at 10:33.

  11. #11
    Liar and Trickster Senior Member Andres's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    In my own skin.
    Posts
    13,208

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    One would think that, after reading this thread, it's clear enough that your "common sense" doesn't seem to be so common at all.
    Andres is our Lord and Master and could strike us down with thunderbolts or beer cans at any time. ~Askthepizzaguy

    Ja mata, TosaInu

  12. #12
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    The EUSSR
    Posts
    30,680

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Andres View Post
    One would think that, after reading this thread, it's clear enough that your "common sense" doesn't seem to be so common at all.
    Yeah yeah but I don't. People on the org almost exclusively of higher education and often (but not always) very open to other's people take on things. It's simply common sense because a child raised by gays is a curiosity. And for some gays a statement. I always go for my intuition first and intuition says that this is more about gay equality than it's about gay parenting, a kid as a crown-jewel of gay activism.

  13. #13
    Tree Killer Senior Member Beirut's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Quebec, Canada
    Posts
    8,168

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Fragony View Post
    I always go for my intuition first and intuition says that this is more about gay equality than it's about gay parenting, a kid as a crown-jewel of gay activism.
    Brilliant!

    (Insert thunderous applause here.)
    Unto each good man a good dog

  14. #14
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    The EUSSR
    Posts
    30,680

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Beirut View Post
    Brilliant!

    (Insert thunderous applause here.)
    Allow me to indulge I don't get many of them

  15. #15

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Beirut View Post
    Scientific research shows that a mother and father are not best for a child?
    I understand now that the problem is one of comprehension and not belief.

  16. #16
    TexMec Senior Member Louis VI the Fat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Saint Antoine
    Posts
    9,935

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Beirut View Post
    Scientific research shows that a mother and father are not best for a child?

    Let me sum up your position as '1 - A mother and father are best, and 2 - the interest of the child should be the overriding, if not sole, consideration'.


    Let present you with a few choices, for the sake of curiousity:



    1) Louis and his wife have a baby. The wife dies. Should the baby now:
    a) stay with single parent Louis
    b) be taken away to be raised by a mother and father


    2) Louis and his wife have a baby. The wife dies. Louis now accepts he's always been gay and marries Andres. Should the baby now:
    a) stay with dad and dad Andres and Louis
    b) be taken away to be raised by a mother and father


    3) Louis is gay. Proletariat is lesbian. We want children, so we decide to get marry and have a baby together. Should the baby now:
    a) stay with its gay and lesbian mother and father Louis and Prole
    b) be taken away to be raised by a heterosexual mother and father
    Anything unrelated to elephants is irrelephant
    Texan by birth, woodpecker by the grace of God
    I would be the voice of your conscience if you had one - Brenus
    Bt why woulf we uy lsn'y Staraft - Fragony
    Not everything
    blue and underlined is a link


  17. #17
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    The EUSSR
    Posts
    30,680

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat View Post
    Let me sum up your position as '1 - A mother and father are best, and 2 - the interest of the child should be the overriding, if not sole, consideration'.


    Let present you with a few choices, for the sake of curiousity:



    1) Louis and his wife have a baby. The wife dies. Should the baby now:
    a) stay with single parent Louis
    b) be taken away to be raised by a mother and father


    2) Louis and his wife have a baby. The wife dies. Louis now accepts he's always been gay and marries Andres. Should the baby now:
    a) stay with dad and dad Andres and Louis
    b) be taken away to be raised by a mother and father


    3) Louis is gay. Proletariat is lesbian. We want children, so we decide to get marry and have a baby together. Should the baby now:
    a) stay with its gay and lesbian mother and father Louis and Prole
    b) be taken away to be raised by a heterosexual mother and father
    You really don't get it, you can fool yourselves all you want but you can't fool nature.

  18. #18
    TexMec Senior Member Louis VI the Fat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Saint Antoine
    Posts
    9,935

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Fragony View Post
    You really don't get it, you can fool yourselves all you want but you can't fool nature.
    Homosexuality is natural. What is unnatural, is the repression of homosexuality in some local and modern human societies. This repression goes against both human and other mammalian nature:


    Anything unrelated to elephants is irrelephant
    Texan by birth, woodpecker by the grace of God
    I would be the voice of your conscience if you had one - Brenus
    Bt why woulf we uy lsn'y Staraft - Fragony
    Not everything
    blue and underlined is a link


  19. #19
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    The EUSSR
    Posts
    30,680

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat View Post
    Homosexuality is natural. What is unnatural, is the repression of homosexuality in some local and modern human societies. This repression goes against both human and other mammalian nature:


    It's not about homosexuality it's about gay parenting. They know that it will be seen and treated differently. Yet insisting, for what and most importantly who. I think they care more about being accepted as parents rather than actually being it. And of course people that devoted will be excellent parents, whole world is watching after all. But who's in the middle of it. So to prefering heterosexual, YES absolutely. If you want a different world fix it yourself.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Fragony View Post
    I think they care more about being accepted as parents rather than actually being it. And of course people that devoted will be excellent parents, whole world is watching after all. But who's in the middle of it.
    Is it really plausible that all, or even the majority, of the millions of gay parents around the world are so activist in nature that they would make such a life-altering decision purely to make a political point? The vast majority of gay parents neither receives nor seeks publicity.

    Also, even if we take your position as true, what is the difference? Many straight people have children for selfish motivations. You seem willing to accept that they can make excellent parents. Is this about what is best for the kids or making a broader point about conventional relationships?

  21. #21
    Tree Killer Senior Member Beirut's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Quebec, Canada
    Posts
    8,168

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat View Post
    Homosexuality is natural. What is unnatural, is the repression of homosexuality in some local and modern human societies. This repression goes against both human and other mammalian nature:
    So we should change the nature of the family and human culture because a couple of male koalas got high smoking eucaliptis leaves and went a'bonking?



    I like you - you're funny.
    Unto each good man a good dog

  22. #22
    TexMec Senior Member Louis VI the Fat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Saint Antoine
    Posts
    9,935

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Beirut View Post
    So we should change the nature of the family and human culture because a couple of male koalas got high smoking eucaliptis leaves and went a'bonking?



    I like you - you're funny.
    Give in to your inner nature. We know all about you lumberjacks and your penchant for wearing ladies undies.



    Anything unrelated to elephants is irrelephant
    Texan by birth, woodpecker by the grace of God
    I would be the voice of your conscience if you had one - Brenus
    Bt why woulf we uy lsn'y Staraft - Fragony
    Not everything
    blue and underlined is a link


  23. #23
    Tree Killer Senior Member Beirut's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Quebec, Canada
    Posts
    8,168

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat View Post
    Let me sum up your position as '1 - A mother and father are best, and 2 - the interest of the child should be the overriding, if not sole, consideration'.


    Let present you with a few choices, for the sake of curiousity:



    1) Louis and his wife have a baby. The wife dies. Should the baby now:
    a) stay with single parent Louis
    b) be taken away to be raised by a mother and father


    2) Louis and his wife have a baby. The wife dies. Louis now accepts he's always been gay and marries Andres. Should the baby now:
    a) stay with dad and dad Andres and Louis
    b) be taken away to be raised by a mother and father


    3) Louis is gay. Proletariat is lesbian. We want children, so we decide to get marry and have a baby together. Should the baby now:
    a) stay with its gay and lesbian mother and father Louis and Prole
    b) be taken away to be raised by a heterosexual mother and father
    A woman who has a baby, unless proven unfit as a mother - and being a lesbian does not mean she is unfit - is entitled to raise that child.

    A gay man who fathers a baby, unless proven unfit as a father - and being gay does not mean he is unfit - is entitled to raise that child.

    If gay man and a straight woman, or a straight man and a gay woman, or a heterosexual couple, have a child and decide to divorce, the courts must decide how the child will be raised on a case by case basis.

    Is the state has authority over a child up for adoption, priority must go to seeing that the child is placed in a home where the child has both a mother and a father.

    People have rights to have children and to keep children, but not to get children.
    Unto each good man a good dog

  24. #24
    TexMec Senior Member Louis VI the Fat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Saint Antoine
    Posts
    9,935

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Beirut View Post
    Is the state has authority over a child up for adoption, priority must go to seeing that the child is placed in a home where the child has both a mother and a father.
    Failing to find the post 1950 western nuclear family, which would you prefer:

    a) The child goes goes to a single mother household
    b) The child goes to a two mother household


    Another choice:

    a) The child goes goes to a single mother household, not a homo in sight
    b) The child goes to an intergenerational household, consisting of a loving grandmother, 62, and a single widower, 36, gay


    Another choice:

    a) The child goes to a single mother, heterosexual, working two shifts
    b) The child goes to an intergenerational household, consisting of a mother and father, heterosexual, and loving grandmother, 68, who's engaged in lesbian relationships in college in 1968
    Last edited by Louis VI the Fat; 02-11-2011 at 20:04.
    Anything unrelated to elephants is irrelephant
    Texan by birth, woodpecker by the grace of God
    I would be the voice of your conscience if you had one - Brenus
    Bt why woulf we uy lsn'y Staraft - Fragony
    Not everything
    blue and underlined is a link


  25. #25
    Master of useless knowledge Senior Member Kitten Shooting Champion, Eskiv Champion Ironside's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    4,902

    Default Re: Gay Parenting

    Quote Originally Posted by Beirut View Post
    Scientific research shows that a mother and father are not best for a child?



    This is hands down the silliest, most deranged debate I'ver ever been in. I've debated guys who thought ten-year olds should carry knives to school for protection and others who thought God was made out of spaghetti and meatballs, but never have I come across a group of people saying a human child is not best served by having a mother and father.

    What's next; have Fido nurse the baby because more teats means more love?
    You are aware that one of the big fundamental things in science is that it can prove common sense wrong? Otherwise it would always be about how large the expected outcome would be.

    Continents moving? Hah, that would be as silly as we're constantly moving more than 100.000 km/h. Or that electrons can create wave interference with itself.
    We are all aware that the senses can be deceived, the eyes fooled. But how can we be sure our senses are not being deceived at any particular time, or even all the time? Might I just be a brain in a tank somewhere, tricked all my life into believing in the events of this world by some insane computer? And does my life gain or lose meaning based on my reaction to such solipsism?

    Project PYRRHO, Specimen 46, Vat 7
    Activity Recorded M.Y. 2302.22467
    TERMINATION OF SPECIMEN ADVISED

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO