Oh Mississippi
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20110210/D9L9TRQG0.html
Peckerwoods man, freaking peckerwoodsThe Mississippi Division of Sons of Confederate Veterans wants to sponsor a series of state-issued license plates to mark the 150th anniversary of the Civil War, which it calls the "War Between the States." The group proposes a different design each year between now and 2015, with Forrest slated for 2014.
There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford
My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.
I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.
Re: Oh Mississippi
Only if they allow some of us to have license plates that say My Great Great Great Grandpa From Vermont Killed Him 22 Rebs or Sherman Was Right About Atlanta
Baby Quit Your Cryin' Put Your Clown Britches On!!!
Re: Oh Mississippi
Awesome.Originally Posted by Major Robert Dump
More seriously, should we consider Gen. Nathan Bedford Forrest redeemed if he rejected the KKK late in life?
CR
Ja Mata, Tosa.
The poorest man may in his cottage bid defiance to all the forces of the Crown. It may be frail; its roof may shake; the wind may blow through it; the storm may enter; the rain may enter; but the King of England cannot enter – all his force dares not cross the threshold of the ruined tenement! - William Pitt the Elder
Re: Oh Mississippi
LOL!
That should put them in their place!
though that is a highly insulting term for those who know it...
Education: that which reveals to the wise,
and conceals from the stupid,
the vast limits of their knowledge.
Mark Twain
Re: Oh Mississippi
Curb yer Reb.
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." *Jim Elliot*
Re: Oh Mississippi
I don't see what the problem is. Forest was a military hero with a set of morals that do not equate to modern norms. Americans have never had a problem honoring such men for their accomplishments while ignoring their more questionable views.
Reporting the 'massacre' at Fort Pillow as fact is also poor reporting. The matter is very much in contention.Forrest, a Tennessee native, is revered by some as a military genius and reviled by others for leading the 1864 massacre of black Union troops at Fort Pillow, Tenn. Forrest was a Klan grand wizard in Tennessee after the war.
Last edited by PanzerJaeger; 02-11-2011 at 12:33.
Re: Oh Mississippi
I agree to a point. But the man founded the Klan, I think there has to be a point where we draw the line. Forest knew what he was doing when he founded then Klan and the legacy they have left on the south is one of terror. Let's not flame uneccssary fire....
ORLY?Reporting the 'massacre' at Fort Pillow as fact is also poor reporting. The matter is very much in contention.
That's why I used itLOL!
That should put them in their place!
though that is a highly insulting term for those who know it...
There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford
My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.
I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.
Re: Oh Mississippi
Not quite.
I know you want to be factual.
Forrest was not one of the six founders but he is believed to have been the head of the First Klan at one point. It is said that George Gordon told Forrest of the Klan.
It is sort of splitting hairs though.
Education: that which reveals to the wise,
and conceals from the stupid,
the vast limits of their knowledge.
Mark Twain
Re: Oh Mississippi
Sorry
Im still in a soul food coma
Last edited by Strike For The South; 02-11-2011 at 17:49.
There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford
My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.
I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.
Re: Oh Mississippi
Saying his morals don't equate to modern norms is a very nice way of saying he led the KKK. What other KKK leaders have Americans honored like this?
CR
Ja Mata, Tosa.
The poorest man may in his cottage bid defiance to all the forces of the Crown. It may be frail; its roof may shake; the wind may blow through it; the storm may enter; the rain may enter; but the King of England cannot enter – all his force dares not cross the threshold of the ruined tenement! - William Pitt the Elder
Re: Oh Mississippi
Senator Robert Byrd D, WVa
In the early 1940s, Byrd recruited 150 of his friends and associates to create a new chapter of the Ku Klux Klan.
According to Byrd, a Klan official told him, "You have a talent for leadership, Bob... The country needs young men like you in the leadership of the nation." Byrd later recalled, "suddenly lights flashed in my mind! Someone important had recognized my abilities!
edit: I am pretty sure he has more buildings, schools, highways, streets, and statues named for him than Forrest ever will.
Last edited by Fisherking; 02-12-2011 at 08:34.
Education: that which reveals to the wise,
and conceals from the stupid,
the vast limits of their knowledge.
Mark Twain
Re: Oh Mississippi
Argh. Point taken.
I still dont like Forrest though.
CR
Ja Mata, Tosa.
The poorest man may in his cottage bid defiance to all the forces of the Crown. It may be frail; its roof may shake; the wind may blow through it; the storm may enter; the rain may enter; but the King of England cannot enter – all his force dares not cross the threshold of the ruined tenement! - William Pitt the Elder
Re: Oh Mississippi
Sorting out Forrest is no easy task.
You need not admire him but he is often cited as the best tactical leader of the Civil War on both sides.
Fort Pillow was for ever a black mark on his name and one he always brought up, both in public and in privet, so it must have greatly disturbed him.
He was accused of atrocities by a Southerner in a letter home and by the Northern Press, however, both he and Union Troops present at the battle say that the troops unwillingness to surrender, even in flight, were the reason for the carnage.
Both black and white Union troops were slaughtered or taken prisoner.
Still some of the evidence is ambiguous and I would not want to commit to either side.
Forrest’s name is always prominent among discussions of the KKK however, it never seems to tell that he ordered the First Klan’s disbandment in 1869.
The Civil War and Reconstruction was an ugly time and the closer you look the uglier everything gets. I don’t know if you would want to call anyone a hero.
Last edited by Fisherking; 02-12-2011 at 14:33. Reason: add a not I missed
Education: that which reveals to the wise,
and conceals from the stupid,
the vast limits of their knowledge.
Mark Twain
Re: Oh Mississippi
I want George Wallace's face on every license plate of Alabama in 2013. Because this was historical:
Re: Oh Mississippi
Yes.
You can add Harry Truman to the list as well.
If you would like to expand it to other prominant Americans who owned slaves or were on record supporting racist views you can add George Washington and Abraham Lincoln to the list, among many others.
Last edited by PanzerJaeger; 02-12-2011 at 13:26.
Re: Oh Mississippi
It makes me sad you used wiki
The man was an integeral part of the early KKK, an organzation that needs no introductionYou can add Harry Truman to the list as well.
If you would like to expand it to other prominant Americans who owned slaves or were on record supporting racist views you can add George Washington and Abraham Lincoln to the list, among many others.
He was not, simply a man of his times
There is no need for this
There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford
My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.
I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.
Re: Oh Mississippi
I am sorry.
Forrest joined the Klan in 1867 during a time of great civil unrest in the South. During that time he used the Klan to try and convince blacks that they were better off returning to the pseudo-feudal system that existed before the war, emphasizing restraint and order in Klan activities. It may sound odd today, but there were many blacks left homeless and without work in the South after the plantation system was destroyed, and it was hoped that they would choose stability over rights. He attempted to dissolve the Klan in 1869 due to the violence he could no longer control.The man was an integeral part of the early KKK, an organzation that needs no introduction
Many people do not know, however, that by 1875 his views had evidently changed dramatically. He supported reconstruction and rebuilding friendly relations with the North. His last public appearance before his death was before a black civic group, where he gave a speech in support of a thoroughly progressive agenda of equality and harmony between the races. He was ashamed of his involvement with the Klan, and fought bitterly to keep it out of his legacy.
Indeed he was not. He seems to have realized nearly a century before most Southerners that the old order had fallen and that racial harmony was the best way forward.He was not, simply a man of his times
That is up to the people of Mississippi to decide. There is no more or less shame in celebrating him than, say, Patton, who was also a racist and an anti-semite. Forrest was arguably the better tactician, though.There is no need for this
Last edited by PanzerJaeger; 02-12-2011 at 20:03.
Re: Oh Mississippi
There is probably something to be said that Patton and Forrest were both fashioned in the Southern military culture, bah.....I'm to drunk to give you a thoughtful reply but I do throughly enjoy your barbs. You took someone I'd admire and then used some of the qualities I'm am railing against and applied them to him. I like that.
Of course you felt the need to link it, do you not trust my knowledge? Didn't he end up giving flowers to the black lady who tried to spit on him? Im hazy on the story.....
I tip my hat sir, We are "bantering".
TO much midday whiskey
See what happens when work is a half day kids?
Last edited by Strike For The South; 02-12-2011 at 20:09.
There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford
My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.
I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.
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