Separation of Science and State

[Rhyfelwyr]

Hey, if you want to ignore the entire content of my post, feel free, but then do me a favor and don't respond to it.

I never said any such thing, I said that science and religion are wholly separate, very different kinds of phenomena.

They are not competing, opposite viewpoints, that you can complain one or the other is being favored. You can be a totally religious fundy and still respect what science says about the universe. You can cling to a belief, but also understand that the belief itself is an assumption that cannot be falsified and is thus a different kind of knowledge; opinion.

Science, on the other hand, is a name for a formal method of gaining knowledge. Knowledge and how we gain knowledge are not the same, they aren't in competition, they are wholly different concepts.

The entire premise of this thread is based on a huge misunderstanding of the key concepts involved. That is why I won't bother to respond to why there is a separation between religion and the state, until the fundamental assumptions underlying this argument are revised.

You're missing the whole point. There you go again, with religion its an 'opinion', with science its 'knowledge'.

[ajaxfetish]

You're missing the whole point. There you go again, with religion its an 'opinion', with science its 'knowledge'.

You're not reading very carefully. He defined 'opinion' as a subtype of knowledge, so it wouldn't make sense to contrast opinion and knowledge any more than it would to contrast cats and mammals. Also, his point was that science is not knowledge. It's methodology. In other words, with religion it's 'knowledge', with science it's not 'knowledge'.

Ajax

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

You're not reading very carefully. He defined 'opinion' as a subtype of knowledge, so it wouldn't make sense to contrast opinion and knowledge any more than it would to contrast cats and mammals. Also, his point was that science is not knowledge. It's methodology. In other words, with religion it's 'knowledge', with science it's not 'knowledge'.

Ajax

No he didn't, he only referenced "opinion" when talking about "beliefs", and we all know how he feels about beliefs from that farcicul "Faith vs Reason" debate he staged where he left in a huff after I pointed out that his fundamental premise was fundametally flawed.

[ajaxfetish]

No he didn't, he only referenced "opinion" when talking about "beliefs", and we all know how he feels about beliefs from that farcicul "Faith vs Reason" debate he staged where he left in a huff after I pointed out that his fundamental premise was fundametally flawed.

You can cling to a belief, but also understand that the belief itself is an assumption that cannot be falsified and is thus a different kind of knowledge; opinion.

Regardless of how AtPG feels about belief, here he explicitly classifies it as a subtype of knowledge.

Ajax

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Regardless of how AtPG feels about belief, here he explicitly classifies it as a subtype of knowledge.

Ajax

The problem though is that he has said different things before and since. You're a philologist, they must have taught you about quoting out of context, and how to identify key words, in this case "cling".

[ajaxfetish]

The problem though is that he has said different things before and since. You're a philologist, they must have taught you about quoting out of context, and how to identify key words, in this case "cling".

Oh, I understand he doesn't have much respect for belief. I just jumped in because Rhy's response to his post completely misrepresented AtPG's statements.

Ajax

[Beskar]

Religion is a man-made tool to suppress people.