Bahrain - a conundrum for the interventionists

[Louis VI the Fat]

I thought we put cops in jail for that kind of behaviour, not look for excuses.

Hey! I am the one in favour of overthrowing tyrannies. You are the one applauding them for shooting protesters.

The point can be made that there is self-interest, realpolitik, and also preference and hypocrisy. However, it is not the cops that should be put in jail for that. It is still the criminals who deserve to be locked up. You are turning this upside down. By blaming the cops for not living up to their higher standards, you are blaming them for the behaviour of the criminals, confusing the cop with the crook.

See, if you get too cynical, if there is too little social trust, if everybody is on it for himself, then you end up with a society in which crimefighters are send to jail while mafia are allowed to roam free. And the reverse, where mafia rules, where there is no social trust, where perpetrators can present themselves as victims, there it is inconceivable that the common good, humanitarian ideals, equality are impulses of policy.

[Sarmatian]

Hey! I am the one in favour of overthrowing tyrannies. You are the one applauding them for shooting protesters.

The point can be made that there is self-interest, realpolitik, and also preference and hypocrisy. However, it is not the cops that should be put in jail for that. It is still the criminals who deserve to be locked up. You are turning this upside down. By blaming the cops for not living up to their higher standards, you are blaming them for the behaviour of the criminals, confusing the cop with the crook.

See, if you get too cynical, if there is too little social trust, if everybody is on it for himself, then you end up with a society in which crimefighters are send to jail while mafia are allowed to roam free. And the reverse, where mafia rules, where there is no social trust, where perpetrators can present themselves as victims, there it is inconceivable that the common good, humanitarian ideals, equality are impulses of policy.

No, I'm just saying that if there are two crooks, cop should arrest them both. He shouldn't leave one on the street because he's paying the cop on the side. Then we're talking about a crooked cop and crooked cops (should) go to jail. In this case it is even worse since the cop is also a mayor, judge, jury and executioner and I'm more worried about him abusing his power because he is in position to do more damage than those two crooks ever could.

Kapish?

[Viking]

We saw, and we might still see continuous shelling of civilian areas by loyalist troops in Libya. We do not see anything like this in Bahrain or other countries at present. If Benghazi had fallen, we should expect a massacre. Not necessarily people lined up, but a slow and steady cleansing of anyone suspected to be involved in the uprising. What is going on in Libya, is a unique chance to stop the plans of mad dictator in their tracks. The protesters in Bahrain also have a chance to stay home to avoid getting shot, which is a typical requirement in not so free countries, given the circumstances. The intervention of the West is so far pretty consistent, though irregularities are to expected. Not the least because the world constantly changes, in so many ways (such as technology and the mood for intervention).

The problem with the analogy of Louis, is that some of the alleys are harder to get to than others. Reaching one of them might require the sacrfice of a limb or two; similar stories for others. The West is not the police, we have no obligations to intervene. But if even we were cops, we would still go for the easiest alleys first, just to make sure that we did actually manage to help someone.