Gallic war cry

[Brandy Blue]

I've tried playing the Gauls for the first time and I don't understand what the battle cry is for. As far as I can see, your troops can only use it when they are standing around, not when moving or fighting. What use is an ability that improves fighting if you can't use it when you fight? Also, what does it do, exactly?

Thanks in advance.

[Guyus Germanicus]

Somebody has likely checked the programming code on this and posted it on the Guild somewhere. But my understanding is that the war cry improves the fighting strength of the unit and reduces it correspondingly in the enemy unit your barbarians are facing. Supposedly the Druids and the screeching women have a similar affect. But just how the game scores it internally in the combat phase is in the code somewhere. But I couldn't tell you any details.

[Telys]

As far as I know the warcry is supposed to weaken nearby enemy units morale and I believe improve their own charge, but don't quote me on the latter.

[Jaguara]

I am not sure about your question, so see below.

If you are asking about how/when to use warcry:

You should use it just before your units engage (seconds before). Regardless of the actual effect regarding stats, it increases the effectiveness of the unit in combat.


If you are asking about the technical effect of the warcry on the stats of the unit/nearby units:

I could not find another thread here at the ORG, but found on other sites the assertion (unsubstantiated) that the warcry increases Attack value of that unit by 10 for 30 seconds. No statement regarding morale. No apprent effect on other units.

If anybody has first-hand information regarding this, or a reference, it would be appreciated.

[Guyus Germanicus]

I could not find another thread here at the ORG, but found on other sites the assertion (unsubstantiated) that the warcry increases Attack value of that unit by 10 for 30 seconds.

Wow! that sounds a bit excessive.

[Motep]

It does not help much, actually, and if you mistime it, your unit will be slaughtered.

[professorspatula]

I have played thousands of custom battles during my years of modding RTW and seen the effect war-cry has many countless times, often from just using 1 on 1 unit battles. From what I can ascertain, it increases the fighting ability of the unit like someone else said for up to about 30 seconds. Whether it adds an attack bonus or a lethality bonus (modders will know the difference) I don't know. It definitely is effective, however, and I've seen it turn the tide of a battle over and over. It becomes most apparent if the kill-speed of combat is reduced through modding whereby you get more of a chance to see it in effect. The best way to use it is to perform the war-cry moments before a charge, then engage the enemy. I'm not sure if you have to let the unit do the full chant before attacking to get the most effect. After 30 seconds or so, you can sometimes pull the unit out of combat, perform war-cry then charge them back in again. I am almost certain it has zero effect on enemy units.

[ReluctantSamurai]

It's rather difficult to implement 'war cry' for multiple units. If the entire battle line consists of units who have this capability, I dare say you will be...pause-start-pause-start-pause-start....or a rapid click-fest just before melee....rather annoying, IMHO. I just pick selected units (usually my more elite ones) to use this feature when I have a lot of units with it. I'm more of an archer-cavalry type anyways, so I don't rely on this feature much to begin with......

My2denarii

[professorspatula]

It's not difficult at all. Group the units together that have war-cry and press the key that uses the ability (possibly F?). Mass war-cry, then charge as per usual. It's just a shame the AI struggles to understand the warcry function and wastes it when it bothers. Then again the AI fails to understand most things in this game.

[ReluctantSamurai]

It's not difficult at all. Group the units together that have war-cry and press the key that uses the ability

Point taken. However, it's still not a feature I use very often because of my playing style. Perhaps I should make more use of it

[Brandy Blue]

Actually one of the things that confused me was that whenever I pressed war cry on a moving unit, it stopped moving. That led me to believe that you cannot warcry while moving, and therefore can't engage the enemy (unless they attack you of course.) Turns out I was wrong. You do stop moving when you turn on the war cry but you can start moving again.

Thanks everyone.

[gollum]

Hello BB,
the warcry gives a "combat bonus", which translates to an increase in stats, unkown how much exactly AFAIK, for however long it lasts. You can see how long it lasts by taking a look to the warcry icon of your unit. This is "on" visibly while it lasts and if falls to "off" again after the alloted time expires. The unit will stop to do the "warcry animation" cycle everytime you set it to warcry again, and in order to do so it will stop moving for while the animation lasts.

As someone said before me in the thread, its easy to use the ability if you group units that can do the warcry and "warcrythem" before charging in. You can even "warcry" them during melee to renew the effect, and teh AI does that regularly.

For barbarian troops the common bonuses are in the woods and in snow and if you stack them together with the warcry they can be very powerful. Even if you manage that stacking for part of your line, ie part of your line fighting in the woods plus warcry, the bonuses can yield real advantages.

In general, use deep formations 5 and above ranks deep for melee troops - avoid 2-3 ranks deep for barbarian troops especially low armour/morale ones like warbands, as they break quite easily then. Phalanxes (available only to the germans) offer an exception to this rule, as even in 4 deep they can do well, but even they benefit from the extra depth (the deeper the phalanx the more spear points the enemy unit is facing up to 5 or 6 ranks i think).

Also avoid single line formations - use 2 or three lines formations unless you are absolutely certain that the engaged line will not break upon contact ie it is superior or at least equal in quality to what they are facing. Multiline formations also help with protecting flanks and rear from cavalry and enveloping moves.

With the Gauls, try to tech up to forester warbands as they are (very unhistorically), the best archers in teh game, and can fight well in melees including against cavalry with their spears. Their missiles stats are killer. Taking well developed Roman cities (including Rome) saves you the money and time to get them.

In terms of campaign strategy, rush the Romans as quickly as possible; if you take them out of Italy/Sicily prior to them getting Marian reforms you've practically won, and this is what i do with the Gauls. Basically, you get a hell of a lot of famous battle markers all over Italy, because the engine gives very favorable odds to teh romans due to their melee stats.

[MajorFreak]

lol. what gollum said. I didn't know about the 5 deep for 'morale' (i just assumed it was for spear tactics and had nothing to do with morale) so my opinion of sword units, which i kept at 3 ranks deep for engagements, kinda sucked. guess i wasn't using them properly regarding game mechanics. lol

hmmmm...well, all i'll add is that i find enemies are prone to route enmasse when you warcry a bunch of warbands when you have the enemy's flank overlapped by your swordsmen and the warbands are currently engaged. I interpreted from that that it affects enemy morale, but extrapolating from what gollum is saying, i'd have to admit that increased attacked strength for a unit affects enemy morale when it comes time for them to morale check (so an indirect affect on enemy morale)

haha...i used to think warcry and druid chant boosted my forester warband missile volleys of doom and destruction. but alas, i think that was just wishful thinking