Results 1 to 25 of 25

Thread: Balearic slingers

  1. #1
    Member Member SwebozGaztiz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Monterrey, NL, Mexico
    Posts
    135

    Default Balearic slingers

    Right now im starting a campaign with the lusotana, im quite surprised of the high quality skins for all their units!and their unit roster has been improved in my opinion, well i have one question, in what area and what type of government is needed to be able to recruit balearic slingers with the lusotana?congratz for making rtw a far more enjoyable game!






    "Sweat saves blood, blood saves lives, and brains saves both." Erwin Rommel
    "Don't fight a battle if you don't gain anything by winning."Erwin Rommel
    "So long as one isn't carrying ones head under one's arm, things aren't too bad." Erwin Rommel

  2. #2

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    The Balearic islands. You can either take the Balearics off of Carthage's hands, or you can just collect the merc harvest now and then for a healthy supply.

  3. #3
    Member Member Lusitan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Olissipo
    Posts
    20

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    are these slingers really worth the bother?

    Ans how do you get ships as the Lusitan to go get them?

  4. #4

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    You can get them on the Carthage side of Ibera as mercs, dont need boats. Ditch them once you conquer some celtic lands though as they are cheaper and better units, which is odd but whatever.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    Something's odd about those Balearic slingers. The gallic slingers I can recruit from Massilia have the same attack(likely due to the experience bonus for type 4 gov), lower cost, insane range, and much more ammo. Plus the Balearics are mercs and can't be retrained. I would have thought Balearics who use stones should have more ammo than lead bullet slingers considering they could just pick rocks off the ground. As it is, there seems no purpose to the Balearics at all.

  6. #6
    Villiage Idiot Member antisocialmunky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    ゞ( ゚Д゚)ゞ
    Posts
    5,974

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    Yup, the Celtic slingers and Balearic slingers are roughly even. I prefer the wider availability and obscene range of the celtic slingers though. It doesn't really fit their description of oldmen and kids.
    Fighting isn't about winning, it's about depriving your enemy of all options except to lose.



    "Hi, Billy Mays Here!" 1958-2009

  7. #7

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    Quote Originally Posted by xchen08
    Something's odd about those Balearic slingers. The gallic slingers I can recruit from Massilia have the same attack(likely due to the experience bonus for type 4 gov), lower cost, insane range, and much more ammo. Plus the Balearics are mercs and can't be retrained. I would have thought Balearics who use stones should have more ammo than lead bullet slingers considering they could just pick rocks off the ground. As it is, there seems no purpose to the Balearics at all.
    Balearics use lead shots, not stone.
    I shouldn't have to live in a world where all the good points are horrible ones.

    Is he hurt? Everybody asks that. Nobody ever says, 'What a mess! I hope the doctor is not emotionally harmed by having to deal with it.'

  8. #8

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    Quote Originally Posted by Fondor_Yards
    Balearics use lead shots, not stone.
    Really? I thought they were famous for using abnormally large stones.

  9. #9
    Member Member Kugutsu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Lausanne
    Posts
    287

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    The celtic slingers are deadly. They should be ranked up there with spartans, gaesatae and other elites... Once they start getting some experience chevrons nothing can stand aganst them. Even if you try to run them down with cavalry, they will slaughter them before they get close, and other ranged units cant touch them. About the only counter is more celtic slingers... Kind of like nukes...

  10. #10

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    Yep they are some bad a** mofos. hum... now u guys got me thinking, I wonder how a Celtic army with a good # of clingers would deal with an army of HA and Cataphracts (sp)??? I'll find out in a months or two thats for sure.

  11. #11
    EB Getai player Member MoROmeTe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Campina, Romania, currently stationed in Bucharest, Romania
    Posts
    155

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    Shouldn't the Balearic's be the "elites" of slingers? I mean lead shot should give them at at least an attack boost, if a somewhat lower range...
    For my name is Legion...

  12. #12
    Chuffed to be a Member Juvenal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    The year before last
    Posts
    127

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    I play KH and use slingers as my main killers (Hellenic ones - shorter range than Celtic, but still good).

    I thought I was unstoppable until I came up against the Getai. They only had one full stack, but it contained several family members and 6 assorted HA's and Scythian riders.

    I advanced with a fullish stack, 4 slingers, 3 cretans, lots of hoplites and some peltasts.

    The battlefield had several small hills. The first shock was that the Getai army seemed to fill the map - every hill had HA's on top of it. You won't understand how intimidating this is unless you play with hoplite armies with no cavalry (OK I did have one unit of Hippeis - but they got turned into pin-cushions quite early on).

    I decided to take on the nearest hill with all my slingers. Unfortunately it had a family member on top. The Getai bodyguard HAs are armoured (barding?). My slingers were devastated before they even got into range (damned hill). The rest of them then died inflicting no more than a dozen casualties on the Getai bodyguard.

    After that there was nothing I could do. It was EB v0.81, so I had Epilektoi bodyguards permanently locked in phalanx mode and the army had to manoeuvre at a slow walk. My boys sat on a hill and were slowly wittled down. Eventually my general got killed and the last few units routed. I lost the entire stack.

    Since then I have found a way of coping with HA's without using cavalry. I still use slingers, but I have more peltasts. The peltasts go in front in loose order and just run at the enemy. This achieves 3 goals:

    • I occupy enough of the map to herd the enemy HAs toward an edge (where they can be caught).
    • My slingers are screened
    • My peltasts take less casualties due to loose formation.


    Once HAs are engaged, heavier troops can run up to administer the coup-de-grace.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    Or if you dont mind waiting you can send a phalanx or a heavy shielded unit out front to absorb all the arrows, if you started the battle anyhow.

  14. #14
    Chuffed to be a Member Juvenal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    The year before last
    Posts
    127

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    @Gask

    When I "sallied" from my home hill, I found I was taking unacceptable hoplite casualties even from the front. A combination of the enemy height advantage and cross-fire from other hills.

    Oh... I think I was playing on H/H as well which didn't help matters. I won't be doing that again after having a siege tower arrive completely empty at the enemy walls with a trail of Spartan corpses behind it (slingers + height = )

  15. #15
    Villiage Idiot Member antisocialmunky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    ゞ( ゚Д゚)ゞ
    Posts
    5,974

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    Quote Originally Posted by Gask
    Or if you dont mind waiting you can send a phalanx or a heavy shielded unit out front to absorb all the arrows, if you started the battle anyhow.
    Wasn't that how Alexander defeated the Scythians he ran into?
    Fighting isn't about winning, it's about depriving your enemy of all options except to lose.



    "Hi, Billy Mays Here!" 1958-2009

  16. #16
    Member Member Thaatu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Finland
    Posts
    1,117

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    Quote Originally Posted by Kugutsu
    The celtic slingers are deadly. They should be ranked up there with spartans, gaesatae and other elites... Once they start getting some experience chevrons nothing can stand aganst them. Even if you try to run them down with cavalry, they will slaughter them before they get close, and other ranged units cant touch them. About the only counter is more celtic slingers... Kind of like nukes...
    I know I have called for limitations on the celtic slinger recruitment (although nobody takes me seriously), but that's pretty extreme.

  17. #17
    Ming the Merciless is my idol Senior Member Watchman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Helsinki, Finland
    Posts
    7,967

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    Quote Originally Posted by antisocialmunky
    Wasn't that how Alexander defeated the Scythians he ran into?
    I seem to recall reading he sent some of his light cavalry ahead to, uh, distract the Scythies' attention and then bum rushed them with heavy cavalry and light infantry. Talk about a redshirt job...

    'Course, in those parts of the world you could probably recruit decent light cav just by clinking a few coins together so no big loss.
    "Let us remember that there are multiple theories of Intelligent Design. I and many others around the world are of the strong belief that the universe was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster. --- Proof of the existence of the FSM, if needed, can be found in the recent uptick of global warming, earthquakes, hurricanes, and other natural disasters. Apparently His Pastaness is to be worshipped in full pirate regalia. The decline in worldwide pirate population over the past 200 years directly corresponds with the increase in global temperature. Here is a graph to illustrate the point."

    -Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster

  18. #18

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    Why cant we train balearic slingers playing romans? afaik romans made use of them

  19. #19
    Villiage Idiot Member antisocialmunky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    ゞ( ゚Д゚)ゞ
    Posts
    5,974

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    Epic necro, this thread was around when there were imba 160 sized slingers from beta.
    Fighting isn't about winning, it's about depriving your enemy of all options except to lose.



    "Hi, Billy Mays Here!" 1958-2009

  20. #20
    JEBMMP Creator & AtB Maker Member jirisys's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    In the town where I was born.
    Posts
    1,388

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    Quote Originally Posted by xchen08 View Post
    Really? I thought they were famous for using abnormally large stones.
    Lead is technically an abnormally large stone compressed and far more dense.

    ~Jirisys (EB Chemist)
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Because we all need to compensate...

  21. #21

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    Except they used stones weighing around a pound (a bit less than half kilo).
    The best is yet to come.
    ZX MiniMod: Where MTW meets AOE
    https://www.wmwiki.com/hosted/ZxMod.exe
    Now on beta 3 with playable golden horde!



  22. #22
    EBII Hod Carrier Member QuintusSertorius's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    23,453

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    Quote Originally Posted by antisocialmunky View Post
    Wasn't that how Alexander defeated the Scythians he ran into?
    The most convincing descriptions of that battle I've seen are that he had archers and javelinmen shielded behind his phalanx line, and they shot at the horse archers whenever they came into range. The horse archers weren't used to an enemy firing back, and falling men and horses disrupted their circles, making them vulnerable to a counter-charge.
    It began on seven hills - an EB 1.1 Romani AAR with historical house-rules (now ceased)
    Heirs to Lysimachos - an EB 1.1 Epeiros-as-Pergamon AAR with semi-historical houserules (now ceased)
    Philetairos' Gift - a second EB 1.1 Epeiros-as-Pergamon AAR


  23. #23

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    Then HA missile range must be significantly lower ( it also can be the accuracy, doesn´t matter ) then of the foot archers ( at least those with composite bows ). In RTW HA factions are the way too early occuring Mongolian Hordes, and the availability of their Nobles in such insane numbers + everywher doesn´t make it better... I hope, in EB2 there will be a highly restricted recruitment pool for the nomadic factions: if they were that plenty, they´d overrun any civilized faction, like the Mongols did thousand years later.

    One more thing: does anyone else think that those "add population" scripts are destroying any balance in the game? The AI could have infynite of money, but no faction, except Romans ( maybe some else with greater pool for levies ), was able to field stack after stack. In vanilla those "villages" were righfully the consequence of over recruitment in those areas. AI can hire mercs, it can bribe armies ( which doesn´t happen really often, also due to the fact how expensive it is: i had bribed 3 Goidic units, ok, 2 of them were elites, and it costed me 22k mnai - come on, for that money i can almost field a full stack of Batacorii, or half stack of Melnahts.
    - 10 mov. points :P

  24. #24

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    I still would like to know why romans cant recruit balearic slingers. afaik they did it.

  25. #25

    Default Re: Balearic slingers

    Quote Originally Posted by vollorix View Post
    Then HA missile range must be significantly lower ( it also can be the accuracy, doesn´t matter ) then of the foot archers ( at least those with composite bows ). In RTW HA factions are the way too early occuring Mongolian Hordes, and the availability of their Nobles in such insane numbers + everywher doesn´t make it better... I hope, in EB2 there will be a highly restricted recruitment pool for the nomadic factions: if they were that plenty, they´d overrun any civilized faction, like the Mongols did thousand years later.

    One more thing: does anyone else think that those "add population" scripts are destroying any balance in the game? The AI could have infynite of money, but no faction, except Romans ( maybe some else with greater pool for levies ), was able to field stack after stack. In vanilla those "villages" were righfully the consequence of over recruitment in those areas. AI can hire mercs, it can bribe armies ( which doesn´t happen really often, also due to the fact how expensive it is: i had bribed 3 Goidic units, ok, 2 of them were elites, and it costed me 22k mnai - come on, for that money i can almost field a full stack of Batacorii, or half stack of Melnahts.
    if it weren't for the non aggressive sauromatae in my campaigns they would easily overrun the whole of europa without even a sweat. they have like, what, 5 units? all 5 can kill your entire army from far range and if not, can just charge you repeatedly until you rout.

    and yes, i HATE the scripts which benefit the AI in such a way as to remove a lot of balance. i understand this is because the AI is very stupid, and wont disband their navy or elephants or anything, so they will go infinitely in debt. but because of that you are essentially battling an unlimited enemy which makes fighitng more established powers a complete and total chore. you can't starve the beast! which to me kills the gameplay a lot. the only way to get rid of AS elite spam, for instance, is to destroy their barracks but then they will just spam some other unit they can build! HUGE amount of provinces/unlimited money and population=no fun
    Last edited by fomalhaut; 04-06-2011 at 20:12.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO