Subverted army can't join allies in battle.

**Dead Guy** · 04-10-2011, 10:10

Just thought I'd share this since I haven't seen anyone mention it.

Two Date stacks were hanging out near my stronghold yesterday, both with lots of Samurai. They had so many Samurai archers that I actually doubted I could defend the stronghold without some serious losses.

So I sent a ninja to sabotage one of the stacks and tried attacking the other one, and the one I sabotaged didn't get to join in the battle. Aftewards it was forceably moved out of my victorious army's zone of control and I could move back to the stronghold.

Quite a nice trick if you don't want to invest three points to get night battles capability!

I think I'll be training a few more sabotaging ninja in the future...

**Zim** · 04-10-2011, 10:39

Interesting, there's a new use for my ninjas.

**econ21** · 04-10-2011, 15:46

Yes, I've observed that. First time I tried it, it did not work so I wrongly posted to that effect in the skills strategies thread. However, it did work last night (ironically with a general I'd just invested in the night fighter skill with). I suspect the first time I subverted one army and then attacked that same army rather than the free one. Yet another Homer Simpson moment in my Daimyo's career.

**Monk** · 04-10-2011, 17:07

Did this a few times myself in my Chokosabe campaign, and it gave me a whole new respect for ninja. By the end I had the max number of ninja supportable, and 3 dedicated to sabotage/spying. My armies don't go anywhere without a man of the shadows looking after them.

**econ21** · 04-15-2011, 03:00

OK, now I am sure that this does not always work. I subverted an army next to a city and it still came on to reinforce the garrison. This leads me to think that my previous observation of the same phenomenon was not in error. I am not sure why sometimes subverting an army stops it joining it's allies and sometimes it does not, but my experience is that it is erratic. Best to get the stealthy/night fighter trait to be sure, I reckon.

**HopAlongBunny** · 04-15-2011, 05:38

The program may "see" the adjacent army differently than the player?

It could be the way city defenders are coded: if it's adjacent then it is part of city defence. That way it is not a reinforcement, but part of what you are attacking.

Exception to the rule? or just variable as you said.

Worthy of some research methinks :)

**econ21** · 04-15-2011, 11:38

Originally Posted by HopAlongBunny

It could be the way city defenders are coded: if it's adjacent then it is part of city defence. That way it is not a reinforcement, but part of what you are attacking.

That's plausible but the first time I observed a subverted army reinforcing (provided I was not in error), it was just a field battle - not a city defence. But it is a topic worth keeping an eye on.

**Monk** · 04-16-2011, 21:55

This seems to be more of a bug with armies joining the reinforcements for city defense, rather than subverting. One of my generals had the "night fighter" trait so I thought i'd pull a classic TW move. Attack a city that is relatively lightly defended, but has a big "reinforcement" stack close by, swap to night attack, and negate the latter.

Even though the enemy tab was greyed out, indicating it wouldn't join the fight, they still did. And i had to contend with them in the siege itself. As of now, if the enemy has an army near a city, I don't think there's anything you can do to stop it from reinforcing the seige.