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Thread: Shogun 2 Realism + | Main Thread: Feedback & Discussion

  1. #31
    TW Modder Since 2005 Member DaVinci's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    1st post updated.

    Version 1.4.1 released, 1.4 removed.

    See the changelog for 1.4.1, a new food supply system in place, which should be more interesting and realistic, works technically flawless, it is now a matter of playtesting if it pays back positive for the gameplay: aspects challenge & gameplay & realism plus not at last AI consideration, ie. if rebellions are more likely now compared to vanilla/S2R+ due to food issues for the AI and gameplay suffers badly, then i have to change it so that AI is capable enough, the human player should be able to plan the steps accordingly and can find a proper way, which offers even real advantages for the very late game (i guess or hope the AI is smart enough to apply that as well).

    Please playtest this and give some feedback.
    Last edited by DaVinci; 04-16-2011 at 18:32.
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  2. #32

    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Reading the changes you made got me interested.

    Download/unpack all went w/o a hitch. I opened a current game after installation; food surplus dropped from about 13+ to -10; does that sound about how it should work?
    Ja-mata TosaInu

  3. #33
    TW Modder Since 2005 Member DaVinci's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by HopAlongBunny View Post
    Reading the changes you made got me interested.

    Download/unpack all went w/o a hitch. I opened a current game after installation; food surplus dropped from about 13+ to -10; does that sound about how it should work?
    13+ food, how is this possible, vanilla offers this?

    However, a saved game will suffer in this regard, yes, can confirm it.

    Please start anew, i'm eager to hear about it how that plays out now if you (and the AI) develops from scratch ... have had no time to playtest the new food supply system.

    Anyways, it's wip, and likely to change if it doesn't work properly in respective aspects.
    I might start a campaign myself soon, but one playtest by one player is not enough to experience all possible outcomes etc.. I'm thankful for every reporting playtester.
    Last edited by DaVinci; 04-16-2011 at 23:03.
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  4. #34
    TW Modder Since 2005 Member DaVinci's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    1st post updated. Version 1.5 uploaded, see changelog.

    (Should be saved game compatible).
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  5. #35
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    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Weekend diligence. 1st post updated.

    Uploaded version 1.5.5. See changelog.
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  6. #36

    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Hi Da Vinci,
    I've been trying to made a minimod (mostly changing unit stats to make the fighting longer) for myself based on S2R+1.4, and I got some difficulty with the dismounted stats (attack, defend, charge). The stats that show up in the dismounted melee skill and dismounted defence skill columns in PFM dont seem to be the ones that show up in game.
    Can you please show me how to fix this?
    also, IMO the stamina should be increased across the board due to the longer fighting. They seem to tire out too quickly, like 2-3 minutes into a melee. Can you tell me where in PFM I can change the stamina stats? Thanks a lot.

  7. #37
    TW Modder Since 2005 Member DaVinci's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by vuvihu View Post
    Hi Da Vinci,
    I've been trying to made a minimod (mostly changing unit stats to make the fighting longer) for myself based on S2R+1.4, and I got some difficulty with the dismounted stats (attack, defend, charge). The stats that show up in the dismounted melee skill and dismounted defence skill columns in PFM dont seem to be the ones that show up in game.
    Can you please show me how to fix this?
    also, IMO the stamina should be increased across the board due to the longer fighting. They seem to tire out too quickly, like 2-3 minutes into a melee. Can you tell me where in PFM I can change the stamina stats? Thanks a lot.
    Agostinos quoted, what he wrote in the PFM thread as summery of the bugs in the landunits stats PFM display, and i can confirm it.
    "Cold Resistance" is actually "Good Stamina"
    "Good Stamina" is "Scares Enemies"
    "Heat Resistance" is "Inspires Allies"
    "Dismounted Melee Defence" is "Dismounted Charge Bonus"
    Note: Scares Enemies is bugged, don't apply that. Wait, wasn't it you who discovered the eager-duration-effect vs. units with the scare-attribute?

    Else, if you use S2R+, i recommend to update the 1.4 to the newest version, and use this as base for your modding, as ie. all the above is already considered, and you only need to make your personal changes.
    Last edited by DaVinci; 04-18-2011 at 08:01.
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  8. #38
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    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    1st post updated, 1.6 uploaded (see changelog).

    The version is saved game compatible, but the effect changes recommend absolutely a new campaign start.

    Things are settled quite good now, the version will stay for a longer playtesting/non-modding phase.
    Last edited by DaVinci; 04-18-2011 at 15:58.
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  9. #39

    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Thank you for the update :)

    The adjustments you made take some getting used to:p

    My Chosokabe campaign was a tough start (I build roads) once I got over that mistake i managed to feed my ppl. The archer cap has been a learning exp. Even with max samurai and ashi archers I never seem to have the numbers I like; so yes, this mod has changed the way I play the game.

    Given the limitations on the player and the way the AI develops, it's a whole new game

    I think I'll start a new campaign for 1.6; thanks again!
    Ja-mata TosaInu

  10. #40

    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    So far in my campaign as the Oda. No trouble whatsoever. I am making alot of money, but then again, I usually don't have a problem with money. Will report more later.

  11. #41
    TW Modder Since 2005 Member DaVinci's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Thanks for your comments.

    A new game start is actually recommended with 1.6.

    As for Oda, yes, due to the changes made to help Oda as AI faction surviving and developing properly, Oda is no longer the huge challenge it was for the human player. This is the downside of the balancing when you aim for helping certain AI factions not vanishing in the first turns. I cannot simply make AI special stats, costs etc. per faction. Anyways, as Oda you'll now be able to play his historical superior role properly :) ...while some neighbors should still provide a good challenge (ie. Takeda, Ikko Ikki if they don't make rubbish as AI in their actions of the first turns).

    ---

    I've a small update in store, which changes some unit names, complete save game compatible, won't affect the gameplay. I'll upload this as optional update v1.65 soon.
    The purpose of this update is a slight improved flavor for the unit names (infantry and cavalry unit names still more japanese vs. the existing mix of english-japanese).
    Last edited by DaVinci; 04-19-2011 at 16:36.
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  12. #42

    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    First large battle with 1.6.

    1500ish vs 2500.

    Both sides fought to 90+% casualties. Heavily outnumbered but i thought with 5 samurai against all Ashi I could likely rout enough to get a wrap. No chance. The Ashi (on both sides to be fair) fought on until 20 men were left.

    Victory! Both generals dead of course; 300 of my army left and a pittance of the enemy. What really got me was, although the enemy sallied...i didn't get the fort.

    If Ashi will fight to the death, what point samurai? (although, they did win the battle:p)
    Ja-mata TosaInu

  13. #43
    TW Modder Since 2005 Member DaVinci's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by HopAlongBunny View Post
    First large battle with 1.6.

    1500ish vs 2500.

    Both sides fought to 90+% casualties. Heavily outnumbered but i thought with 5 samurai against all Ashi I could likely rout enough to get a wrap. No chance. The Ashi (on both sides to be fair) fought on until 20 men were left.

    Victory! Both generals dead of course; 300 of my army left and a pittance of the enemy. What really got me was, although the enemy sallied...i didn't get the fort.

    If Ashi will fight to the death, what point samurai? (although, they did win the battle:p)
    Custom battle or campaign? Difficulty? Factions? Generals: skills/stars?


    The mod is generally balanced for what is stated in the 1st post.

    And according to my experience this is complete different, very dependent on the circumstances ... battlefield, behaviour, tactics ... i've battles where Ashigaru (speaking of the typical Ashigaru Yari, with the lowest morale) rout far earlier. Else, if you don't see the value of Samurai, then i can't help you ... you say it yourself "...win the battle" (although complete outnumbered with a rate of 60 % more enemies).

    Also: Ashigaru have different morale values per certain factions. For example you'll always have a quite hard time vs. Oda Ashis.

    ---

    Concerning 1st post, quoting myself
    Attachment: A fix for v1.65. I just discovered that the Nanban high christian conversion rate is back in v1.65 (strangely, must've been an oversight somehow). This is fixed here: Just replace the 1.65 or 1.60 file, if you don't want to see likely some easily christian converted factions. For everything else, it's the same as v1.65.
    Last edited by DaVinci; 04-20-2011 at 01:52.
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  14. #44

    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Yes the samurai proved their worth. It was a Chosokabe campaign.

    But at a cost ratio of 2-2.5 - 1 why not just field all Ashi Yari. Given the difference in unit sizes, I would have outnumbered the Beshi (sp).

    The generals were nothing special: 3star on both sides.

    The tactics may have worked against me. I stacked all 5 samurai (2sword, 1yari, 2bow) on one flank, with my cav unit, looking to get a breakthrough. So even with the units that did eventually rout, I was still out numbered by what was left. The cav in the rear and flanks had limited impact, likely for the same reason.

    The stuff posted is not criticism of the mod; my report and musings on game dynamics.
    Ja-mata TosaInu

  15. #45
    TW Modder Since 2005 Member DaVinci's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by HopAlongBunny View Post
    Yes the samurai proved their worth. It was a Chosokabe campaign.

    But at a cost ratio of 2-2.5 - 1 why not just field all Ashi Yari. Given the difference in unit sizes, I would have outnumbered the Beshi (sp).

    The generals were nothing special: 3star on both sides.

    The tactics may have worked against me. I stacked all 5 samurai (2sword, 1yari, 2bow) on one flank, with my cav unit, looking to get a breakthrough. So even with the units that did eventually rout, I was still out numbered by what was left. The cav in the rear and flanks had limited impact, likely for the same reason.

    The stuff posted is not criticism of the mod; my report and musings on game dynamics.
    That's what i want, critics, just to stuff gaps in the balance etc., it's all okay with your post :) ... need as much info as possible to understand comments.

    But at a cost ratio of 2-2.5 - 1 why not just field all Ashi Yari. Given the difference in unit sizes, I would have outnumbered the Beshi (sp).
    Can you elaborate this, i do not understand ( Beshi is probably Bessho, or similar ;) ).

    As for your Samurai flanking tactic, i guess also that your main Ashi line just suffered too much. That, as you say, Ashi fought to 20 men astounds me in this situation.
    I usually spread my Samurai, so they can reduce the vast numbers of Ashi Yari, getting them rout sooner or later at those points, and if ie. the center breaks, then it needs not much to break the flanks as well.
    Rear and flank charge attacks help, but not if the enemy units are still complete, they should have quite some losses already, then it works excellent.
    Last edited by DaVinci; 04-20-2011 at 07:55.
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  16. #46
    TW Modder Since 2005 Member DaVinci's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    1st post updated. V 1.7 uploaded.

    Besides the nanban fix, some more balancing for diverse aspects, see changelog.

    ...the never ending story of playtesting/modding.
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  17. #47

    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    "But at a cost ratio of 2-2.5 - 1 why not just field all Ashi Yari. Given the difference in unit sizes, I would have outnumbered the Beshi (sp)."

    The 5 samurai represent about 3600 koku. With Ashi Yari costing 223 koku each I could have 16 of them.
    At 210 men per unit I would have outnumbered the enemy w/o even considering the rest of my army.

    Of course it's more complex than that. A large all Ashi army would have had a different experience distribution from my march across the island. Does the sheer number of extra units make up for that?
    Ja-mata TosaInu

  18. #48
    TW Modder Since 2005 Member DaVinci's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by HopAlongBunny View Post
    "But at a cost ratio of 2-2.5 - 1 why not just field all Ashi Yari. Given the difference in unit sizes, I would have outnumbered the Beshi (sp)."

    The 5 samurai represent about 3600 koku. With Ashi Yari costing 223 koku each I could have 16 of them.
    At 210 men per unit I would have outnumbered the enemy w/o even considering the rest of my army.

    Of course it's more complex than that. A large all Ashi army would have had a different experience distribution from my march across the island. Does the sheer number of extra units make up for that?
    Hm, just imagine the situation vice versa, AI with the 5 Samurai etc. and you with the composition which you experienced there in the AI stack of, if i understood right, Ashigaru only. Who will win, i don't know ... you can try that all.

    Besides this, i personally aim also for a quite historically army deployment, if i have Samurai available, i'll field them to some extent and all along my cashflow.

    Generally, Senguko armies/battles were largely fought by Ashigaru (more and more), but you know this certainly.
    The times of Samurai only battles were over here.
    And from on starting 17th century Samurai transformed slowly to non-warriors, as the melee warrior skill wasn't anymore that relevant due to gunpowder units.
    Last edited by DaVinci; 04-20-2011 at 14:49.
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  19. #49
    TW Modder Since 2005 Member DaVinci's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    1st post updated. V 1.75 out.

    This is close to the final base balancing design and endversion of S2R+.
    S2R+ provides now a pretty different unique gaming experience, just gameplay tweaks with some degree of historical realism reflections and bit of flavour increase.

    This time i don't intend to make a never ending modding story (which i might stop with v2.0, and then loose the version numbers with the final build).

    I guess, next modding phase for the current build, i'll start to fiddle with dedicated CAI files for a finetuning, prior to this lots of campaign playtesting on the current version.
    Last edited by DaVinci; 04-20-2011 at 20:19.
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  20. #50

    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Hey DaVinci. The unit stat modding is great. Naginata now beats Yari in battle even though Naginata are outnumbered, but Yari are better meat shields (fodder).

    I am now concerned about the larger garrisons. The good thing is that castles are lasting longer and minors are surviving. The bad thing is, now I am seeing Takeda and Mori die within the first couple of turns (13th turn).

    For me this is strange because I had never before seen these factions die off quickly. I am guessing that now they cannot take the minor castles out and so the minors are able to eat them up? Also, the Ikko Ikki die off to Uesugi.

    Maybe an implementation of "majors survivability" script which allows them to have 1 more recruitment slot in their capital? Just a thought.

    EDIT: Also, I had the Hattori attack my capital (backstab) while I was building up an army to attack Hojo. Their attack force consisted of 1 Naginata, 7 Yari, 1 Yumi, and 1 Taisho.
    My army in the Capital including the garrison was: 2 Yari, 2 Yumi, 1 Samurai, 1 Naginata, 1 Taisho.

    No matter how many times I replay the battle, the enemy overruns me. Even if I use my Taisho to lure 4 enemy units around outside the castle for most of the battle, the enemy still overtakes me. So, I think the army composition is great. I enjoy losing, it means something is being done right. (I shouldn't have left the capital so undefended).\
    Last edited by tan zhi han; 04-20-2011 at 21:54.

  21. #51
    TW Modder Since 2005 Member DaVinci's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by tan zhi han View Post
    Hey DaVinci. The unit stat modding is great. Naginata now beats Yari in battle even though Naginata are outnumbered, but Yari are better meat shields (fodder).

    I am now concerned about the larger garrisons. The good thing is that castles are lasting longer and minors are surviving. The bad thing is, now I am seeing Takeda and Mori die within the first couple of turns (13th turn).

    For me this is strange because I had never before seen these factions die off quickly. I am guessing that now they cannot take the minor castles out and so the minors are able to eat them up? Also, the Ikko Ikki die off to Uesugi.

    Maybe an implementation of "majors survivability" script which allows them to have 1 more recruitment slot in their capital? Just a thought.

    EDIT: Also, I had the Hattori attack my capital (backstab) while I was building up an army to attack Hojo. Their attack force consisted of 1 Naginata, 7 Yari, 1 Yumi, and 1 Taisho.
    My army in the Capital including the garrison was: 2 Yari, 2 Yumi, 1 Samurai, 1 Naginata, 1 Taisho.

    No matter how many times I replay the battle, the enemy overruns me. Even if I use my Taisho to lure 4 enemy units around outside the castle for most of the battle, the enemy still overtakes me. So, I think the army composition is great. I enjoy losing, it means something is being done right. (I shouldn't have left the capital so undefended).\
    In my two recent camp starts suddenly Oda dies off again quickly. Other were different ... it is different per started campaign, it seems.

    This is on one side good, interesting, but i also wanna have what you called "majors survivability script". I'm trying this all the way, and factions who have separate units and shall survive got already a lot extra-consideration, really a lot, while Hojo is difficult as he has no extra normal infantry, Takeda has some extra cavalry, also tricky.

    What it really needs is startpos modding (startsituation), but i refuse to touch these files as of yet, as it might make the mod application complicate technically, the modding of those files is "annoying" since ETW, and is much more timeconsuming. And if i start with such things, then i would like to change a lot, making a proper historically reflected startsituation, besides would change the whole balance, and this is really then a lot work and time, which i have not.

    Maybe you are right, and it is the new added garrison mod because since i added that file from radious the majors issue is due, it seems. I'll replace it with the former one, or maybe still another. Chances are high that these major faction issues are solved then (again, because it was already quite good).

    Please tell me also which parameters you use, difficulty etc., perhaps other gameplay mods?

    ---

    And v1.75.1 uploaded, see 1st post and changelog.
    Last edited by DaVinci; 04-22-2011 at 01:35.
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  22. #52

    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    I am playing normal/normal with normal unit sizes. Just using 1640 campaigns, realm divine mod, and graphics/audio tweaks. No other gameplay mods, S2R+ all the way. Will download the new patch.

  23. #53
    Member Member Jahmann's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Hello!

    Since S2R +1.7 I have the following problem with Takeda campaign (new campaigns start): The unit rate is that the Takeda cavalry 60 men and 200 men Yari Ashigaru in the initial army does not coincide with the recruitment of the unit number of 120 Takeda cavalry and Yari Ashigaru 280 men in town Kai.
    Please fix the small bow. I play hard/hard sometimes normal/hard and with the following mods: MOD_monthly turn v1.0, mod_movement_reduction_inf20_cav10 mod_realm_divide, MOD_Japanese_fix_v2, mod_Faction_color11, hororemoval, battle border, cherry_blossoms, zw_no_projectile_trails_1.1 and Brigs Music.

    I noticed no problems otherwise, the mod works perfectly with the sub-mods. I play since S2R + 1.2 in this configuration.
    Supi mod and good gameplay, keep it up DaVinci!
    Last edited by Jahmann; 04-21-2011 at 09:06.

  24. #54
    TW Modder Since 2005 Member DaVinci's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jahmann View Post
    Hello!

    Since S2R +1.7 I have the following problem with Takeda campaign (new campaigns start): The unit rate is that the Takeda cavalry 60 men and 200 men Yari Ashigaru in the initial army does not coincide with the recruitment of the unit number of 120 Takeda cavalry and Yari Ashigaru 280 men in town Kai.
    Please fix the small bow. I play hard/hard sometimes normal/hard and with the following mods: MOD_monthly turn v1.0, mod_movement_reduction_inf20_cav10 mod_realm_divide, MOD_Japanese_fix_v2, mod_Faction_color11, hororemoval, battle border, cherry_blossoms, zw_no_projectile_trails_1.1 and Brigs Music.

    I noticed no problems otherwise, the mod works perfectly with the sub-mods. I play since S2R + 1.2 in this configuration.
    Supi mod and good gameplay, keep it up DaVinci!
    Please check 1.75.1 out, and look anew about unit numbers, the fix i adressed there is exactly about one cav unit entry, probably Takeda's, not sure now.

    Unit numbers are based on ultra size and multiplier setting 1 in preferences. If you leave setting 1 and change it via menu you get just the according numbers and the setting will change automatically in preferences.
    Else, the map starting units are different because they mirror vanilla numbers, cannot change it, unless i would do startpos modding, what i don't plan atm..

    Small bow? What do you mean there?

    ---

    Else, i intend to release shortly a v1.80 with another garrison modding, as the current one reduces somehow the provided major faction supports in a bad way.
    Last edited by DaVinci; 04-21-2011 at 16:47.
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    Release 04.2013: Rise of the Samurai Realism+


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  25. #55
    Member Member Jahmann's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Sorry, said Fix the small problem / the bug.
    Thank you first for the info so far. Takeda North Shinano and Kozuke conquered, but the General and my cavalry not fill more of their troops. Should the building be available as of late? In the other cities I've taken, this is not the case.
    have already updated to 1.75.1 but have not started a new campaign.
    I will then look even if the little problems are still there.
    Last edited by Jahmann; 04-21-2011 at 17:57.

  26. #56
    TW Modder Since 2005 Member DaVinci's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jahmann View Post
    Sorry, said Fix the small problem / the bug.
    Thank you first for the info so far. Takeda North Shinano and Kozuke conquered, but the General and my cavalry not fill more of their troops. Should the building be available as of late? In the other cities I've taken, this is not the case.
    have already updated to 1.75.1 but have not started a new campaign.
    I will then look even if the little problems are still there.
    Bold part: You mean the replenishment? I guess so.
    Well, i have changed it so that the somehow magical easy and fast replenishment is significantly reduced ... while buildings etc. have an impact on the rate, look at the descriptions of buildings, traits etc..
    A realism aspect, just how would it be possible to replace every warrior with ease in a few months? I like that new design-aspect a lot, as it will make every single warrior still more precious and relevant, you must act with your men carefully.

    As for new campaign start, i'll upload within the next 20-30 minutes a quick-update to 1.75.1 as 1.76 which will have the former garrison file back and some very small changes. Anyways, this version should then bring back the design that majors survive and expand.
    Last edited by DaVinci; 04-21-2011 at 19:46.
    TWC Wiki: List of TW Modding Contributions 2005-2011
    Release 12.2012: Third Age TW Realism+
    Release 04.2013: Rise of the Samurai Realism+


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    What's really more disappointing than dis-information and non-education?
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  27. #57
    TW Modder Since 2005 Member DaVinci's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Update 1.76 is online, see first post.
    TWC Wiki: List of TW Modding Contributions 2005-2011
    Release 12.2012: Third Age TW Realism+
    Release 04.2013: Rise of the Samurai Realism+


    Support: Greenpeace
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    What's really more disappointing than dis-information and non-education?
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  28. #58

    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Latest version (normal/normal)

    Update:
    New campaign with Chosokabe where I just kept ending turns to watch what happened.
    -Oda,Asai,Oggyisuke (??),Sakai die on the 2nd turn.
    -2 minor clans die on 3rd turn.
    -Shimazu and another minor clan die on the 4th turn.

    Conclusion:
    -Definitely has to do with Garrisons. I prefer the previous version with the larger garrisons which helped to keep minors alive longer.
    -At the same time I prefer not having Oda and Shimazu die (or any major faction for that matter)
    -It will most likely need to be done through scripting.

    Notes:
    -In the previous garrison version, minors lasted longer, but generally majors still expanded better.
    -In the lighter garrison version, minors and majors fall left and right (too quickly).
    -I prefer the previous version. Can we even add scripting into the game yet?

  29. #59

    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    Rice-exchange provides +1 surplus food (formerly first with Guild possible)

    Again, not logical I think, rice market SELL rice is more logical, this is not a production place....

  30. #60

    Default Re: Shogun 2 Realism + | Release & Discussion Thread

    We can argue this til the cows come home :)

    The Rice Exchange (like a grain exchange) provides a more efficient pricing mechanism and distribution. It could be argued that the greater efficiencies spur both consumption and production = more rice produced per unit of land and or more land devoted to rice.
    Ja-mata TosaInu

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