Units who you cannot stand in your armies?

**Forward Observer** · 04-19-2011, 08:04

I've had bad luck with bow cavalry also. I put them on skirmish--thinking they'll be OK---then the next thing I know is that they get backed into a tight and get wiped out--when my attention is elsewhere, . Consequently, I simply stopped recruiting them.

However, I just finished a short Takeda campaign and at some point got stuck with a free unit of bow cavalry for completing one of the Bushido arts. They just happened to be in a lower level coastal castle when it got attacked, which meant I had no way to use them outside the fort. The only choice was to dismount them for use as rather weak foot archers. I didn't put them on the wall, but lined them up against the side of the center building. I completely forgot about them until the battle ended.

I was out numbered about 2 to 1, but that's usually manageable--when defending a castle. When it was over--was I surprised to see all 60 of them survived and was even more astounded when I saw that they scored just over 90 kills. I don't know if their kills were from lobbing arrows over the wall or from shooting attackers that made it briefly inside the fort, but it was still the best I have ever done with them.

Cheers

P.S. I also don't bother with the bomb throwers either--for pretty much the same reasons.

**The_Emperor** · 04-19-2011, 08:52

Bomb Throwers and Kisho Ninja

small units that require far too much micromanagement to use effectively in majority of battles. Plus the Ninja are just so damn expensive!

Oh and Bow cav.

**A Nerd** · 04-19-2011, 10:29

^ ^ I tried the ninja and felt they were not worth the price and the recruitment time. Never tried any bomb throwers.

**Dead Guy** · 04-19-2011, 10:39

All of the above except Bow Ashigaru, the mainstay of many an army for me. Bow Ashis with excpetional accuracy bonus (master bow maker + hunters lodge) are good enough and dirt cheap. They're not supposed to fight or get shot at, they're just supposed to hit things with arrows. Bow Samurai are too expensive, you're paying for melee abilities you will/should never use.

I've also never really used Imported Matchlock Ashigaru, since when I did try them out, they were incredibly underwhelming. They barely got a volley off, looked more like a few odd shots that didn't really kill anyone. Because of this I haven't used any gunpowder troops at all.

**frogbeastegg** · 04-19-2011, 15:46

Hero units. Too much a 'crazy-power' unit for my tastes. They make me feel like I can get away with sloppy play when they are on my side, and are a chore to kill when the AI has them. They also ruin the illusion that the battle is plausible. I used them in a single battle and will not build them again.

Battlefield ninja. I didn't see the point in STW, and I don't see it in S2TW. Maybe if as a player I was more interested in hunting down the enemy general I'd have a different view. As it is, I prefer to kill him later in the battle.

Bomb throwers, cavalry archers and guns are all units which have a place in my armies; that place is highly limited, highly specialised, and I do not want them around outside of that. I'm working on guns in the hopes I will one day wish to include them in my standard armies. At the moment I feel I have other, better ways to get similar results using more standard unit types, e.g. a flanking cavalry charge instead of a flanking gun volley to damage morale.

**james_austintx** · 04-19-2011, 16:48

Bomb Throwers are outstanding when defending in siege assault.

**The_Emperor** · 04-19-2011, 17:37

Originally Posted by frogbeastegg

Battlefield ninja. I didn't see the point in STW, and I don't see it in S2TW. Maybe if as a player I was more interested in hunting down the enemy general I'd have a different view. As it is, I prefer to kill him later in the battle.

Hi froggy!

i agree there, I did read up some strategies on how to use them on sieges but to be honest I would much rather smash their General with a Yari Cav charge in the back than take a small bunch of sneaky dudes that always seem to start the game with the AI army marching directly towards their position on their way to my army.

There are so many better ways to kill the enemy general than to rely on ninja.

**Marshall Louis-Nicolas Davout** · 04-22-2011, 21:43

Originally Posted by frogbeastegg

Hero units. Too much a 'crazy-power' unit for my tastes. They make me feel like I can get away with sloppy play when they are on my side, and are a chore to kill when the AI has them. They also ruin the illusion that the battle is plausible. I used them in a single battle and will not build them again.

Battlefield ninja. I didn't see the point in STW, and I don't see it in S2TW. Maybe if as a player I was more interested in hunting down the enemy general I'd have a different view. As it is, I prefer to kill him later in the battle.

Bomb throwers, cavalry archers and guns are all units which have a place in my armies; that place is highly limited, highly specialised, and I do not want them around outside of that. I'm working on guns in the hopes I will one day wish to include them in my standard armies. At the moment I feel I have other, better ways to get similar results using more standard unit types, e.g. a flanking cavalry charge instead of a flanking gun volley to damage morale.

oh no,Hero units are the best!They were used in Japan during that peroid.And they are killers!

**frogbeastegg** · 04-22-2011, 22:01

Originally Posted by Takeda Shogunate

oh no,Hero units are the best!They were used in Japan during that peroid.And they are killers!

One day I should do a comedy test battle in the custom battle mode. One of each hero unit for my army and no one else, versus 20 units of yari ashigaru. How many men can the heroes kill? I used to do that to relieve stress in the older games, like 4 units of the best knights against a horde of peasants. It's a good break from the regular battles I like to fight in campaign mode.

By the way, how did your campaign go? Did you win?