Quote Originally Posted by Axalon
Originally Posted by Asai Nagamasa
Spies only affect the loyalty of the province, not the loyalty of generals.
False…. Spies affect the loyalty of target-generals due to failed treason-trials. Per each attempted and failed trial: -1 Loyalty as a result… And then there is the vices too….


Vices gained:
===========

1 attempted & failed trial: “Informants”, -0 loyalty…. +2 vs. spies
2 attempted & failed trials: “Informant network”, -1 loyalty…. +4 vs. spies
3 attempted & failed trials: “Spy Network”, -2 loyalty…. +4 vs. spies
4 attempted & failed trials: “Spy Network”, -3 loyalty…. +4 vs. spies
5 attempted & failed trials: “Secret Assassinator”, -4 loyalty…. +6 vs. spies, – 20% happiness…
6 attempted & failed trials: “Assassinator”, -5 loyalty…. +2 vs. spies, -40% happiness….
Hello Axalon, like Girlandir says, i also undestood that Asai meant whether spies affect generals' loyalty by their default presence. If so, and i think that this is how it was meant, then what ws said is actually true.

Quote Originally Posted by Axalon
Originally Posted by Asai Nagamasa
Failed treason plots have no effect apart from giving the general vices that can make him harder to get rid of - more resistant to spies.
False…. See above…. Also, the fact is that with enough failed trials it actually becomes easier pull it off due to severely lowered loyalty that comes out of repeated attempts.
Combined with the above, i'd say that this information is certainly incomplete but not false. False means something entirely wrong or untrue and this is not tha case. Thank you for adding/correcting the info presented, but there is no need to discredit the author of it in doing so.

Quote Originally Posted by Axalon
This time around it will be me (again).
I'm sure we all welcome your knowledgeable contributions Axalon, but there is really no need trying to outdo in a discrediting manner fellow members by contributing. Whatever tension or rivalry may have existed or still exists between you and Asai, using misteps of others (with a bit of of conscious or unconscious extra misunderstanding) in order to outdo them only feeds the tension and exacerbates said rivalries, creating a climate of fear and hostility. There is enough space for all of us here, no need to outdo anyone.

Please bury the hatchet, because it is quite unpleasant to see this sort of thing in the main hall where there is a very friendly climate of collaboration, friendship and understanding for ages now. This behaviour is certainly unworthy of someone of your contributions to the MTW community in my eyes.