Where to expand with Saka?

[xzGAB]

I am now playing a Saka campaign and, as usual, started to expand south and destroyed Bactrian. But now I have 2 choices: remain east conquering rebel sentlement and (after/at the same time) attack AS. I also ask me why not abandon all east cities and go to Ptolomaic lands, they are very rich. I could go greece (and all those gold mines), Minor Asia...

What do you all think? Tell me a place with good chance to earn easy money and stabilish myself.

[Zim]

Haven't played a nomadic faction in a long time, but isn't there a province or two with the nomad resource around Getai's starting lands? Might make Greece the best bet, since you could conquer north and be able to recruit more of Saka's non elite cavalry.

On the other hand, I migrated to Carthage as the Sauromatae and had a lot of fun. Used Numidian cavalry as my fodder to back up the elite cavalry I could build by settling...

[gamegeek2]

Gandhara! Big money there.

[Tux]

China is my tip...

[athanaric]

Gandhara! Big money there.

Also, extremely good recruitment options for Saka. Probably the best for any faction in any region.

[Cute Wolf]

teleport to Ireland

[xzGAB]

Big money in Gandhara? youre kidding me...i am talking serious, i don't know if i should spend money in my cities and remain east or go west...

[CashMunny]

Big money in Gandhara? youre kidding me...i am talking serious, i don't know if i should spend money in my cities and remain east or go west...

Uh, Gandhara IS big money. Not sure what you mean... Go southeast into India, capture Sindh, Gandhara, and uh... the other one... I want to say Taxashila? Then go westwards either against the Sauromatae or the Arche. I'd recommend defeating the Sauromatae and expanding across the steppes, because you can keep the Arche at bay with a few halfstacks of HAs, and the Sauros don't usually ever attack you until you attack them first as Saka, so you can take 2-3 settlements before they can respond, and even then they're distracted by Hayasdan, Getai, and Koinon Hellenon usually so you can make quick work of them.

[gamegeek2]

Taksashila = capital of Gandhara. Has 3 mines, I think, and amazing recruitment. One of the best cities in the game.

[athanaric]

Taksashila = capital of Gandhara. Has 3 mines, I think, and amazing recruitment. One of the best cities in the game.

It has only one mine, which is always upgraded by the time you capture it though. Plenty of other resources as well. Sattagydia and Sindh have two mines each, also upgraded.
Sindh has the worst recruitment options of the three (still pretty good though, with Guild Warriors and Elephants and all that), but is the strongest in economical terms because of the two mines plus the possibility to build a level 2 port plus some other goodies.

[strategos roma]

Just started a Saka campaign and started by killing off the Parthians then going really deep into the AS. I've now got Assak, Margiane, Apameia, Hekatompylos, Marakanda and Alexndreia-Eschate and am moving on Gabai while planning an invasion on Bactria seeing as their main army is beseiging some slave city in the steppes. Didn't bother with any slave cities; too hard to take with their HAs. I've now got the reforms but no idea how to get the new units; can anyone help me out there? Some advice on their government options and building tree would also be much appreciated.

[xzGAB]

You should read about them searching topics. There's a walkthrough with the first few turns teaching how to get green economy fast.

To get the reformed units you need to build an allied government. Build Indigenous Sentlement to enable Allied Government. Then build the barracks for local soldiers. The reforms enable the use of these local soldiers.

[xzGAB]

I have a problem. All my nobles and HA are at east conquering those cities with gold mines. To secure my border against AS I had to train levy troops (greek levy spearmen and persian archers) and fortify Persepolis.

My problem is to train Saka Heavy Hoplites (those after reforms) at Persepolis, I cant build Allied Govern there, only nomadism and pastoralism are available. RV says I can train Indo-Saka units at Persepolis but I cant do it.

It's not easy defend a city with levy troops and I am being sieged every year. What to do?

[strategos roma]

You should read about them searching topics. There's a walkthrough with the first few turns teaching how to get green economy fast.

To get the reformed units you need to build an allied government. Build Indigenous Sentlement to enable Allied Government. Then build the barracks for local soldiers. The reforms enable the use of these local soldiers.

Thx mate. So all the reform units need the allied gov, even the late Saka catas? Also, how do I get client rulers?

[Taedius]

@ xzGAB: Have you buit the Indigenous settlements building?

@ strategos roma: Nomadic client rulers require a fix. Check the tech forum for 1.2 fixes.

[xzGAB]

Yeah, I sell enemy govern, build Indigenous Sentlement and the Allied building doesn't come. Migration is still out there. Is this a bug? I just took Gabai and the same happened: build Indigenous and Allied doesnt show up.

[xzGAB]

Saka catas replace the general armored nobles. Your general will not shoot anymore, but will be heavier and the new weapon to replace the bow, very good at mellee (use Alt after the charge).

But this will not occur with Saka reform, but with generic reform. Saka reform only enable you to use regional soldiers

[Taedius]

Maybe it's the mixed hidden resource kicking in. Not sure if that hinders allied gov. though. Can anyone confirm?

[Drewski]

Yeah, I sell enemy govern, build Indigenous Sentlement and the Allied building doesn't come. Migration is still out there. Is this a bug? I just took Gabai and the same happened: build Indigenous and Allied doesnt show up.

My 1st time with them - I have the reforms, and have conquered south and west all the way to Persepolis - yet the ONLY option for an allied gov (and hence to build proper foot soldiers) is in Baktra. Has anyone any idea just where you can build allied govs as Saka (I'm guessing in Pakistan and the Indus)? Defending Persepolis with just generals and horse archers (and winning heroic victory after HV) is getting a little stale.

[xzGAB]

Taxshala (or whattever is the name of the city) and the other 2 cities east can have an AlliedG. I saw tha maps and Persepolis is marked as a mixed city, so we cant have AG there. Baktra isnt the only place to recruit reform soldiers, you can train them at Kophen too. According to the map after Persepolis we dont find mixed cities, so I hope my Saka Heavy Hoplites can be recruited there.

I am planning to conquer AS and change my style of fighting. I want to have 2 armies of campaign. One with saka hoplites as infantrymen supported by archers and maybe cheap HA and 3 or 4 heavy horsemen. This will be my main army and will be supported by another "old style" cheap HA half stack with 3-4 heavy horsemen. Blitz and conquer.

Drewski, dont forget to conquer the 3 cities at east, they all have very good gold mines. Dont forget the 1.2 fix too. It is not easy to maintain public order because of the distance to capital, so a client ruler is very important

[Drewski]

Taxshala (or whattever is the name of the city) and the other 2 cities east can have an AlliedG. I saw tha maps and Persepolis is marked as a mixed city, so we cant have AG there. Baktra isnt the only place to recruit reform soldiers, you can train them at Kophen too. According to the map after Persepolis we dont find mixed cities, so I hope my Saka Heavy Hoplites can be recruited there.

I am planning to conquer AS and change my style of fighting. I want to have 2 armies of campaign. One with saka hoplites as infantrymen supported by archers and maybe cheap HA and 3 or 4 heavy horsemen. This will be my main army and will be supported by another "old style" cheap HA half stack with 3-4 heavy horsemen. Blitz and conquer.

Drewski, dont forget to conquer the 3 cities at east, they all have very good gold mines. Dont forget the 1.2 fix too. It is not easy to maintain public order because of the distance to capital, so a client ruler is very important

Don't worry, I have the fixes but thanks for mentioning them ;)

Where can I find this map that you mention?

Yeah. I know all about the Indus cities, but all have at least 2 elephants (3 with an elephant general if he/they are still alive), plus Infantry Guild Men- until I can afford an army with some foot skirmishers etc., they are really tough asks to take.

I'm trying this, because I started a Sauro campaign recently, and frankly found it mind-numbingly boring (all HA armies are basically one tactic, abuse the ais idocy while running away, then charge with FMs). At least I got the hang of the different govt. types.

Saka interested me because I didn't know they could quickly get "traditional" type of armies, which mixed with their insane FMs, makes for some interesting battles and tactics. I think I'll start again, and not bother blitzing all the way to Persepolis this time.

EDIT: Never mind I found a map -its here if anyone else wants it

[strategos roma]

I managed to get out of debt and finished building the final level of barracks in my capital but some of the units listed on the EB website were missing. I couldnt any catas but did find an unit called armoured bodyguards, which I thought were same as my FMs, only to discover that they didn't have any missiles and were actually catas. Is this normal?

Btw, after killing of the Parthians, their remaining fm who became slave suddenly had their bodyguards changed to Brihentin. Anyone seen this before?

[Ca Putt]

their remaining fm who became slave suddenly had their bodyguards changed to Brihentin. Anyone seen this before?

oh, yeah many times :(

[Drewski]

Btw, after killing of the Parthians, their remaining fm who became slave suddenly had their bodyguards changed to Brihentin. Anyone seen this before?

Exactly the same thing happened to me....

I killed off the Pahlava AND The Bactrians insanely early in my 2nd Saka try. Bactra had a full stack sieging Kophen,and I attacked a half stack in Baktra, with just 3 generals, and they had another 3 quarter stack in relief. My spy opened the gates, and I thought "what the heck, lets kill as many as possible then run away". Miraculously, one general occupied the town square---3.00 and counting down- I managed to use the other two generals to blockade the approaches, and the relieving army were 15 seconds too late :) Baktra dead....

Pahlava left one city almost completely unguarded, so I attack a turn or two later and took it. To my horror, a full stack appeared by their last remaining city, but then proceded to march upon the one I'd just conquered (doh), which allowed a heroic victory by just one FM and a unit of HA against the few units garrisoned there. Pahlava dead.

But now HUGE problem. The Hay never attacked the AS. Pontus have just signed a peace treaty with the AS. So the AS attack me, and immediately sign a peace treaty with the Ptols (I mean come on - "Hey Ptols, lets stop fighting over all these valuable middle eastern/anatolyian cities, some upstart Horsemen have just conquered a couple of tiny valueless towns in the middle of nowhere, let's fight them instead!")

Taking out both Pahlava and Baktra by 268BC, means that the AS become just too powerful, with too few enemies....

[xzGAB]

AS become just too powerful, with too few enemies

The problem is AS have good units after persepolis. The small villages at the border with Baktra (your early targets) are badly defensed but cities near the heart of the AS are very well defended and your arrows will kill only shooting at the backs of the enemy. Saka infantry and superarmored FMs (after generic reform) are very important now

[Ca Putt]

kill only shooting at the backs of the enemy

if at all :( - TAB

[Cute Wolf]

if at all :( - TAB

something worse, have you seen AS TAB SPAM? they're actually worse than Argyraspidai spam because they can't be killed via normal archery ways, and will rip the hell out of you in melee

[Ca Putt]

yeah, had that, especially annoying when you just trained a bunch o Cav archers(as KH) and try to get them into the Field when you get caught at a ford deep in hostile territory! maaan I had to send a new stack to get an ample number of steppe raiders in the field :/

that was close to beeing the first Heroic Victory for the AI ^^

When faceing TABs you really need some AP units, or at least phalangites.

[xzGAB]

What is TAB SPAM?

[moonburn]

thorokitai annoying bullduzorers after the arche reforms those dudes just refuse to die :|and they have thicker armour then most of ww2 tanks