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Thread: Differences of the Ikko Ikki faction

  1. #1
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    May 2004
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    Default Differences of the Ikko Ikki faction

    This is just a copy-and-paste job from TWC, where a poster did some excellent work detailing all the many differences between Ikko and the "normal" factions. If you post at TWC, please go to the thread and thank him for his work with a rep:

    And now, here's the data

    Unit Availability

    - Buddhist Monk
    + Ikko Monk

    - Metsuke

    - Yari Ashigaru
    + Ikko Yari Ashigaru (+20% Unit Size, +1 morale, -1 Melee Attack, -1 Melee Defence)

    - Bow Ashigaru
    + Ikko Bow Ashigaru (+33% upkeep, +20% Unit Size, +1 morale, -1 Melee Attack, -1 Charge Bonus, -20% Accuracy, -60% Reloading Skill)

    - Matchlock Ashigaru
    + Ikko Matchlock Ashigaru (+25% Unit Size, +1 morale, -1 Melee Attack, -1 Charge Bonus, -67% Accuracy, -50% Reloading Skill)

    - Yari Samurai
    + Yari Ronin (+7% Recruitment Cost, -33% Upkeep, -25% Unit Size, +2 morale, +2 Melee Attack, +2 Melee Defence, -"Rapid Advance")

    - Naginata Samurai
    + Yari Ronin xp1 (-33% Upkeep, -25% Unit Size, +2 morale, +5 Melee Defence, +10 Bonus vs Cavalry, -4 Armour, +12% Movement Speed)

    - Katana Samurai
    + Katana Ronin (+7% Recruitment Cost, -25% Unit Size, +2 morale, +2 Melee Attack, +2 Melee Defence)

    - No-Dachi Samurai
    + Katana Ronin xp1 (-25% Unit Size, +2 morale, +1 Melee Attack, -13 Charge Bonus, +6 Melee Defence, +3 Armour, -"Banzai")

    - Bow Samurai
    + Bow Ronin (+7% Recruitment Cost, -17% Unit Size, +1 morale, +13% Accuracy, +25% Reloading Skill)

    - Yari Cavalry
    - Katana Cavalry
    + Naginata Warrior Monk Cavalry (Too tired for analysis. Stats appear to be warrior monks on a horse, standard cavalry size. 25% higher upkeep cost than the samurai cavalry. Numbers added together, they should be equal in melee versus Yari Cavarly and Katana Cavalry. Vulnerable to being charged by Yari Cavalry. Better morale. Much worse armour. Great vs Infantry)

    - Naginata Warrior Nuns

    - Samurai Retainers
    - Onna Bushi
    + Ikko Ikki Naginata Warrior Monk Garrison (far superior, including double the size of Onna Bushi/Samurai Retainers. From Ikko temple buildings instead of castles)

    All Warrior Monks replaced with Ikko Ikki versions, which are have the increased combat stats of Uesugi, but not the lowered recruitment cost and upkeep of Uesugi. Naginata and Bow Warrior Monks need only a temple, not monestary, thus much earlier accessed).

    + Ikko Ikki Matchlock Warrior Monks

    + Ikko Ikki Naginata Warrior Monk Cavalry


    - "Secret Police"
    + Can research "Sword Hunt" cheaper because "Secret Police" is not requirement.
    + "Scholarship" does not require "Tea Ceremony".
    +- "Neo-Confusionaism" requires "Scholarship" instead of "Calligraphy"

    Scholarship gives +5% to Ikko Monk actions instead of the 10% of the other religions.


    Japan is generally very hostile and there is a tendency to choose the Ikko Ikki is targets of expansion. Extreme effort is required in diplomacy. Compared to starting as a typical Buddhist clan...

    - Diplomatic penalty with Buddhist clans: -30
    - Diplomatic penalty with Christian clans: -90


    - Cannot change clan religion (as far as I can tell).
    - Others cannot convert to Ikko religion.


    - Castles don't provide Onna Bushi or Samurai Retainers (At the moment they do provide Samurai Retainers instead of some of the Ikko Warrior Monks from Temples; obviously bugged)
    + Ikko temple chain of buildings (+Naginata Warrior Monks buildable at temple level instead of Monestary. +1 Naginata Warrior Monk Garrison for every level of temple chain and +1xp to all warrior monks per temple level. Spreads religion to nearby provinces.)

    Starting Location

    + Plenty of trade possible right away.
    + No rebels.
    + Two provinces.
    + Home is "Artistans" with sea lane. Second is "Blacksmith".
    + Start with Ikko Monk.
    + Start with Ikko Temple.


    Generals have three skill paths instead of two. The new is mostly rearranged from the standard general, providing Province religion conversion, inspire ability, rally ability, morale boost and reduced maintenance costs are among the first the generals can gain.

    Generals convert provinces to Ikko religion as a base trait.

    No metsuke means having to use Ninja assassinations and Monk character conversion to get rid of enemy Ninja. There is no protection against enemy Ninja, and you will get some of your generals and tons of monks assassinated/executed over and over. You also cannot raise the own general loyalty through Metsuke, and cannot boost tax revenue in your provinces. Economy is difficult, especially with the expensive units and hateful neighbors.

    No metsuke is not compensated with more other agents. So Ikko gets 5 agent on map less than others. Standard is 5 monks, 5 ninjas, 5 metsuke and 1 Geisha. Investment into Ninjas a must.

    Ikko Monks incite Ikko rebel revolts. If they take a province, it transfers into your ownership along with the (sometimes very hardcore) rebel army that took it. Inciting revolts instantly breaks military alliances with the province owner. Can get major diplomatic penalties. I saw "-40 Revolts Incited" and also sometimes "Sabotage Attempts". Attempting to convert characters, and MAYBE demoralize army gives "-50 Hostile Agent Actions". Unclear how much of this mechanic applies to the other clans as of this patch.


    There's new general speech stuff concerning the Ikko. New intro movie for them, victory movie, shogun, narration stuff.

    The Yari Ronin unit stands out as being especially cost effective. Slightly less men but massively less upkeep (100 per turn, 50 less than Yari Samurai) while posessing superior combat abilities. Faster and better than Naginata Samurai while having superb anti-cavalry abilities. Just watch out for the Katana Samurai. The lack of "Rapid Advance" limits their use as ambushers or quick tactical maneuvers however.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Differences of the Ikko Ikki faction

    Thanks! Very useful and informative.

    Another thread has the buildings' conversion rates, though the poster wrote that some figures may be inaccurate.

    Buddhist chain:
    Buddhist Temple: +1 zeal
    Monastery: +2 zeal, +1 zeal neighboring
    Temple Complex: +4 zeal, +3 zeal neighboring
    Famous Temple: +6 zeal, +5 zeal neighboring

    Christian chain:
    Chapel: +2 zeal, +2 zeal neighboring
    Mission: +4 zeal, +3 zeal neighboring
    Church: +6 zeal, +5 zeal neighboring
    Cathedral: +8 zeal, +6 zeal neighboring

    Nanban chain:
    Nanban Trade Port: +4 zeal
    Nanban Quarter: +6 zeal, +3 zeal neighboring

    Ikko chain:
    Jodo Shinshu Temple: +3 zeal, +1 zeal neighboring
    Jodo Shinshu Monastery: +5 zeal, +3 zeal neighboring
    Jodo Shinshu Sanctuary: +7 zeal, +5 zeal neighboring
    Honganji: +10 zeal, +8 zeal neighboring


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