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No rush, take your time.
Originally Posted by Myth:
No rush, take your time.
Says the man with two stacks planted in forts. No rush, take your time.
I forgot SS allows fort building in enemy/non-allied territory. Because of that and the low cost of forts, spies should be allowed to open the gates of forts. Leon upSS allows it, as does vanilla, Teutons, Crusades, basically any mod we use sans TATW and Britannia (which has a plethora of stone forts sprinkled around the map) aForts are the only way to ensure that we don't just camp in our cities waiting for tier 3 siege weapons in a fought battles game. Since, you know, going in with anything but a 3 on 1 numerical advantage is risking your amy being slaughtered. Also, forts are used to protect one's besieging army from relieving forces. And you still have the home turf advantage of both sallying from your cities and from being able to gang up on armies.
Plus I said in the tips part of the first post to always sleep in forts. To which I will add: unless the enemy has catapults, in which case your army might get massacred in a botched up siege defense (Silver slaughtered a full cav-stack of mine this way in GA)
That being said, I would like to hear what the others think. I also want them to welcome our new player if they have nothing against him participating. I don't want to be a tyranical admin for this game since I'm also a player, but it's kind of hard to have a discussion when this thread does not get replies.
Plus I said in the tips part of the first post to always sleep in forts. To which I will add: unless the enemy has catapults, in which case your army might get massacred in a botched up siege defense (Silver slaughtered a full cav-stack of mine this way in GA)
That being said, I would like to hear what the others think. I also want them to welcome our new player if they have nothing against him participating. I don't want to be a tyranical admin for this game since I'm also a player, but it's kind of hard to have a discussion when this thread does not get replies.
wait... who is our new player?
well, whoever you are, welcome!
(I don't mean to be oblivious, but I don't see anyone joining the game in this thread...)
as to the replies, the question just went up today :)
Here is my opinion though, I understand your point about forts being very powerful loosecannon, but in my experience letting spies open much of anything at will turns the game into a huge spy battle, with everyone dedicating as much of their resources as they can to that one unit, which I don't find that entertaining. Spy use has also been a hotspot of contention/accusations in my experience due to the random and unpredictable nature of them.
If other people want to allow this though I will be fine with that as well.
well, whoever you are, welcome!
(I don't mean to be oblivious, but I don't see anyone joining the game in this thread...)
as to the replies, the question just went up today :)
Here is my opinion though, I understand your point about forts being very powerful loosecannon, but in my experience letting spies open much of anything at will turns the game into a huge spy battle, with everyone dedicating as much of their resources as they can to that one unit, which I don't find that entertaining. Spy use has also been a hotspot of contention/accusations in my experience due to the random and unpredictable nature of them.
If other people want to allow this though I will be fine with that as well.
The new player would be me, if im accepted by Ezilkannan and Silver Shield but In either case, i thank you
Forts sure seem vital in hotseat, but not being able to use the spys full potential is bothering me slightly as you always have assasins. After all subterfuge have always been one of the most important things in war.
Knowledge is power, hide it well.
Forts sure seem vital in hotseat, but not being able to use the spys full potential is bothering me slightly as you always have assasins. After all subterfuge have always been one of the most important things in war.
Knowledge is power, hide it well.
Welcome Mithridate, I'm not sure where I missed that you are joining, but it isn't important I guess.
Nightbringer check the posts on page 9 of this thread. Anyway spies are used for LOS behind enemy lines and to create public order in enemy settlements. This game is limited to one assassination attempt per turn and as such spies won't be in too much danger.
On the other hand, if spies are allowed to open forts, it will have to be the second action done so i can check if the player did not reload to get the spy to open on the first turn. But i do not want to see the enemy positions and armies as a player here, so we'll have to burden Phonics to do it. Also, people can and probably will reload at least so that they do not lose their spy on his attempt to emter, and then wait for him to open on turn 2.
Overall this is a big pain in the butt and i don't see a compelling reason to change it, as usung forts well is a fundamental skill to have in a lead battles game.
On the other hand, if spies are allowed to open forts, it will have to be the second action done so i can check if the player did not reload to get the spy to open on the first turn. But i do not want to see the enemy positions and armies as a player here, so we'll have to burden Phonics to do it. Also, people can and probably will reload at least so that they do not lose their spy on his attempt to emter, and then wait for him to open on turn 2.
Overall this is a big pain in the butt and i don't see a compelling reason to change it, as usung forts well is a fundamental skill to have in a lead battles game.
So you can actually see if a player reloads a save?
Bummer, messed up taking screens so now ive got to report it to the admin in the corresponding game >.<
No biggie tho.
Edit: Great, now i know how and what to do in case of failed screens. better learn now than later, since i doubt sinking 2 ships with will cause an outrage ;)
Bummer, messed up taking screens so now ive got to report it to the admin in the corresponding game >.<
No biggie tho.
Edit: Great, now i know how and what to do in case of failed screens. better learn now than later, since i doubt sinking 2 ships with will cause an outrage ;)
The admin can see if.this particular instance of the save has been loaded by tye actions log that is genrleratwd while.Mm2TW is being played. However this too cab be circumvented because thwre is no particular.time.when one must play one's save. We are not quite as paranoid as the. net guys, so we only watch for the random string - we require for assassinations to go first, and spy attempts second (or the other way around). Since the outcome of an action changes whenever another action has been taken. This happens because the so called "random seed" changes whenever the player does something - if you try to kill someone with your assassin and fail, you canreload, move one army by one hex and then try again, and this time the outcome can be different.
However eith rules stating that spy actions are first and assassination or sabotage attempts go second, there is no way for the player to change the outcome no matter how many times.he loads.
As far as naval battles go, they seem to be much more random than land battles. The. net guys frequently ban Heroic Victories at sea for this reason. Here though we are more trusting of our fellow players and do not enforce such rules, nor do we require screenshots.
Plus one player might be your enemy here, and a most trusted ally in another game, so cheatung makes less sence.
However eith rules stating that spy actions are first and assassination or sabotage attempts go second, there is no way for the player to change the outcome no matter how many times.he loads.
As far as naval battles go, they seem to be much more random than land battles. The. net guys frequently ban Heroic Victories at sea for this reason. Here though we are more trusting of our fellow players and do not enforce such rules, nor do we require screenshots.
Plus one player might be your enemy here, and a most trusted ally in another game, so cheatung makes less sence.
I'm sorry for the dreadfull mistakes, i'm on trough my phone and it's hard to type correctly on a tiny virtual keyboard.
The problem with forts is that this is Stainless Steel and balistas are useless against any building. The "attack" button won't even light up on a siege with only a balista in the army. In MOT and WotK2 we're playing much later and everybody has a siege factory somewhere. So right now, Myth can slowly move troops across my territory and I can't attack him.
And as to these "fought battles". I thought it was interesting until I fought one. The battles ended as soon as TE's armies broke and I was unable to run them down and capture or kill even more of his men. Auto-resolve is much better.
And as to these "fought battles". I thought it was interesting until I fought one. The battles ended as soon as TE's armies broke and I was unable to run them down and capture or kill even more of his men. Auto-resolve is much better.
I don't know what's up with the fought battles where it son't let you finish off the enemy, it seems like it's random in some mods to whether it lets you finish off an army or not
Originally Posted by Thanatos Eclipse:
I don't know what's up with the fought battles where it son't let you finish off the enemy, it seems like it's random in some mods to whether it lets you finish off an army or not
I know, that has always confused me.I don't know what's up with the fought battles where it son't let you finish off the enemy, it seems like it's random in some mods to whether it lets you finish off an army or not
Originally Posted by LooseCannon1:
The battles ended as soon as TE's armies broke and I was unable to run them down and capture or kill even more of his men. Auto-resolve is much better.
Do you think you kill more in AR? It's impossible to finish an army off that way either.The battles ended as soon as TE's armies broke and I was unable to run them down and capture or kill even more of his men. Auto-resolve is much better.
It is weird the way the battle ends when they break, you usually get the option to continue or not but it doesn't seem so in this mod. Still, it's not hard to leave one enemy unit fighting while you finish off the rest - old fashioned horse archer tactics to maximise kills!
In all my experience fighting battles every game and mod has behaved the same:
I fight the AI until i can spark a chain route of the army. Note that units that route in this stage can return to "shaken" or even normal status, based on their base morale value and the command and chiv of the general.
The game pauses when every remaining unit has routed and asks if i want to declare victory or continue fighting.
I choose to continue and send my cav to wipe out the fleeing enemy stacks, targeting those closest to the edge of the map first.
The battle ends when every enemy unit is either dead or flead. However this might happen sooner if the enemy broke close to the edge of the map, or if you leat most enemy units flee while you concentrated on one or two.
Even in a siege assault you get the chance to kill off reinforcements and defenders after you have held the town center for three minutes. I've never had the battle end without giving me a choice, unless i've already killed every enemy unit and there is nothing left to chase.
AR depletes enemy stacks by some percentage and you can't really finish them off unless they are in a settlement or fort.
Also, please re-read the rules for this game. Ballistae can't open anything (regardless of the SS mod). However, if you keep your armies in a castle you can still get the chance to lead a battle (sally forth) since no one has trebuchets or cannons and thus has to wait for rams, ladders and towers to be built. Lead battles does more justice to the Muslim factions btw, you would get mauled by the western infantry and crusader mercs in AR.
I fight the AI until i can spark a chain route of the army. Note that units that route in this stage can return to "shaken" or even normal status, based on their base morale value and the command and chiv of the general.
The game pauses when every remaining unit has routed and asks if i want to declare victory or continue fighting.
I choose to continue and send my cav to wipe out the fleeing enemy stacks, targeting those closest to the edge of the map first.
The battle ends when every enemy unit is either dead or flead. However this might happen sooner if the enemy broke close to the edge of the map, or if you leat most enemy units flee while you concentrated on one or two.
Even in a siege assault you get the chance to kill off reinforcements and defenders after you have held the town center for three minutes. I've never had the battle end without giving me a choice, unless i've already killed every enemy unit and there is nothing left to chase.
AR depletes enemy stacks by some percentage and you can't really finish them off unless they are in a settlement or fort.
Also, please re-read the rules for this game. Ballistae can't open anything (regardless of the SS mod). However, if you keep your armies in a castle you can still get the chance to lead a battle (sally forth) since no one has trebuchets or cannons and thus has to wait for rams, ladders and towers to be built. Lead battles does more justice to the Muslim factions btw, you would get mauled by the western infantry and crusader mercs in AR.
Originally Posted by Myth:
In all my experience fighting battles every game and mod has behaved the same:
I fight the AI until i can spark a chain route of the army. Note that units that route in this stage can return to "shaken" or even normal status, based on their base morale value and the command and chiv of the general.
The game pauses when every remaining unit has routed and asks if i want to declare victory or continue fighting.
I choose to continue and send my cav to wipe out the fleeing enemy stacks, targeting those closest to the edge of the map first.
The battle ends when every enemy unit is either dead or flead. However this might happen sooner if the enemy broke close to the edge of the map, or if you leat most enemy units flee while you concentrated on one or two.
As TE had multiple generals in each stack, I concentrated ranged units on them. His armies were 80% dead when they broke. I just wanted to get my generals a few more dread points. They deserved themIn all my experience fighting battles every game and mod has behaved the same:
I fight the AI until i can spark a chain route of the army. Note that units that route in this stage can return to "shaken" or even normal status, based on their base morale value and the command and chiv of the general.
The game pauses when every remaining unit has routed and asks if i want to declare victory or continue fighting.
I choose to continue and send my cav to wipe out the fleeing enemy stacks, targeting those closest to the edge of the map first.
The battle ends when every enemy unit is either dead or flead. However this might happen sooner if the enemy broke close to the edge of the map, or if you leat most enemy units flee while you concentrated on one or two.
Originally Posted by :
Even in a siege assault you get the chance to kill off reinforcements and defenders after you have held the town center for three minutes. I've never had the battle end without giving me a choice, unless i've already killed every enemy unit and there is nothing left to chase.
AR depletes enemy stacks by some percentage and you can't really finish them off unless they are in a settlement or fort.
Also, please re-read the rules for this game. Ballistae can't open anything (regardless of the SS mod). However, if you keep your armies in a castle you can still get the chance to lead a battle (sally forth) since no one has trebuchets or cannons and thus has to wait for rams, ladders and towers to be built. Lead battles does more justice to the Muslim factions btw, you would get mauled by the western infantry and crusader mercs in AR.
Tell that to Hungary. In AR, I eliminated every man in it's Crusade army. In an open field.Even in a siege assault you get the chance to kill off reinforcements and defenders after you have held the town center for three minutes. I've never had the battle end without giving me a choice, unless i've already killed every enemy unit and there is nothing left to chase.
AR depletes enemy stacks by some percentage and you can't really finish them off unless they are in a settlement or fort.
Also, please re-read the rules for this game. Ballistae can't open anything (regardless of the SS mod). However, if you keep your armies in a castle you can still get the chance to lead a battle (sally forth) since no one has trebuchets or cannons and thus has to wait for rams, ladders and towers to be built. Lead battles does more justice to the Muslim factions btw, you would get mauled by the western infantry and crusader mercs in AR.
Now, repeat after me, ballistae are useless in SS because of how they are designed by gracul and Point Blank not by any rule you impose. You can make a rule that ballistae MUST be used against buildings but that won't improve their ZERO effect against walls and gates. Fact is every other siege weapon can knock down a stone wall, even mangonels, (which have a 5 or 10 attack vs walls).
Fact is forts are too cheap in SS. In KGCM they're 2500 not 500 which is why they're used sparingly. Not like in this game where the guy who had Leon before TE put up a half-dozen forts. He only knew enough that no spy or ballista could get through them. And in addition to one strategic error, I made 3 tactical ones on the first 2 turns.
I put up a lot of those forts as I subbed Leon when Ashur left us. I understand what you're saying, but this is not an AR game. Give it a chance, you may like it yet! Conjuring up Heroic Victories to turn the tide of a doomed game is something that can never happen in an AR game. AR means that whomever gets the most land and stacks is predetermined to steamroll the opposition. No such thing in a lead battles game.\\
P.S. You can eliminate enemy stacks in AR if you give them no place to retreat but that's illegal on every hotseat forum i know.
P.S. You can eliminate enemy stacks in AR if you give them no place to retreat but that's illegal on every hotseat forum i know.
The Hungarian Crusade army had stopped outside of Toledo. I attacked with the garrison, killed the general, ransomed some prisoners and the rest of the stack disolved. There was no visible retreat of the army to the northeast or anywhere else. They had plenty of escape room. but they may have been too far from any allied territory (which is what some people have claimed).
Originally Posted by LooseCannon1:
The Hungarian Crusade army had stopped outside of Toledo. I attacked with the garrison, killed the general, ransomed some prisoners and the rest of the stack disolved. There was no visible retreat of the army to the northeast or anywhere else. They had plenty of escape room. but they may have been too far from any allied territory (which is what some people have claimed).
Yeah, if they have no contiguous territory and no ships on the coast they will be annihilated. This is an exception to the escape rule. Cecil lost the Britannia game this way when he landed a stack with all his FMs on it on an island and got beaten by a Norse army.The Hungarian Crusade army had stopped outside of Toledo. I attacked with the garrison, killed the general, ransomed some prisoners and the rest of the stack disolved. There was no visible retreat of the army to the northeast or anywhere else. They had plenty of escape room. but they may have been too far from any allied territory (which is what some people have claimed).
Mithridate when the Turks come up I'll clear the password for you. Let me know if you need help.
im too busy for that today its halloween. give me a slight extention here im having this up tomorrow
No problem.
Originally Posted by Myth:
Mithridate when the Turks come up I'll clear the password for you. Let me know if you need help.
Dont worry, I will if something comes up. Now im setting up in a dark corner to plot, inviting all the faithful to join me!Mithridate when the Turks come up I'll clear the password for you. Let me know if you need help.
alright kwarz up
http://depositfiles.com/files/gqcab3se1
im good with keeping unlimited forts and banning spies from opening it. the game is better that way
im taking Mithridate is the same Mithridate playing the danes at the game at the other forum? hadnt had a look at the situation at this game yet im doing this later today but the danes likely are disrupting my game plan there but anyway u welcomed
http://depositfiles.com/files/gqcab3se1
im good with keeping unlimited forts and banning spies from opening it. the game is better that way
im taking Mithridate is the same Mithridate playing the danes at the game at the other forum? hadnt had a look at the situation at this game yet im doing this later today but the danes likely are disrupting my game plan there but anyway u welcomed
Originally Posted by SilverShield:
im taking Mithridate is the same Mithridate playing the danes at the game at the other forum? hadnt had a look at the situation at this game yet im doing this later today but the danes likely are disrupting my game plan there but anyway u welcomed
Indeed, the one and only. I do not however play with anyone named Silver Shield there as far as i can tell and im only Danes in DC CCmv2, are you perhaps under a diff name?im taking Mithridate is the same Mithridate playing the danes at the game at the other forum? hadnt had a look at the situation at this game yet im doing this later today but the danes likely are disrupting my game plan there but anyway u welcomed
Currently in 4 hotseats, it all goes so slooow :( Think ill look for more yo join^^
Originally Posted by Mithridate:
I do not however play with anyone named Silver Shield there as far as i can tell and im only Danes in DC CCmv2, are you perhaps under a diff name?
He's called Gladius Maximus over thereI do not however play with anyone named Silver Shield there as far as i can tell and im only Danes in DC CCmv2, are you perhaps under a diff name?
French are up
Attachment 3021
Today the Seljuk Empire celebrated as the new Sultan led the faithful to Heroic victories against a massive rebel host with a handful brave men, and led a band of militia in desperate defence of their homes against a larger, well trained force of crack Byzantic troops.
The faithless shall tremble as they sense all that we are about to accomplish, we shall bring his holy retribution down upon them!
Constantinople will BURN
Attachment 3021
Today the Seljuk Empire celebrated as the new Sultan led the faithful to Heroic victories against a massive rebel host with a handful brave men, and led a band of militia in desperate defence of their homes against a larger, well trained force of crack Byzantic troops.
The faithless shall tremble as they sense all that we are about to accomplish, we shall bring his holy retribution down upon them!
Constantinople will BURN
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