Results 1 to 30 of 38

Thread: Freedom v Bansturbators

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1
    Clan Clan InsaneApache's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Grand Duchy of Yorkshire
    Posts
    8,636

    Default Freedom v Bansturbators

    I've been following the events in Stony Stratford and I have to say, I'm on the side of liberty.

    I can't work out what the British public is most wedded to – civil liberties, private enterprise or fags. Paul Bartlett, a Tory councillor in Stony Stratford, Buckinghamshire, has introduced a motion to ban smoking in all public places. Even outside. If it succeeds, Stony Stratford will have the first smoke-free high street in the UK.

    "Everybody who lives in Stony, everybody who shops in Stony, truly loves Stony," Susi Whittaker told me from the gallery she runs in the high street. "Hence the bunting, baskets and flowers. Everybody wants to keep this a thriving market town. Nobody supports him. People who don't smoke don't support him. People who have kids and don't smoke don't support him."

    Bartlett is well known for his zero tolerance views. He's a kind of mayor Giuliani for Milton Keynes or to put it another way "a total twat". So said Stony resident Gina Sherwood. "I think it's absurd. There are too many people against it. I don't know one person who is for it."

    Bartlett's rationale is that walking up any high street you get smoke in your face which harms you and your children. It's an argument that has already worked in some part of America. The first city to go nuclear on the issue was Calabasas, California, which has had a ban on smoking outdoors since 2006. New York banned smoking from its parks and beaches last month, around the same time it legalised same-sex marriage. But such legislation sticks in the nicotined craw of British smokers, who point out that when you're outdoors there's a proliferation of fresh air.

    Resistance is not limited to smokers, however. Whittaker doesn't smoke nor does Zoe Bridgewood, who also ticks the parent box. She said: "This is just victimising people. Can't we just be non-smokers? Why do we have to be anti-smokers?"

    Matthew, who works in an estate agency in the town, said: "It's quite la-di-da around here. Not many people smoke. So it might send house prices up a bit. But they're too high anyway. I think it's a bit silly."

    Though none of the people against the ban had ever met anybody who was in favour of it, I did find one. Helaine Whiteside said: "I think it would be good. Because of the nature of the town the pubs don't have gardens. Many are old coaching inns so the outside space is filled with the coaching houses, which people live in. So smokers have to stand on the street and they don't clean up after themselves."

    This is a pub-centric and strangely familiar place, partly because it features the famous Cock and Bull pubs, from which the phrase "a cock and bull story" derives, and also because this is where the film A Cock and Bull Story was shot. It's also where Withnail and I was filmed, and everyone here seems extremely proud of this.

    The town represents a dichotomy of two very distinct strands of Britishness – the Victor Meldrewish tendency to find everybody else annoying, especially when they're doing something noisy or smelly, and the Withnail Britishness of drinking until you're sick and finding it really amusing.

    The purity of this war makes everybody's position more robust, and as certain as the local councillors are of success – many from both parties support the ban – so the opponents are sure they will overturn it, if necessary, with sheer attitude.

    Tim, a 62-year-old smoker, said: "There's a groundswell of outrage about this suggestion." But will this be enough? What does a groundswell even look like? "Petitions have already gone around. We'll go on Tuesday and protest outside the meeting."

    It's hard to say at this point how the division looks, whether all the people in favour of the ban are are councillors, and will have a vote on it, while all those opposed are outside the process, with only as much sway as a banner and a sense of outrage can provide.

    Perhaps this is what such decisions looked like in America; the non-smokers on one side of the process – possibly having better access to the corridors of power because they don't waste time standing around outside smoking – and a load of baffled onlookers, wondering what just happened.
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/theguardia...ames-residents

    So, are you with me? Or are you a closet bansturbator?
    There are times I wish they’d just ban everything- baccy and beer, burgers and bangers, and all the rest- once and for all. Instead, they creep forward one apparently tiny step at a time. It’s like being executed with a bacon slicer.

    “Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists or not, diagnosing it incorrectly, and applying the wrong remedy.”

    To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticise.

    "The purpose of a university education for Left / Liberals is to attain all the politically correct attitudes towards minorties, and the financial means to live as far away from them as possible."

  2. #2
    Darkside Medic Senior Member rory_20_uk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Taplow, UK
    Posts
    8,690
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default Re: Freedom v Bansturbators

    I'm personally against smoking, as yes, others are affected.

    Chewing tobacco? Fine - just don't spit on the pavement.
    Cocaine? Fine.
    Heroin? Fine.
    Crack? No - again there are fumes
    Opium pipes? No, fumes.

    One should have all liberties as long as they do not impinge on the liberties of others.

    Smoke at home. Smoke whatever the hell you like.
    Do cocaine off a prostitute's backside. I really don't care.
    There is a very different discussion on then who picks up the tab for cocaine-induced heart attacks... but McDonald's induced ones are apparently fine as is cigarette induced COPD. Best just tax the lot and deal with it that way.

    I no more want to inhale smoke in town than I want to listen to preachers of any religion with a megaphone blasting their stunted understanding of their dogma.

    An enemy that wishes to die for their country is the best sort to face - you both have the same aim in mind.
    Science flies you to the moon, religion flies you into buildings.
    "If you can't trust the local kleptocrat whom you installed by force and prop up with billions of annual dollars, who can you trust?" Lemur
    If you're not a liberal when you're 25, you have no heart. If you're not a conservative by the time you're 35, you have no brain.
    The best argument against democracy is a five minute talk with the average voter. Winston Churchill

  3. #3
    Voluntary Suspension Voluntary Suspension Philippus Flavius Homovallumus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Isca
    Posts
    13,477

    Default Re: Freedom v Bansturbators

    I have to say, running the "smoky gauntlet" on a narrow pavement outside a pub is really quite unpleasent. So I don't know, I'm sure it will be banned eventually anyway and it's a measure that would do more to cut the number of smokers than anything else.
    "If it wears trousers generally I don't pay attention."

    [IMG]https://img197.imageshack.us/img197/4917/logoromans23pd.jpg[/IMG]

  4. #4
    TexMec Senior Member Louis VI the Fat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Saint Antoine
    Posts
    9,935

    Default Re: Freedom v Bansturbators

    Quote Originally Posted by rory_20_uk View Post
    I'm personally against smoking, as yes, others are affected.

    Chewing tobacco? Fine - just don't spit on the pavement.
    Cocaine? Fine.
    Heroin? Fine.
    Crack? No - again there are fumes
    Opium pipes? No, fumes.

    One should have all liberties as long as they do not impinge on the liberties of others.

    Smoke at home. Smoke whatever the hell you like.
    Do cocaine off a prostitute's backside. I really don't care.
    There is a very different discussion on then who picks up the tab for cocaine-induced heart attacks... but McDonald's induced ones are apparently fine as is cigarette induced COPD. Best just tax the lot and deal with it that way.

    I no more want to inhale smoke in town than I want to listen to preachers of any religion with a megaphone blasting their stunted understanding of their dogma.

    Will you ban cars, anything with an exhaust pipe?


    As for health hazards, I think I run a much greater risk health risk from people drinking alcohol. I've never had to run for smokers roaming the streets with foam on their mouths and madness in their eyes, looking to pick a fight. Let's ban alcohol first of all drugs, this killer that turns our streets into a zombie apocalypse-like war zone every weekend.
    Anything unrelated to elephants is irrelephant
    Texan by birth, woodpecker by the grace of God
    I would be the voice of your conscience if you had one - Brenus
    Bt why woulf we uy lsn'y Staraft - Fragony
    Not everything
    blue and underlined is a link


  5. #5
    Ranting madman of the .org Senior Member Fly Shoot Champion, Helicopter Champion, Pedestrian Killer Champion, Sharpshooter Champion, NFS Underground Champion Rhyfelwyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    In a hopeless place with no future
    Posts
    8,646

    Default Re: Freedom v Bansturbators

    Quote Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat View Post
    Will you ban cars, anything with an exhaust pipe?


    As for health hazards, I think I run a much greater risk health risk from people drinking alcohol. I've never had to run for smokers roaming the streets with foam on their mouths and madness in their eyes, looking to pick a fight. Let's ban alcohol first of all drugs, this killer that turns our streets into a zombie apocalypse-like war zone every weekend.
    Spot on!

    The "your liberty ends where anothers begins" line of thought should not be abused. I think banning outdoor smoking is an example of such abuse, since the harm to others is pretty much negligible.
    At the end of the day politics is just trash compared to the Gospel.

  6. #6
    BrownWings: AirViceMarshall Senior Member Furunculus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Forever adrift
    Posts
    5,958

    Default Re: Freedom v Bansturbators

    Quote Originally Posted by InsaneApache View Post
    I've been following the events in Stony Stratford and I have to say, I'm on the side of liberty.

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/theguardia...ames-residents

    So, are you with me? Or are you a closet bansturbator?
    it comes down to how you interpret this phrase:

    http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Mrs_Patrick_Campbell

    Understand this phrase and understand the english!

    "Does it really matter what these affectionate people do — so long as they don’t do it in the streets and frighten the horses!"

    It is not YOUR business to curb the liberty of another englishmen, regardless of your opinion on its moral value or otherwise, unless it represents a serious intrusion into your own life.
    Furunculus Maneuver: Adopt a highly logical position on a controversial subject where you cannot disagree with the merits of the proposal, only disagree with an opinion based on fundamental values. - Beskar

  7. #7

    Default Re: Freedom v Bansturbators

    Unless they're celebrities, or it's about sex. In which case the Englishmen feel very much that it is their business to know and pass it on.
    - Tellos Athenaios
    CUF tool - XIDX - PACK tool - SD tool - EVT tool - EB Install Guide - How to track down loading CTD's - EB 1.1 Maps thread


    ὁ δ᾽ ἠλίθιος ὣσπερ πρόβατον βῆ βῆ λέγων βαδίζει” – Kratinos in Dionysalexandros.

  8. #8
    A very, very Senior Member Adrian II's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
    9,748

    Default Re: Freedom v Bansturbators

    All these calls for bans come from people who lead useless lives and who have ****-all to do all day but complain. Anyone want to live in Rory's exhaust-free, barbecue-free, deodorant-free world? Id rather go and hang myself.

    AII
    Last edited by Banquo's Ghost; 07-17-2011 at 20:26. Reason: All letters of a profanity to be asterisked out
    The bloody trouble is we are only alive when we’re half dead trying to get a paragraph right. - Paul Scott

  9. #9
    Member Member Greyblades's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    8,408
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default Re: Freedom v Bansturbators

    Hrm... I'm all for liberties normaly but I realy hate the smell of ol' baccy.

    Personally I think we should go with George Carlin's method; You should have the right to blow smoke in my face, but I should have the right to kick you in the nuts, steal yer lighter and set fire to yer pants if I dont like it.
    Being better than the worst does not inherently make you good. But being better than the rest lets you brag.


    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    Don't be scared that you don't freak out. Be scared when you don't care about freaking out
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

  10. #10
    Clan Clan InsaneApache's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Grand Duchy of Yorkshire
    Posts
    8,636

    Default Re: Freedom v Bansturbators

    It not about tobacco.
    There are times I wish they’d just ban everything- baccy and beer, burgers and bangers, and all the rest- once and for all. Instead, they creep forward one apparently tiny step at a time. It’s like being executed with a bacon slicer.

    “Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists or not, diagnosing it incorrectly, and applying the wrong remedy.”

    To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticise.

    "The purpose of a university education for Left / Liberals is to attain all the politically correct attitudes towards minorties, and the financial means to live as far away from them as possible."

  11. #11
    Tuba Son Member Subotan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    The Land of Heat and Clockwork
    Posts
    4,990
    Blog Entries
    3

    Default Re: Freedom v Bansturbators

    Quote Originally Posted by Greyblades View Post
    Hrm... I'm all for liberties normaly but I realy hate the smell of ol' baccy. .
    Alternatively, this could be written as "Hrm...I'm all for liberties normally, but I really hate fags."

  12. #12
    Darkside Medic Senior Member rory_20_uk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Taplow, UK
    Posts
    8,690
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default Re: Freedom v Bansturbators

    Quote Originally Posted by Adrian II View Post
    All these calls for bans come from people who lead useless lives and who have ****-all to do all day but complain. Anyone want to live in Rory's exhaust-free, barbecue-free, deodorant-free world? Id rather go and hang myself.

    AII
    Ever thought of writing for the News Of The World? They could do with your ability to make **** up. If you confuse the utility of a car with a cigarette, perhaps hanging yourself would be doing the world a favour.

    An enemy that wishes to die for their country is the best sort to face - you both have the same aim in mind.
    Science flies you to the moon, religion flies you into buildings.
    "If you can't trust the local kleptocrat whom you installed by force and prop up with billions of annual dollars, who can you trust?" Lemur
    If you're not a liberal when you're 25, you have no heart. If you're not a conservative by the time you're 35, you have no brain.
    The best argument against democracy is a five minute talk with the average voter. Winston Churchill

  13. #13
    Ranting madman of the .org Senior Member Fly Shoot Champion, Helicopter Champion, Pedestrian Killer Champion, Sharpshooter Champion, NFS Underground Champion Rhyfelwyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    In a hopeless place with no future
    Posts
    8,646

    Default Re: Freedom v Bansturbators

    Quote Originally Posted by rory_20_uk View Post
    Ever thought of writing for the News Of The World? They could do with your ability to make **** up. If you confuse the utility of a car with a cigarette, perhaps hanging yourself would be doing the world a favour.

    Or maybe you could learn to not obscure things by picking up on petty points when they don't really have any major impact on the argument.
    At the end of the day politics is just trash compared to the Gospel.

  14. #14
    Member Senior Member Proletariat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Far up in the Magnolia Tree.
    Posts
    3,550

    Default Re: Freedom v Bansturbators

    Quote Originally Posted by rory_20_uk View Post
    Ever thought of writing for the News Of The World? They could do with your ability to make **** up. If you confuse the utility of a car with a cigarette, perhaps hanging yourself would be doing the world a favour.

    If you're so confused you think heroin use and cocaine is fine as long as it isn't being smoked because that would emit fumes, maybe you should go hang. ...your medical degree on the wall for something we normal people can use for a dartboard, you quack.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO