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  1. #1

    Default Re: Question to all US orgahs 40+ years and older

    A broken system...

    Indeed, the deal negotiated Sunday - after weeks of brinksmanship - would leave until later the big problems such as Social Security and Medicare, whose finances must be overhauled as the population ages.

    Deficits would continue for the coming decade, and the debt would continue to rise - just not as much as if there is no deal.

    Obama struggled throughout the weeks of clashes.

    He came to the debt debate late. After spending the first two years of his term pushing greater federal spending to fight the effects of a deep recession, he largely ignored recommendations to cut deficits by his own bipartisan commission headed by Erskine Bowles and Alan Simpson, and did not propose any significant deficit reductions in his Feb. 1 budget proposal to Congress. His budget envisioned the debt rising by $9 trillion over 10 years.

    And when he first asked Congress to increase the government's debt ceiling - to allow more borrowing to pay bills already in the pipeline - he insisted it be done without any conditions as it had been done routinely for decades.

    Only after the Republican-controlled House of Representatives demanded offsetting spending cuts over the next 10 years to match any increase in the debt ceiling did Obama change course and enter negotiations.

    He pressed for tax increases along with spending cuts, but did not prevail. After Republicans walked out of White House talks claiming they could not negotiate with Obama, Vice President Joe Biden, a veteran of the Senate, stepped in.

    "The perception is that the president has abrogated leadership," said Sherry Bebitch Jeffe, a political scientist at the University of Southern California. "He lost it when he sort of blew off the Bowles-Simpson commission. He could have used it as a starting point."

    Also, Obama was somewhat captive to the left wing of the Democratic Party, knowing his approval ratings are low and that he'll need a big turnout from liberals in what could be a very close re-election contest next year.

    Thus, when he and the Republicans appeared close to a deal more than a week ago - one that included Republican approval of $800 billion in increased tax revenues over 10 years - Obama came under pressure to make the package more acceptable to liberal Democrats. He proposed adding $400 billion more in taxes - or scaling back cuts in entitlement spending. The Republicans broke off the talks.

    At the same time, Obama found himself unable to move the public.

    Polls showed a majority of Americans sided with him in pressing for higher taxes from wealthy Americans as part of any deal. Yet despite frequent public appearances to press that approach, Obama saw his approval rating drop to 40 percent last week in the Gallup Poll, the lowest of his presidency. It had reached 50 percent in June.

    "When he's gone out front, he's dropped even further, which gives him even less leverage," said George Edwards, a scholar of the presidency at Texas A&M University.

    Assuming they can get the deal through Congress, Republicans can claim some success at forcing the government to start reining in spending.

  2. #2
    The Black Senior Member Papewaio's Avatar
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    Default Re: Question to all US orgahs 40+ years and older

    Bigger problem is this is just about shuffling how much debt and talking about reining it in. Leaves two massive problems leftover:
    Reality of getting a handle of the debt and working it down.
    Perception of how well the US is functioning economically has lost so much gloss that there are suggestions in the market that the US will lose its AAA rating because of cracks appearing. Unfortunately the markets are based more on perception then reality.

    The reality is neo-industrial countries are information and service based. Thus the US is in very good shape, all we are presently seeing is the attempts to slough off the dead skin of industries that are out of date or individual companies that aren't performing. One thing that would have been better for the budget and the US in the long term may have been not intervening so heavily with corporations, that includes welfare for ones that are 'too big' to fail... or having learnt the lesson, limit corporations to being smaller then that size and foster more competition.

    Maybe have a two types of companies. Much like some banks get government backing... if you self limit your corporation size to a competitive level then you get government bailouts if a nationwide disaster happens... if you want to go for broke, have less controls (laws, size controls, unlimited CEO payrolls etc) then you can have a much larger company but it has to stand on its own two feet.
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  3. #3
    Member Centurion1's Avatar
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    Default Re: Question to all US orgahs 40+ years and older

    Quote Originally Posted by Papewaio View Post
    Bigger problem is this is just about shuffling how much debt and talking about reining it in. Leaves two massive problems leftover:
    Reality of getting a handle of the debt and working it down.
    Perception of how well the US is functioning economically has lost so much gloss that there are suggestions in the market that the US will lose its AAA rating because of cracks appearing. Unfortunately the markets are based more on perception then reality.

    The reality is neo-industrial countries are information and service based. Thus the US is in very good shape, all we are presently seeing is the attempts to slough off the dead skin of industries that are out of date or individual companies that aren't performing. One thing that would have been better for the budget and the US in the long term may have been not intervening so heavily with corporations, that includes welfare for ones that are 'too big' to fail... or having learnt the lesson, limit corporations to being smaller then that size and foster more competition.

    Maybe have a two types of companies. Much like some banks get government backing... if you self limit your corporation size to a competitive level then you get government bailouts if a nationwide disaster happens... if you want to go for broke, have less controls (laws, size controls, unlimited CEO payrolls etc) then you can have a much larger company but it has to stand on its own two feet.
    The ultimate irony is that no single corporation in the US at this moment is truly too big too fail....... Ford, GM, etc. If they went bankrupt it wouldn't destroy the United States. None of the corporation bailouts were truly necessary to the economic safety of the USA. Corporations and businesses fail and are either reborn from the ashes or disappear. This is the nature of the capitalistic system. A failing business simply creates a vacuum which another entity moves into or grows into.

  4. #4
    smell the glove Senior Member Major Robert Dump's Avatar
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    Default Re: Question to all US orgahs 40+ years and older

    Tell that to the Feds.
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  5. #5
    Senior Member Senior Member Fisherking's Avatar
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    Default Re: Question to all US orgahs 40+ years and older

    Quote Originally Posted by Major Robert Dump View Post
    Tell that to the Feds.
    Sure, they bailed out the banks for the most part.

    We gave them money we didn’t have so they could charge us more interest on the money we gave them.

    It is no wonder they wanted to pass out a lot of it a bonuses to the bosses now is it?


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