why did the west commit to multiculturalism?

[Kagemusha]

How does Poland count?

Can't speak for Europe, but at least in Sweden the second generation is clearly integrating on average. That includes less children.

But you're right that they increase the number by around 40% in Stockholm (using the old definition of being second generation immigrant if one parent is an to immigrant) to around 37% (Stockholm is above average). I think total number is about 21% for "Swedes with foreign backround" that category. Debatable source, but I don't think they felt need to lie about that.

Are Swedish Finns counted on those numbers?

[Koga No Goshi]

The sociological average of immigrant communities entering a host countries that applies across all groups is:

1) First generation NEVER loses their original tongue as a primary first language, and it is most usually the only language they speak in the home and with fellow community members.

2) Second generation is usually bilingual and often acts as translators for the first generation or grandparents or relatives.

3) Third generation has typically lost the original language and their strongest ties to the original culture of origin is food.

That's across all groups. There's of course going to be exceptions and outliers or cases where one community holds onto customs/language a bit longer or a bit shorter than average, but in the big general picture, that's the sociological fact when it comes to immigrant groups entering a larger host mainstream culture.

Whenever people talk about something like "oh but this group is different, they don't WANT to adapt", it's usually just prejudice dolled up as something else. First generation immigrants of any sort rarely WANT to lose their culture or language, however much there are instances of "well my grandaddy came here and learned English right away and refused to speak German" or whatever else, those were usually coping mechanisms for dealing with periods of time where there was a lot of anti-immigrant sentiment or whatever else, moreso than someone actually desperately wanting to shed their own background and heritage. But you can find groups of EVERY background bemoaning the loss of language and culture in their 2nd and 3rd generations after being in a new country... it's pretty much just an unavoidable happening.

These kinds of criticisms about "not wanting to adapt/learn our language/assimilate" are ALWAYS directed against the newest, least popular group. In Europe it's the Muslims, in the U.S. it's Spanish speakers. But I took Spanish classes in high school with *plenty* of 2nd and 3rd generation or even 1.5 generation Latino kids who could not fully speak or fully read and write their own "original language" outside of minor round-the-dinner-table conversational Spanish with mom and dad.

Why do "they don't WANT to adapt" arguments superficially appear to be valid? Because they're nearly always directed against new groups that are primarily first generation or the 2nd generation is fresh/kid/school age. But almost invariably the 2nd generation will have the host country language as their first language.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

The sociological average of immigrant communities entering a host countries that applies across all groups is:

1) First generation NEVER loses their original tongue as a primary first language, and it is most usually the only language they speak in the home and with fellow community members.

2) Second generation is usually bilingual and often acts as translators for the first generation or grandparents or relatives.

3) Third generation has typically lost the original language and their strongest ties to the original culture of origin is food.

Except that the current "Second Generation" Muslims in Britain and elsewhere are less integrated and appreciative of their host country than their parents. They are reactionary, in many cases very deeply, in a few murderously.

[Koga No Goshi]

Except that the current "Second Generation" Muslims in Britain and elsewhere are less integrated and appreciative of their host country than their parents. They are reactionary, in many cases very deeply, in a few murderously.

I think to greater or lesser degrees you could make virtually the same claim about any sizable ethnic enclave or group in a new host country, especially if looking over the worst elements or examples. People in the U.S. said exactly the same thing about ties to the mother country and the U.S. being ruled from Rome when the big recent groups were the Irish and Italians and both groups were rife with gang and mafia activity. Fast forward a few generations and the idea that they were regressive people who'd never blend into the mainstream is kinda silly.

But in specific you say they're less integrated. Are you seriously saying they speak less English than their parents' generation? Are less connected with English or British culture, despite growing up in it and going to British schools? That seems rather far fetched.

[rory_20_uk]

I think the reason is the first migrants were pure economic migrants who want the jobs, security but not the country as such.

America, probably because of its heritage, is very big on drumming into everyone they are Americans. Salute the flag, morning statement at school and also when becoming a citizen. Here there is none of that. America us undoubtedly changing with influxes of new people, but these are adding to the core rather than choosing enclaves.

[Koga No Goshi]

I think the reason is the first migrants were pure economic migrants who want the jobs, security but not the country as such.

America, probably because of its heritage, is very big on drumming into everyone they are Americans. Salute the flag, morning statement at school and also when becoming a citizen. Here there is none of that. America us undoubtedly changing with influxes of new people, but these are adding to the core rather than choosing enclaves.

With regards to the first generation that is quite correct I believe and one of the great myths in the U.S. is that people believe the "old immigrants", the "good ones" came here with awe on their faces wanting so much to be Americans. They came here as economic immigrants by a huge margin, just like today.

[Ironside]

Are Swedish Finns counted on those numbers?

You're a separate country are you not? Yes, it's the largest group.