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Thread: How much does the AI Change between Easy and Legendary?

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  1. #1
    Senior Member Senior Member RedKnight's Avatar
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    Default Re: How much does the AI Change between Easy and Legendary?

    Quote Originally Posted by NightwindKing View Post
    holy crap these stupid peasants won't stay down!
    If you study the changing icons for happiness in each provice, you should never be surprised. A couple of tips:
    1) It doesn't matter how happiness is at the end of your turn, only what it will be at the beginning of the next turn. So if a Sake Den is almost done (+2 smiles) and repression is going from -4 to -3, well then you have 3 happiness you don't need to worry about. You can move out or kill 3 police, if you were at -2 or whatever.
    1b) Corollarry: Any new garrison force made will be there at the beginning of next turn.
    2) Be careful of generals and agents who may add happiness or suppression (same thing) until they move out.
    3) Resistance To Invaders increases, as you take more provinces. Your first few provinces have none, but by the time you have 12 or so (all depending on difficulty etc.), it will never go below 4.
    4) Look for red provinces on the Finance screen (key N) before ending each turn, if ever unsure. After a while you will call this screen your friend. Red provinces are ok if you understand everything involved.

    The pirates are a harrassment. You have to make a fleet that can deal with many contingencies. Before that, you have to make an economy that can support the contingencies.
    RK

  2. #2
    Member Member I_damian's Avatar
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    Default Re: How much does the AI Change between Easy and Legendary?

    Well, on easy and normal, if at the start of the game you move your whole army in to an enemy province, leaving your capital defended only by a single general, even if you're at war with a neighbour and even if they march in to your land, they will purposely make tactical blunders, such as not attacking your capital even though they could overpower the lone general and his 30 Samurai retainers with ease. They'll just mill around eating your fruit and, if they're feeling particularly warlike that day, destroy one of your buildings.

    On hard, they'll just go straight in for the city and wipe you out on turn 2, like what happened in my Takeda campaign this morning. First time I've ever lost a campaign since Medieval: Total War. (the first one from like a decade ago).
    EBII has finally released. All hail the EBII team!

  3. #3

    Default Re: How much does the AI Change between Easy and Legendary?

    Quote Originally Posted by RedKnight View Post
    If you study the changing icons for happiness in each provice, you should never be surprised. A couple of tips:
    1) It doesn't matter how happiness is at the end of your turn, only what it will be at the beginning of the next turn. So if a Sake Den is almost done (+2 smiles) and repression is going from -4 to -3, well then you have 3 happiness you don't need to worry about. You can move out or kill 3 police, if you were at -2 or whatever.
    1b) Corollarry: Any new garrison force made will be there at the beginning of next turn.
    2) Be careful of generals and agents who may add happiness or suppression (same thing) until they move out.
    3) Resistance To Invaders increases, as you take more provinces. Your first few provinces have none, but by the time you have 12 or so (all depending on difficulty etc.), it will never go below 4.
    4) Look for red provinces on the Finance screen (key N) before ending each turn, if ever unsure. After a while you will call this screen your friend. Red provinces are ok if you understand everything involved.

    The pirates are a harrassment. You have to make a fleet that can deal with many contingencies. Before that, you have to make an economy that can support the contingencies.
    RK
    1. My problem is that I end my turn building, say, a sake den, two units of yari ashigaru, and a Metsuke going-in to oversee the town, and in-between the end of my one turn and the start of my next, a rebellion appears, even though it was only at -2 or -1 when I ended the turn (I never let it get below that...and that only because Im forced to move my army away from the city).

    3. Ah! I didnt know that. Good to know! Thank you!

    4. I usually do, but I can never tell what black provinces are...they never seem too much different in output/happiness from green ones???

    @ Damian
    Good to know. Yeah I re-started my Date campaign last night and on turn 2 I saw that both the Tokugawa and the Shimazu had been destroyed. yikes!

  4. #4

    Default Re: How much does the AI Change between Easy and Legendary?

    Quote Originally Posted by NightwindKing View Post
    4. I usually do, but I can never tell what black provinces are...they never seem too much different in output/happiness from green ones???
    Black provinces are ones you have exempted from taxation. They have an increase in happiness, and bring you no money. If the province is deeply unhappy the happiness bonus from tax exemption will still not be enough to prevent revolt.

    Have you tried checking for enemy agents promoting unrest in these problem provinces? Send a ninja or metsuke scuttling around the map in that area, see if anyone shows up. Then try assigning them to the castle on the 'free' mission for a few turns, in case there's an agent which passed the sight check and wasn't noticed during the casual scouting. You are not 100% guaranteed to spot enemy agents this way, but the chance should be very high unless your people are low level and the enemy high level.

    Is your daimyo dishonourable? There's a happiness penalty for having less than 3 points of honour.

    Booting out enemy army remnants can be important as well; your people grow unhappy if an enemy army is ravaging the countryside.

    I take expansion slowly and steadily, keeping my army in place in newly conquered castle for a few turns. That lets some of the unhappiness pass whilst repression is high. I can then add in agents, a garrison, temporary tax exemption, and happiness buildings if I feel I will need them once the big army moves on. Repairing the castle and other damaged buildings is a high priority; I issue the order the turn I take over. I aim to keep 100% religious unity in all provinces and at all times; the monks/missionaries are sent in as soon as I spot a province which doesn't completely follow my chosen religion.

    I confess I don't see many happiness problems, even though I play on the highest difficulties. Thanks to these methods I have not seen a single revolt in any of my games.
    Frogbeastegg's Guide to Total War: Shogun II. Please note that the guide is not up-to-date for the latest patch.


  5. #5

    Default Re: How much does the AI Change between Easy and Legendary?

    Quote Originally Posted by frogbeastegg View Post
    Black provinces are ones you have exempted from taxation. They have an increase in happiness, and bring you no money. If the province is deeply unhappy the happiness bonus from tax exemption will still not be enough to prevent revolt.

    Have you tried checking for enemy agents promoting unrest in these problem provinces? Send a ninja or metsuke scuttling around the map in that area, see if anyone shows up. Then try assigning them to the castle on the 'free' mission for a few turns, in case there's an agent which passed the sight check and wasn't noticed during the casual scouting. You are not 100% guaranteed to spot enemy agents this way, but the chance should be very high unless your people are low level and the enemy high level.

    Is your daimyo dishonourable? There's a happiness penalty for having less than 3 points of honour.

    Booting out enemy army remnants can be important as well; your people grow unhappy if an enemy army is ravaging the countryside.

    I take expansion slowly and steadily, keeping my army in place in newly conquered castle for a few turns. That lets some of the unhappiness pass whilst repression is high. I can then add in agents, a garrison, temporary tax exemption, and happiness buildings if I feel I will need them once the big army moves on. Repairing the castle and other damaged buildings is a high priority; I issue the order the turn I take over. I aim to keep 100% religious unity in all provinces and at all times; the monks/missionaries are sent in as soon as I spot a province which doesn't completely follow my chosen religion.

    I confess I don't see many happiness problems, even though I play on the highest difficulties. Thanks to these methods I have not seen a single revolt in any of my games.
    Hmm. Im pretty sure I dont have any tax-exempt provinces...maybe it's a bug? I can check when I get home from work.
    I've got a Metsuke in each of my 'problem provinces', and still end up with this issue. One of them, I think Buzen, is 100% Christian, and I'm a Shinto/Buddhist clan. I have a fully upgraded temple complex AND a monk, and the religion hasn't changed at all. What gives? Is it because of the Nanban trade port? I'd happily destroy it, as I dont need/use it, but I'd be afraid I couldn't build another one later if I needed to.

    My Daimyo is full on the honorable bar, and actually gives a happiness increase when he visits a province. And yes, i usually keep a garrison in an unhappy, newly-conquered province. But Buzen especially has been giving me constant headaches. I'd let the curs keep it except that I need the port and farms there.

    And this is just on Hard.

  6. #6

    Default Re: How much does the AI Change between Easy and Legendary?

    Quote Originally Posted by NightwindKing View Post
    I've got a Metsuke in each of my 'problem provinces', and still end up with this issue.
    Try sending a ninja in to take a look around. Ninja and metsuke are strong against different agent types, and so what's overlooked by one might be noticed by another. Assuming that there is something to find, of course.

    One of them, I think Buzen, is 100% Christian, and I'm a Shinto/Buddhist clan. I have a fully upgraded temple complex AND a monk, and the religion hasn't changed at all. What gives? Is it because of the Nanban trade port? I'd happily destroy it, as I dont need/use it, but I'd be afraid I couldn't build another one later if I needed to.
    That kind of religious difference is very bad! It's almost certainly the cause of most of your problems. Put your mouse cursor over the up/down arrow icons next to the religious summary on the province information screen. That will break down exactly what is affecting each religion. Act to remove anything which gives a positive factor to Christianity.

    The Nanban port spreads Christianity; if its spread % is higher than that of your temple, it will prevent the temple from converting the population. Even if it gives a lower percentage than your temples, it will hamper your efforts. Burn that port down and you should start to see a difference. It is possible to keep one and have your population remain happily Buddhist; since you are already having difficulties it would be best to try that out another time, when you have had more practice at keeping the peasants happy. If you destroy the Nanban port you will be able to make a new one later, provided you have had the event which offers the chance to trade with the foreigners. All of the clans get that at different points in the campaign; it moves from the west side of the map to the east, so clans on the west side get it earlier.

    Monks work best in groups of 2-3 unless they are level 5 or 6. Low level monks don't have a very high conversion ability, so stacking the bonuses provided by multiple monks is the best way to get a big jump in the percentage. Especially when combined with Buddhist buildings.

    Check the neighbouring provinces for Christian buildings. Some of them spread the religion to all provinces which share a border. It could be that your enemy has one of these buildings, and is still converting your populace without actively doing anything. If you find one of these buildings get a ninja to sabotage it. That will temporarily remove the bonus. Repeatedly sabotage it until you can safely capture the province which contains it.

    Check for enemy missionaries in your province. They do not need to be on a mission to convert the population, their mere presence is enough.
    Frogbeastegg's Guide to Total War: Shogun II. Please note that the guide is not up-to-date for the latest patch.


  7. #7

    Default Re: How much does the AI Change between Easy and Legendary?

    Will do! Thanks for th info. Didn't know you could see affectations by mousing-over the up/down religion arrows. Cool!

    Forgot about that for neighboring provinces. Hmm...that might be affecting it too...

    On a separate question...how on earth do I level-up my agents? So far what I've found is that Metsuke are easy to level up, Monks take forever due to a lack of easily-convertible enemies, and Ninja are just impossible: I've managed to get ONE ninja to level two out of the 8 or so I've had so far...mostly they attempt an assassination or sabotage at 50%, fail and escape, and dont seem to gain xp.
    I have not yet seen any missions with OVER a 50% chance of success for my level 1 or two ninjas.
    My level 2 guy tried a 48% chance assassination and was caught and executed on the first try. He was the first ninja I've had caught while attempting a mission AND killed.
    What am i doing wrong? Is there some easy mission I can use to build-up my agents' skills?

  8. #8
    Senior Member Senior Member RedKnight's Avatar
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    Default Re: How much does the AI Change between Easy and Legendary?

    Good tips, fbe. It takes a while to figure out all the factors affecting population happiness Nightwindking, and occasionally the displays are hard to read even for a veteran, but there is a lot of info there. If you didn't know about the spread of religion, now you know to keep a much better eye on it. Christianity is a really volatile thing in this game, and mastering it (whether playing Buddhist or Christian) is a lot of fun.

    I'm sure there are many guides to agents to be found if you search. Some tips are:
    1. Monks and Priests are fairly easily level-able by siccing them on armies (demoralize). The smaller the stack, the easier to demoralize and less chance of failure (which often equals death for a beginner priest).
    2. Likewise, ninja sabotaging armies is an easy choice. Again, smaller armies are better (cheaper and more chance of success). Sabotaging buildings is also a choice; the lower the level of the building (less improved), the less the cost and higher the chance of success. Just click on all the choices you have in range and choose the easiest and/or cheapest, when training your ninja.
    3. I find metsuke the hardest to train because they mainly need to confront other agents... and unlike armies and buildings, enemy agents can be hard to predict. Often enough, but hardly always, AIs generate them at their capitols.
    For the record, your agents get 15 points for a successful action and 3 for a failed one. Also, 1 point/turn for a "maintenance" action (like a metsuke being embedded in a town to increase its taxes).

    Also for the record, I don't believe the percentages shown in game are always right, particularly at the lower ends (below 50% chance). Above 80%, they seem to be on target. Also doing something like trying to assassinate a daimyo seems to be really overstated; you probably only have a third of the chance shown.

    Something that may not be obvious is that any failed action against an AI also incurs a diplomacy hit, which you can see if you mouse over the other AI in the diplomacy screen to see the reasons for your current score against them. If you want to worry about this, you can choose to harrass rebels and/or only war enemies... but the point where AIs decide to war with you seems to be complex, so I'm not yet sure how much it matters. For one thing, they seem to declare war first if someone is adjacent to them, and only secondly based on warscore if they have no one to declare war on, next to them.

    Sometimes early in the game I will have a ton of young monks and ninjas around one hapless one-unit stack, which can't move and is incredibly demoralized. Poor bastards, ha ha.

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