Flash is dead! Long live Flash!

**Lemur** · 11-09-2011, 19:24

So Adobe is killing development for mobile Flash, but keeping desktop Flash around for a while. I guess this is good? Nobody "owns" HTML5, so I suppose it's an improvement? Thoughts?

Adobe has confirmed that it will cease development of Flash on mobile devices, saying that it will instead focus on HTML5 and apps for mobile platforms. [...]

“Over the past two years, we’ve delivered Flash Player for mobile browsers and brought the full expressiveness of the web to many mobile devices,” wrote Danny Winokur, Adobe VP and General Manager of Interactive Development. “However, HTML5 is now universally supported on major mobile devices, in some cases exclusively. This makes HTML5 the best solution for creating and deploying content in the browser across mobile platforms.”

Winokur says that Adobe will continue to let Flash developers package native apps for all major app stores using Adobe Air, but it is ceasing development of the Flash Player for Android and the BlackBerry PlayBook. (Now I’m sure plenty of tablet makers are regretting listing Flash capabilities as a feature.) The company says it will continue to release bug fixes, as well as let licensees of its source code release their own Flash-like products.

**Husar** · 11-09-2011, 20:21

Thoughts on Flash that I pretty much agree with. *puts on flame retardant*

Not a really big fan of Flash, the sooner HTML5 replaces it the better I think.
I often got the impression that it's bloated and slow, just like Adobe Reader...

Spoiler Alert, click show to read:

**Lemur** · 11-09-2011, 23:48

The only thing with HTML5 is the whole unresolved video codec snake pit. But other than that, I don't see how this is a bad thing.

**Tellos Athenaios** · 11-10-2011, 02:29

The only thing with HTML5 is that over half of the web isn't.

**Husar** · 11-10-2011, 13:11

Originally Posted by Tellos Athenaios

The only thing with HTML5 is that over half of the web isn't.

If over half of the web doesn't want me to look at their page that's their problem.

**Furunculus** · 11-10-2011, 15:38

Originally Posted by Lemur

The only thing with HTML5 is the whole unresolved video codec snake pit. But other than that, I don't see how this is a bad thing.

HTML5 + WebM + WebGL = FTW!

**Tellos Athenaios** · 11-10-2011, 19:01

Originally Posted by Husar

If over half of the web doesn't want me to look at their page that's their problem.

... Including but not limited to the ORG?

**Tellos Athenaios** · 11-10-2011, 19:03

Originally Posted by Furunculus

HTML5 + WebM + WebGL = FTW!

Not really. HTML 5 adds some interesting features/clarifications from HTML 4 but none of them are, from a technical viewpoint, an actual improvement over older tech.

**Furunculus** · 11-10-2011, 19:17

the combination will allows many of the web applications that have been traditionally associated with flash, but without needing flash, so i consider that a FTW situation.

**Tellos Athenaios** · 11-10-2011, 22:02

Originally Posted by Furunculus

the combination will allows many of the web applications that have been traditionally associated with flash, but without needing flash, so i consider that a FTW situation.

Sure. But my point here is that while it's probably great fun to be able to play with and develop stuff in JavaScript, it's not enough of an upgrade to be compelling for Flash shops to move over, or for old websites to upgrade. It's also not yet ubiquitous enough, and there are plenty of rough edges. For instance the video element is simply no contest for a Flash, VLC or MPlayer plugin in terms of supported formats, features and performance. (My view is that the video element has been bungled from the start: it should inherently never have been anything more than a semantic overlay on top of plugins -- an accessible replacement for the object/embed mess.)

**Husar** · 11-11-2011, 01:26

Originally Posted by Tellos Athenaios

... Including but not limited to the ORG?

I can view the Org on all my devices.
I'm not aware of any big flash applications here.
I know it's not html 5 but this is about flash vs html5, not html4 vs html5.

**Tellos Athenaios** · 11-11-2011, 01:52

Originally Posted by Husar

I can view the Org on all my devices.
I'm not aware of any big flash applications here.
I know it's not html 5 but this is about flash vs html5, not html4 vs html5.

Sorry, I misunderstood you, possibly because HTML5 has been so overhyped that I saw a bullish “HTML5 or get out” remark where none was intended.

What I am saying, though, is that where HTML5 is supposed to be a real competitor to Flash, in practice it is inferior in technical capabilities/specs. For instance WebM is a rather marked step backwards from H.264 in terms of picture quality, amenability to hardware acceleration, etc. That is why a video site serious about fidelity and performance can't use WebM. So H.264 it is. Except that it won't be supported by for instance Opera or Firefox. So back to the plugins (Flash), it is. Related, for 2D games the browsers have long actually been capable enough to do this without plugins (think Lemmings), but the world kept using Flash regardless.

It's the browser integration (UX), ubiquity of tools & tooling support, the power hungry nature of Flash due to a number of reasons where Flash loses out. For developers of websites/content these are all SEP.

As a result I just don't see the WWW mass migrating to HTML5, and I don't expect it Flash free any time soon.