Org Minecraft Server

[Vladimir]

Unfortunate. It should be in the next official update.

[rajpoot]

I killed the dragon.
I can read their thoughts

[Vladimir]

Somehow I managed to drown in three feet of water by the hotel last night.

Found my next project idea: http://www.minecraftforum.net/topic/...play-tutorial/

[TinCow]

The map has been updated and is now current as of last night. I increased the image compression to 50% (from 25%) to make the file upload a more manageable size. You can tell a bit when zoomed in, but I think the final result works just fine.

[Vladimir]

I don't like how redstone circuitry is coded. It seems inconsistent and not like true mechanical circuitry. I wish I knew more about coding to see what rules it follows.

Well, I suppose the rules are the same but they don't translate well into the Minecraft universe.

Of course, and I still can't view the map on my home computer.

[Beskar]

Of course, and I still can't view the map on my home computer.

Tried a different browser to Firefox? Updated Flash/Java/etc too? Do you have addons like noscript turned off?

[Vladimir]

Tried a different browser to Firefox? Updated Flash/Java/etc too? Do you have addons like noscript turned off?

Hmm. Thank you. Works well with Chrome.

[rajpoot]

So the big community arena thing is no longer on the table now?

Edit:
I just managed to obtain a music disc. Was trying to get a skeleton to kill a creeper since ages, but the creepers always blew up after the first shot. This time though I was successful.


Edit2:
I had another disc drop but it's the same one as the previous one so if anyone wants it let me know. I'll trade you for it.

[TinCow]

So the big community arena thing is no longer on the table now?

We're still doing it, but not in the same form as previously planned. We're simply going to make it a giant arena for visual appeal, without any plans to make it a mob-fighting location. We're mainly focusing on interesting architecture on a massive building, and will probably add in fun redstone circuitry wherever it makes sense, such as for doors and whatnot.

We're almost done clearing the main area. I think we should be finished with that today. When it's done, we'll measure the area to see just how much space we have. If we conclude we need more area after the measurement, we'll do more clearance. Once the area is fully leveled, we'll start by setting down a perfect circle 1 block high to form the basis of the outer wall. The construction will then progress from there.

[rajpoot]

Ahh OK...it's just I didn't see anyone log in since a few days so I thought it had all been scrapped.

I'll see if I can join you guys later tonight.

BTW Tincow have you had applied the pre-release update 11w50a to the server? Just asking since the creeper dropped the same disc twice and that update enabled additional disc drops.

[TinCow]

Ahh OK...it's just I didn't see anyone log in since a few days so I thought it had all been scrapped.

I'll see if I can join you guys later tonight.

BTW Tincow have you had applied the pre-release update 11w50a to the server? Just asking since the creeper dropped the same disc twice and that update enabled additional disc drops.

No, I havent installed any snapshots because CraftBukkit doesn't have a release that is compatible with them yet. I could install them, but I'd have to turn off CraftBukkit in order to do so.

[rajpoot]

Err....I don't know what CraftBukkit is, and I can't find a good explanation anywhere.....

Anyway, if turning it off inconveniences you in managing the server, then it is all right. I can live with one disc.
I just wanted to make sure that it was not chance that the same disc dropped twice in a row.

[Vladimir]

Hey. I've given my life more than once on the server this weekend. True, I was selfishly gathering my own resources at the time but I cleared a bit of dirt too.

The visual effect and the circuitry should be fun. It's going to be huge. There's even a good tutorial I posted about creating a 7 segment display. I need to find a way to do it with redstone torches. I'm also close to creating a mechanical bridge builder; Just need to get the top perpendicular piston to function properly. I can also install fully retractable lighting.

...Once I get the bridge builder working, I may be able to put it into an automatic feedback loop to automate it...

[Vladimir]

1.1 update due?

http://twitter.com/#!/jeb_/status/157141588324257792

Awesome!

[TinCow]

Ok, here's the proposed external frame of the arena:



The red circle has a radius of 75 squares, which should fill most of our area. The black circle in the middle is just a guess about the internal wall surrounding the combat floor. That circle has a radius of 37 squares. I don't think we need to build that one quite yet, but we'll need to figure out how much room we want for the stands and how much for the arena floor itself.

[edit] Ok, I have built a single layer of the outer (red) circle out of stone. We may want to continue by building the entire outer wall first, so we'll be able to figure out the height limitations.

[TinCow]

I think one of the main structural aspects which will impact the layout will be the construction of the seats. We need to create circular tiers of seating, in stadium style to look appropriate. This means that each ring of seats will have to be on its own height level, which will impact both the height of the exterior wall and the size of the combat floor (I am using a 30 radius combat floor in the examples, just for consistency). Here are some options I see as possible:

O = stone block
L = stairs (wooden, cobblestone, stone brick, brick, or netherbrick) (mimics seat)
II = fence (wooden, iron, or netherbrick).
- = blank space just to keep formatting proper

Low Spacious Tiers:

II
OL--II
OOOO

This setup I think will provide a pretty nice look, but it will also take up a lot of space. It requires 3 horizontal blocks for every 1 vertical block. If we had a central combat area with a radius of 30 blocks, that means we would have approximately 15 of these tiers, which would drop only an altitude of 15 squares. Ground level is at y = 65, which means we have 63 altitude to work with, so even if our bleachers started a further 10 squares up (for the combat floor wall), we'd only have an additional height of 25, which is 38 short of the maximum. I think that's too short.

High Spacious Tiers:

II
O
OL--II
OOOO

This is the same as above, but with each tier separated by 2 vertical blocks instead of 1. Once again, we'd get 15 tiers of seating with a 30 radius combat floor, but we'd now get an altitude difference of 30, which would hit 40 with a 10 square combat floor wall. Again, significantly shorter than the maximum, but I think the visual effect of this height would be better.

Low Small Tiers:

OL
OOO

This is the same as the first one, but without the fences, and thus shorter. With a 30 radius combat wall, we get 22 tiers and an altitude difference of 22. This has more seating than the Spacious Tiers, but I think it's still a bit short on altitude and I don't think it would look as nice.

High Small Tiers:

O
OL
OOO

The same as above, but with an extra block of height. Once again, on a 30 radius combat floor we get 22 tiers, but now an altitude difference of 44. Adding in a combat floor wall of 10 and we would hit an altitude increase of 54, which is nearing the maximum.

Other considerations:

In all of these options, we need access routes to allow people to get to their seats. These generally take two types: stairs going up the seating itself to allow movement closer to and farther away from the combat floor, and open walkways going around the arena to allow movement around the combat floor. The open walkways will reduce the number of tiers of seating we can use, but they could also be used to give some height boosts to the spacious tiers. Example:

II
O
O
O---II
OOOO

or


II
O
O
O
O---II
OOOO

In both of these cases, the walkway would just take up 1 spacious tier width, but would give a height increase of 1 or 2 blocks beyond even the High Spacious Tier. Access ramps from the ground floor/entrance areas of the arena could also open up into the high wall of these walkways, which is a design similar to the Coliseum and many modern arenas.

Of these, I'm inclined towards High Spacious Tiers with 2 of the extra-high walkways, which would give 13 tiers of seating and an altitude change of 44 with a 10 high combat wall. That leaves 19 squares above the highest tier for other stuff, which could include a low domed roof if we wanted one, perhaps with a suspended scoreboard or something.

Thoughts? Does anyone have any other designs for seating?

[rajpoot]

The high spacious tier seating option sounds best to me too. I can't quite visualise either of the access routes however....
I do suggest one thing though that along with normal seats we can add two boxes with VIP seats (facing each other, say at level with third or fourth row of seats from the bottom), to make it look like a proper arena.

Edit:
If we do the scoreboard, we should use redstone circuitry with the 7 segment display which Vladimir is building to actually display scores.

[TinCow]

Yeah, I think we definitely need VIP boxes as well. Probably 4, one each of the vertical/horizontal sides. Or we could even do an entire 'ring' of private boxes closest to the arena floor, perhaps with a couple extra large ones.

That scoreboard video he posted took up an absolutely crazy amount of space, I don't think it would fit into the design. Is there a more compact version?


Also, here's a basic cross section diagram of what the high spacious tiers would look like combines with a high walled walkway with an access route:

O = stone block
L = stairs (wooden, cobblestone, stone brick, brick, or netherbrick) (mimics seat)
II = fence (wooden, iron, or netherbrick).
- = blank space just to keep formatting proper
X = Access route (perhaps 2-3 blocks wide)

II
O
OL--II
OOOO
OOOOL--II
OOOOOOO
OOOOOXX
OOOOXXX
OOOXXXX---II
OXXXXOOOOO
XXXXOOOOOOL--II
XXXOOOOOOOOOO
XXOOOOOOOOOOOL--II
XOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

[Vladimir]

Now I know what to read during lunch.

On the scoreboard: I don't know if there's a compact version. Redstone construction always takes a lot of space. My thought was to incorporate the wiring blocks into the ceiling with the controls wrapping around to the control booth on the opposite end. I want a dual display but I'm sure that would take too much space.

I think the scale we're working on is sufficient to allow for a single digit display, again, with the circuitry in the uppermost levels.

[TinCow]

Another option would be to build the scoreboard into one side of the arena. We could have one section be without seating and instead have the scoreboard on the wall on that side. That might make it easier to build, and me might be able to fit in two digits.

[rajpoot]

Building it into the wall of the arena itself sounds better to me. And two digits would work perfectly as long as we have matches between two teams/players. All we'll need to do it display the number of wins.

[Vladimir]

Yeah, I think we definitely need VIP boxes as well. Probably 4, one each of the vertical/horizontal sides. Or we could even do an entire 'ring' of private boxes closest to the arena floor, perhaps with a couple extra large ones.

That scoreboard video he posted took up an absolutely crazy amount of space, I don't think it would fit into the design. Is there a more compact version?


Also, here's a basic cross section diagram of what the high spacious tiers would look like combines with a high walled walkway with an access route:

O = stone block
L = stairs (wooden, cobblestone, stone brick, brick, or netherbrick) (mimics seat)
II = fence (wooden, iron, or netherbrick).
- = blank space just to keep formatting proper
X = Access route (perhaps 2-3 blocks wide)

II
O
OL--II
OOOO
OOOOL--II
OOOOOOO
OOOOOXX
OOOOXXX
OOOXXXX---II
OXXXXOOOOO
XXXXOOOOOOL--II
XXXOOOOOOOOOO
XXOOOOOOOOOOOL--II
XOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

I quite like the idea of netherbrick fences and standard brick stairs. Not the stairs used for seats but stairs allowing access to seating. I also hope we can incorporate diamond, gold, and lapis lazuli blocks into VIP boxes. We can still simulate holding pens and I want to incorporate lava dispensers. We could drop lava in a couple places on the arena floor to make it more dangerous. Hopefully the arena floor is not bigger than 2/3 of the total area to give us plenty of space for the walls.

Edit: Maybe we want to reserve fences for mid-level seating. Keep the cheap seats limited to a couple blocks of stone and one cobblestone stair.

After the outline is laid (in dirt, like TC proposed) we focus on construction from the inside out. I'd also like to see a sample segment of the seating in game. ASCII art doesn't hold much beauty for me. I would like to have three classes of seating.

[rajpoot]

I also hope we can incorporate diamond

If you have excess diamond, I'll happily take it off your hands

[Vladimir]

If you have excess diamond, I'll happily take it off your hands

When I think VIP I mean VIP.

[TinCow]

After the outline is laid (in dirt, like TC proposed) we focus on construction from the inside out. I'd also like to see a sample segment of the seating in game. ASCII art doesn't hold much beauty for me. I would like to have three classes of seating.

I put down an outline (one block high) of the outer wall in stone last night, after marking the pertinent points with dirt columns. The dirt column near the workshop is the exact center.

I can do a mock-up of a section of seating without any problems as well, though I wont have time to do it tonight.

One issue we'll have to deal with is that the square nature of the blocks may make it some of the seating tiers a bit odd looking in spots, depending on how the concentric circles are drawn.

[rajpoot]

It will look a little odd in every place where blocks are arranged diagonally.
I don't think there's any way to prevent this from happening though because no matter how large a circle is made, there will always be blocks arranged in a diagonal fashion.

IMO we do the seating for one part...say a fourth of the arena, all the way to the top level. If it looks very odd we can think of something else.

Or we can simply abandon the 'seating with stairs' plan, and make it out of simple blocks/half blocks.

[TinCow]

IMO we do the seating for one part...say a fourth of the arena, all the way to the top level. If it looks very odd we can think of something else.

Well, in order to do that we'll need to put up at least part of the exterior wall first. With the outline already in place, that should be a project anyone can work on. Just keep stacking stone (not cobblestone) vertically to y = 110. That's enough for the proposed seating style without going overboard. Exterior designs and such can be added later, for now we can just get a vertical wall built.

[Vladimir]

Don't worry about looks. This is going to look great!

The more outlines the better. Building up the exterior wall section will give us a better idea of the resources we'll need. Once that's done we'll just build up a line of seating and go from there.

I'm most worried about coal/charcoal for the furnaces. I can't wait to see the outer line.

Edit: Maybe we could use a freight rail system with powered minecarts. Never seen one in the wild.

1.1 Changelog

http://mojang.com/2012/01/12/minecraft-1-1-update/

[rajpoot]

Right my client updated. And I can't join the server until it's been updated.

[TinCow]

You'll either have to revert to 1.0.0 or wait a while then. I have a work thing to go to this evening and won't be home until late tonight to upgrade the server.