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  1. #1
    Senior Member Senior Member Fisherking's Avatar
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings II

    The marriage went without warning that it was a Matrilineal marriage. I can live with that. It was something that won’t be repeated.

    On the other hand, creating a new title and taking it seems to have cut me out of the first. I don’t understand why.

    If need be I will see if I can give away that second title, though I don’t know that having a vassal of equal rank is such a good plan.

    My next move will be to get my new County of Cathness holding independent and then as a vassalage to me, and that will be complex, no doubt.

    I took a page from you and took Munster. Funny enough, dad was Holey Roman Emperor, via mum of course. And for some reason my younger brother is now in line for that title, but not me.

    I was heir to her Duchy but who knows now.

    One large bone I have to pick with the game though is that there should be 5 kingdoms and no Duchies in Ireland. That was part of the problem with uniting them.

    Still, I don’t understand why I can’t hold Munster and Leinster at the same time.

    If you managed to get the island you must have run into the same problem?


    Education: that which reveals to the wise,
    and conceals from the stupid,
    the vast limits of their knowledge.
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  2. #2
    The Abominable Senior Member Hexxagon Champion Monk's Avatar
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings II

    Quote Originally Posted by Fisherking View Post
    The marriage went without warning that it was a Matrilineal marriage. I can live with that. It was something that won’t be repeated.

    On the other hand, creating a new title and taking it seems to have cut me out of the first. I don’t understand why.

    If need be I will see if I can give away that second title, though I don’t know that having a vassal of equal rank is such a good plan.
    You cannot have a vassal of equal rank, period. A duke is lawfully equal to a duke and, therefore, will not be burdoned to take orders from one. Just like a King would not take orders from a king, or a count take orders from a count. In order to hand out duchies you have to establish yourself as a king, in order to hand out counties, you must be a duke and ect.

    You must be one level higher on the social ladder than the title you wish to grant. If you give someone a title that is equal to your own they will become independent.

    My next move will be to get my new County of Cathness holding independent and then as a vassalage to me, and that will be complex, no doubt.

    I took a page from you and took Munster. Funny enough, dad was Holey Roman Emperor, via mum of course. And for some reason my younger brother is now in line for that title, but not me.
    Sounds like you're running under gravelkind succession. That means all the titles are split up between the children, with the eldest getting 30% of them, and afterward the other siblings get an even share. Your claim to the throne was likely given away to a brother while you got something else. You should change that asap to primo, so that your oldest son inherits everything. Stay away from Seniority unless you want your 80 year old uncle getting the crown over your 5 star 16 year old son.

    edit: it should also be noted that getting someone elected emperor has a funny effect on title inheritance. In my honest opinion I think its a little buggy, but i havent seen its effects enough to say that with confidence. But I've heard stories of people having claims to 4-5 duchies, getting elected emperor, and then losing those claims once their emperor dies.

    One large bone I have to pick with the game though is that there should be 5 kingdoms and no Duchies in Ireland. That was part of the problem with uniting them.

    Still, I don’t understand why I can’t hold Munster and Leinster at the same time.

    If you managed to get the island you must have run into the same problem?
    You can, but people don't like it, to put it simply. You'll have to deal with unhappy nobles who see you hoarding all the titles until you unite the island as a kingdom. When i played Irish the very first thing I did was work to change the succession laws, then tried to build ducal claims on my neighbors with my chancellor. All you'll need to do is claim a single county from them, then you can press further claims that you'll get when you hold half a de juro duchy.
    Last edited by Monk; 02-26-2012 at 23:27.

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    Semi-Corruptible Member White_eyes:D's Avatar
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings II

    Quote Originally Posted by Monk View Post
    edit: it should also be noted that getting someone elected emperor has a funny effect on title inheritance. In my honest opinion I think its a little buggy, but i havent seen its effects enough to say that with confidence. But I've heard stories of people having claims to 4-5 duchies, getting elected emperor, and then losing those claims once their emperor dies.
    I was playing as the emperor of the HRE with Gavelkind inheritance laws(on the Kingdom level) and when my 2nd-gen ruler died some of the titles were passed around to his kids.(Had the 3rd gen-heir Kill his other brothers for their titles...received "kinslayer" from it and had some fun times with that)

    But it seemed to act buggy after that. When my 3rd-gen guy died, it seemed to act kinda like Primogeniture and only the oldest son received everything. While it saved the lives of (most) of his siblings, it was acting buggy with how the bohemian gavelkind law was working and I had to abandoned it.
    Last edited by White_eyes:D; 02-27-2012 at 04:26.

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    The Abominable Senior Member Hexxagon Champion Monk's Avatar
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings II

    So there's been some wondering about how strong the Byzantines are in this game, and empires in general for that matter. A lot of people on the CK forums are of the belief its impossible for empires to die in the current balance, well...

    I had to post this, ladies and gentlemen I give you the death of the Byzantine blob:



    Through a combination of internal pressure and cultural tension the Byzantine empire has imploded into a colorful sea of successor states, each one vying with the other for the right to call themselves the heir to the Roman legacy. I have double checked by selecting the Byzantines and looking at their stats. Down to having only 3 vassals and a pitiful 1000 men out of a possible 6000 strong army, the emperor is in DIRE straights. Constantinople is on the verge of falling to siege.

    This has COMPLETELY changed the dynamic of the asia minor political situation. I am almost wishing I picked a nation in that neck of the woods just so I could be there to take advantage. Alas, my own kingdom needs my attentions.

  5. #5
    The Abominable Senior Member Hexxagon Champion Monk's Avatar
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings II

    Quote Originally Posted by Gelatinous Cube View Post
    Wow that looks really good. I heard they used the same engine in Sengoku, which is just a beautiful game compared to most titles of the genre. Payday soon! You bet this is on the to-buy list.
    It really is. I said it before but I think it's worth saying: this game is in my contention for best paradox/grand strategy of all time. Its just that good. I'm really wondering what I missed by not playing the first game and cannot wait for more patches to come for CKII.

    I also realize the irony in me posting (initially) to collect other users thoughts, and then ending up the biggest contributor to this thread. I'll try not to post here as much but I did want to offer a few tips to people who have the game but are struggling a bit. I wouldn't call myself an expert but I'm approaching the 200 year mark in my castille game, so that's something at least!

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    1. Make sure your council is always hard at work. What they do is really up to you but there's two things you ALWAYS want to be doing. First, tell your spymaster to uncover plots in your capital. You have a base chance to always discover plots whether your spymaster is actively counter spying or not, but doing this boosts that chance significantly. If you discover a plot in its infancy and the character who is the mastermind likes you enough, you have a chance to resolve the situation peacefully. If you dont discover it in time it usually leads to a civil war.

    Secondly, always, ALWAYS tell your court chaplain to build relations in Rome. Excommunication is the single most powerful tool you can use against your fellow catholics, but you cannot get excommunicated if the Pope likes you. Avoiding getting excommed should be near the top of your priority list

    2. Wars are the best way to lose useful characters - never think that this game is like EU3 where characters hardly ever die when in battle. Sieges are bloody, and if you attack a province dealing with an outbreak of a disease it can quickly turn into an absolute mess. This is a bit gamey, but in my opinion you should always tell your king to stay at home (unless you're caught up in roleplaying and want to be the warrior king on the front lines)

    Raise your crown authority to anything above Low, that way you can manually assign the leaders of your armies. Give command of the army to people who are either low on the totem pole (courtiers, barons, ect) or Dukes who hate you. You shouldn't have any shortage of people who have at least decent martial stats, so don't worry about that. What you cannot risk is losing your supporters even if you're fighting for your life against a foreign invader. There's no point in winning a war if you lose your most trusted advisers - this is how civil wars start!

    3. Always keep an eye on who your vassals are allied with in the allies tab. The natural reaction when seeing your vassal is allied to a lot of your other vassals might be to think nothing of it. Actually, this is the worst possible situation you can ever be in. A vassal who has built a strong web of inner-realm alliances is a far bigger threat than any blob on the map. If he rebels, he's going to bring all those allies against you (unless they like you more).

    Inner realm politics is like a constant cold war. You want to limit the personal power of your vassals while maintaining a strong base from which to fight. To that end you should always keep a dimense size of at least 50% your limit if not more. Even if everyone in your realm likes you, all it takes is a bad succession to find yourself fighting for your son's survival against men who his father thought as his best friends. Opinions are fickle, a strong personal army last forever.

    It's also a VERY bad idea to give any Duke more than one duchy. From time to time they will get the "desires Duchy X" ambition for themselves, which serves as a negative to their opinion to you. My first natural inclination was to just give them what they wanted, and while this will satisfy them for about a decade, its not long before they start getting too big for their boots and they try to take on the crown for independence. Remember, its all about balance.

    4. Keep an eye on the culture of the tutors your children get sent to. Children who grow up with an Irish duke, for example, will take on his culture. Lets say you're playing as France and your wife is Irish so you let her tutor them. Sounds good right? Unfortunately, your children will take on her culture and when they take over your realm, your vassals will hate them because they view them as a foreigner. Always, always send your children to nobles who have the correct culture to be tutored.

    On that same note: when choosing a tutor for a child think about what you want your child to become. The card furthest left in a characters traits will tell you what kind of person that character is. You'll see things like "brilliant strategist" "midas touched" ect. Personally, I like to send heirs to get tutored by those with high bonuses to Stewardship and Diplomacy, this will give you a boost to income and relations respectively. I tend to send the second or third sons to get better martial training as I like them leading my armies. With any luck they will die in glorious battle and not even think about contesting the throne when their brother takes over

    5. When you take over a new province sometimes all of the vassals who used to serve there get thrown out. Unless you want to control every single holding in a province (making your demesne unmanagably large) you'll need to assign new vassals to those holdings. Dont worry, the game actually rewards you for this since you get more income from cities if a mayor rules them than if a feudal lord (you) does. To create new vassals, bring up the province menu and right click on one of the buildings there. If you can make a new vassal, the "create new vassal" button will not be greyed out.

    6. Finally, dont forget to check the "include all lower titles" checkbox when you're handing out landed titles. This will ensure that when you give out a county, all the vassals of that county will go with it. If I want my brother to control county X, then naturally, i want him to be the lord of all the vassals there. If i forget to click that, then while he'll have the title of "count of X", i'll still control most of the vassals who live there. In short this simply allows more power to the people who hold titles in your lands. Some people dont do this and actually limit the power of those beneath them.

    Honestly i've seen good arguments on both sides, but I tend toward stronger servants. It makes management less of a headache.


    I've learned all of these lessons the hard way. Here's hoping you guys don't have to suffer like I did.
    Last edited by Monk; 02-28-2012 at 16:02.

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  6. #6
    COYATOYPIKC Senior Member Flatout Minigame Champion Arjos's Avatar
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings II

    Well this is what that pause in the GoT forum game did to us :D

    Thank you Monk (and lots of other people) for the heads up, got the game few days ago and forged an Hauteville empire from Mauretania to the Nile ^^
    Having some lag lately though and I'm trying to sort that out :S

    It's a very enjoyable game I must say!

    BTW about the dukes, wait to see all your vassals fighting eachother for claims lol
    They are still loyal at least...
    Duchies are fine to grant on different families, but keep crowns for yourself, gave one to my son and my possessions split, ungrateful youth!

  7. #7
    Member Member Greyblades's Avatar
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings II

    Tell me about it, playing as england, try to conquer Wales and Ireland before one of them gets it in thier head to become king, its a real pain having the duke of glamorgan repeatedly plotting to take one of my crowns.
    Being better than the worst does not inherently make you good. But being better than the rest lets you brag.


    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    Don't be scared that you don't freak out. Be scared when you don't care about freaking out
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

  8. #8
    One of the Undutchables Member The Stranger's Avatar
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings II

    Quote Originally Posted by Monk View Post
    So there's been some wondering about how strong the Byzantines are in this game, and empires in general for that matter. A lot of people on the CK forums are of the belief its impossible for empires to die in the current balance, well...

    I had to post this, ladies and gentlemen I give you the death of the Byzantine blob:



    Through a combination of internal pressure and cultural tension the Byzantine empire has imploded into a colorful sea of successor states, each one vying with the other for the right to call themselves the heir to the Roman legacy. I have double checked by selecting the Byzantines and looking at their stats. Down to having only 3 vassals and a pitiful 1000 men out of a possible 6000 strong army, the emperor is in DIRE straights. Constantinople is on the verge of falling to siege.

    This has COMPLETELY changed the dynamic of the asia minor political situation. I am almost wishing I picked a nation in that neck of the woods just so I could be there to take advantage. Alas, my own kingdom needs my attentions.
    funny this is the complete opposite of my game. im now in 1170 and i started in 1066. the byzantines are the most powerful nation in the world having complete control of the balkans, minor asia up to the caucasus and the lower part of the boot of italy.

    We do not sow.

  9. #9
    One of the Undutchables Member The Stranger's Avatar
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    Default Re: Crusader Kings II

    Quote Originally Posted by Monk View Post
    You cannot have a vassal of equal rank, period. A duke is lawfully equal to a duke and, therefore, will not be burdoned to take orders from one. Just like a King would not take orders from a king, or a count take orders from a count. In order to hand out duchies you have to establish yourself as a king, in order to hand out counties, you must be a duke and ect.

    You must be one level higher on the social ladder than the title you wish to grant. If you give someone a title that is equal to your own they will become independent.



    Sounds like you're running under gravelkind succession. That means all the titles are split up between the children, with the eldest getting 30% of them, and afterward the other siblings get an even share. Your claim to the throne was likely given away to a brother while you got something else. You should change that asap to primo, so that your oldest son inherits everything. Stay away from Seniority unless you want your 80 year old uncle getting the crown over your 5 star 16 year old son.

    edit: it should also be noted that getting someone elected emperor has a funny effect on title inheritance. In my honest opinion I think its a little buggy, but i havent seen its effects enough to say that with confidence. But I've heard stories of people having claims to 4-5 duchies, getting elected emperor, and then losing those claims once their emperor dies.



    You can, but people don't like it, to put it simply. You'll have to deal with unhappy nobles who see you hoarding all the titles until you unite the island as a kingdom. When i played Irish the very first thing I did was work to change the succession laws, then tried to build ducal claims on my neighbors with my chancellor. All you'll need to do is claim a single county from them, then you can press further claims that you'll get when you hold half a de juro duchy.
    i united ireland in 50 years (3 generations), 50 years later now and i am king of france and ireland XD

    it is not too hard to be honest. just take one of the dukes and you should be fine. ursurp all the counts and then you will be able to create the title of king. from there just offer vassalisation to what is left over. they will readily accept, atleast in my case :P


    the game is awesome imo but i agree with frogg that it needs more or more complex ambitions and plots. most of the time i can only choose to kill my wife as an ambition and i havent really had any particularly complex or interesting plots. thats the only thing sofar which really dissapointed me. as well as the absence of a quickload button :S now i have to resign and then load from the single player menu again. and every 5 times the game will freeze, tho i am quite sure that is a problem of steam... (i hate steam).
    Last edited by The Stranger; 03-02-2012 at 00:39.

    We do not sow.

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