Crusader Kings II

[Chaotix]

If you have The Old Gods, the new tech system relies on Duchies to generate tech points. Basically, if a county isn't organized into a Duchy, it won't get any more advanced without sending the spymaster to steal tech from someone else.

So, if you can at all afford to do so, it is a good idea to create vassal duchies. Kings are entirely optional, and I tend to go without them, but some people prefer them for organizational purposes. In the end, you're going to have a civil war one way or the other--the plus is that you get to choose what it will look like well in advance.

Without the Old Gods, the biggest reason to create duchies is vassal management. Yes, Counts are easy to control, but what can they do? In a civil war they'll get annexed by your neighbors. With High Crown Authority or lower, where vassals can still wage war, counts aren't going to get you very much new land. The only plus is easy squashing during times of rebelliousness (like during the early reign of a bad king).

Good call on both the tech and annexed rebels, I forgot these points myself during my explanation.

Civil wars are almost impossible to avoid, but with high diplomacy you can usually prevent them from being too terrible. Being able to choose your heir with Elective (as in the HRE) is also a good way to ensure a smooth succession.

[Myth]

I have all the DLCs, I know that the tech system was different before (you could only favour which tech to get). I didn't know that Duchies mattered however. Inspired by these here posts, I started a game as the Jarl of Oppland (I think. The one who has modern day Denmark's capital). My life was all fun and games. First, the sons of Lodbrok asked who's face I would like to smash. I chose the Anglo-Saxon kingdom between Scotland and Wessex (so between Scotland and what appears to be London, Oxford, Winchester etc.) They died handily. Then I returned and told my neighbour to the east that I'm forming the Kindom of Denmark. It took some axe-to-the-face persuasion, but in the end he saw things my way.

Now a Kingdom, i raised Crown Authority to the paltry next-to-lowest state which I'm allowed and went to Ivar the Bonless's spineless son and informed him that from this day onward, Jorvik is part of the Kingdom of Denmark. A short debate involving axes and faces later, he too saw things my way.

Then I began playing "just the tip" with Wessex, chomping at their counties one at a time. They got the big idea of starting a holy war or two against me and failed miserably. Scotland also tried a holy war. Once.

Meanwhile i had some news shoved into my face, because I play CK2 on the highest speed setting usually, and normally have the political awareness of a potato. It turned out Sweden had formed, and for some reason we had East Fancia as a grey blob encompassing what I would call the height of the HRE's achievements - Capua to the south, my very borders to the north, a border with France and Lotharingia to the west (lotharingia was then promptly eaten by West Francia Grey Holly Roman Wannabee). To the east the Cumans and (surprise) my own Bulgarian Kingdom were having a hayday and the Basileos of the ERE was mainly preoccupied with not dying with his head impaled on a Bulgarian, Cuman or Arab spear. Strange, since someone reported that the ERE has a CB on everyone and anyone and it tends to blob like crazy with the Old Gods on.

So, anyway, It took some executins and encouragement to go join the Varangian guard to kill of all but one of my sons (pity the good one died young). I've been able to successfully emulate primageniture with Denmark this way. But I'm having trouble with the dukedoms of Jorvik and Pomerania, because thier leaders are always fighting someone within my borders. And that Pomeraninan bastard switched to Christianity and now half the time he is leading a faction to rebel against me. It also appears that I can't revoke a Ducal title without good reason.

I have two questions about this: do i absolutely have to form ducal titles? I can create 11 I think. I can also create the Kingdom of England and the Kingdom of Pomerania. Do I need to do so? How will Ducal titles benefit my technology? I've been stealing tech for 100 years already and I've slowly gotten pretty advanced.

I took a look at this whole "reforming the Norse faith" thing, but since I don't have the holy sites i can't do it yet. So I just subjugated Pomerania instead (hence the issues i mentioned above). And just as Sweden had fractured after an abysmal succession crisis and I eyed them and my good friend Fairhair's Ostlandet, suddenly, out of nowhere, East Francia started spamming Holy Wars at me. 20k stacks coming at me and that attrition bonus ain't what it used to be apparently. Now I have to huddle and wait for them in a province with rivers just to have a fighting chance. That, or spare 1000 gold in assassinations to get rid of their King. But I want to have a more permanent solution for them. Any suggestions? I'd take the usual subtle axe-to-the-face approach but they have more faces (and more axes) than myself, and they are mostly landlocked so I can't go all boats and scallywags on them.

Also, apparently I can call invasions and I didn't make use of this mechanic yet apart from the Lodbrok event. Would that help me do it?

[komnenos]

So now I want to ask you about your best record. What's your highest score in this game(without any cheating!)?

[Chaotix]

So now I want to ask you about your best record. What's your highest score in this game(without any cheating!)?

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Not an exact answer, but I'm pretty sure that's my best. I stopped playing after that screenshot.

174,000 + 8,000 combined Prestige/Piety of my current ruler makes ~182,000.

[Beskar]

I have deleted mine, but it was the same as Chaotix but I owned Hungary, Poland and HRE too.

[Monk]

Something around 60,000 in my Di Cannosa, Italy game. If i went all out on a conquer/assassination spree i might've gotten twice as high but I enjoy the game most when i play mods or house rules that put that kind of behavior in check.

[Chaotix]

Something around 60,000 in my Di Cannosa, Italy game. If i went all out on a conquer/assassination spree i might've gotten twice as high but I enjoy the game most when i play mods or house rules that put that kind of behavior in check.

I generally don't use too many assassinations myself.

I almost never use the hired assassins, as they are unreliable and often far too expensive for the kinds of people I need to kill.

Plot assassinations I have no qualms about, but I only tend to use them as revenge on people who have plot-killed my own family members, and even then only if they're in a place where I can't reach them with the law.

Conquering, well, I tend to do a lot of that. I avoid the invite-claimant exploit, but I'm not afraid to holy war-spam or use any of the other casus belli, except maybe invasion when playing as muslims. If anything, the new trucebreaking penalties have slowed me down considerably, otherwise I would be breaking truces with an infidel fairly often. Now I don't think I've done it since. Especially with that Roman Empire game; it's hard to throw away half your prestige all on a single duchy, especially when you're making giant-empire level prestige.

[Hooahguy]

Well, my wife was assassinated, leaving my heir as the new Emperor of the HRE. A few years later I also died.

Now I am the ruler of a huge chunk of Europe. I had to put down a huge revolt by my younger brother who was king of England and I had him executed afterwards. Didnt think that through, I thought since my brother rebelled I could get away with no penalty. Guess not.

[Chaotix]

Well, my wife was assassinated, leaving my heir as the new Emperor of the HRE. A few years later I also died.

Now I am the ruler of a huge chunk of Europe. I had to put down a huge revolt by my younger brother who was king of England and I had him executed afterwards. Didnt think that through, I thought since my brother rebelled I could get away with no penalty. Guess not.

Oooh, Kinslayer.

Now that's a trait that people will hate you for for the rest of your life. Be prepared for a rough 20 years or so, and never let your guard down.

Yeah, always better to just throw them in the oubliette than execute.

[Hooahguy]

Oooh, Kinslayer.

Now that's a trait that people will hate you for for the rest of your life. Be prepared for a rough 20 years or so, and never let your guard down.

Yeah, always better to just throw them in the oubliette than execute.

I figured that since he led a huge rebellion I could get away with it, but apparently blood ties are stronger than treason.

[Chaotix]

I figured that since he led a huge rebellion I could get away with it, but apparently blood ties are stronger than treason.

Indeed.

"Kill me and be cursed. You are no king of mine!"
-Rickard Karstark, just before Robb Stark chopped his head off.

[Monk]

Soooo this happened.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

The Byzantines were marching home going across my border when I realized a few things.

1. they were divided.
2. I had a HUGE amount of free troops from the "form Hungary" decision
3. Even with the Byzantine forces numbering at 50k men (30k more than me).. I could take Constantinople with a fraction of that with a dedicated assault.

I declared an invasion and utterly wiped out the Byzantine army as they were marching to quell a peasant uprising. The war plan was pretty simple: Destroy the enemy with overwhelming force before they can mobalize a response. Within a few years I'd completely decimated the standing forces of the Byzantine Emperor and captured the capital city.

20k Hungarians vs 50k Byzantines. They never had a chance.

I am tempted to mod a titular emperor title in just for this occasion.

[Ibn-Khaldun]

When exactly do the Aztecs appear? I bought the Sunset Invasion DLC and would like to play as them or against them. Was it around 1200-1220 ??

[rickinator9]

So now I want to ask you about your best record. What's your highest score in this game(without any cheating!)?

The El Cid Game. While not all my doing, it was certainly an achievement to keep that shit together.

[Monk]

When exactly do the Aztecs appear? I bought the Sunset Invasion DLC and would like to play as them or against them. Was it around 1200-1220 ??

They can start appearing in 1250 and will not appear after 1350. The Aztecs also have a much higher chance of not spawning than the Mongols do, due to their alternate history inspiration.

[rickinator9]

I started a game as the 867 count of Holland. Those viking overlords sure like to revoke my titles!

Edit: Had some success putting allies and sons on counties. I have been encountering this glitch though. Anyone else?

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[Chaotix]

I started a game as the 867 count of Holland. Those viking overlords sure like to revoke my titles!

Edit: Had some success putting allies and sons on counties. I have been encountering this glitch though. Anyone else?

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Yes, it's a known bug. The new beta patch fixes it.

It actually does not change gameplay, though. It says the penalty is for being a lover, but it is really just the different religion penalty, with the incorrect display text.

[Hooahguy]

Pretty awesome story of revenge, from the CKII subreddit.

But now the rains weep o'er his hall,
with no one there to hear....

[komnenos]

Have they added new events or decisions for other pagan religions (except norse) in the recent patch?

[Myth]

I've began watching I, CLAUDIUS (the whole series is on youtube). I've decided to start an ERE game with a designed ruler named Caluduis, who will have to be lame, who stutters and if I can find an appropriate representing trait - to have head jerking. He should also be a genius and a scholar. This should be good.

[naut]

I guess this belongs here with Scottish Germany and Hungarian Byzantium.

I'm not entirely sure how the Pechengs got a casus belli on Bohemia in the first place =/ =3

Bonus pic:

Most recent game and the state of play in Italy. Also I guess my MO is pretty obvious now, lol, I enjoy using the Ruler Designer to make OP rulers in hard starting positions. My first playthrough I got Holy Warred by the Byz. This time they imploded and and only just regrouped, meanwhile Orthodox Benvento buffered me from the various Catholic Kingdoms that have ruled Northern Italy. I'm really satisfied by Italy's deterioration into City States and minor Lords. =)

[Chaotix]

What mod are you playing there?

I've noticed the Bulgarian Empire and Jewish religion... can't be vanilla!

[rickinator9]

Project Balance, probably.

[naut]

Currently PB + VIET.

Recommend both, PB for previously stated reasons and VIET for enhancing the base game-play and making character portraits more varied, more interesting and less ugly (hehe, not that much of an issue, but I love the sweet white Rabbi beard my Cohen dynasty is rocking, and it's nice that all of Europe doesn't look like they're trying to suck eggs through straws anymore.).

[komnenos]

Who knows what will be their next project for CK2? May they start developing another expansion for it for future?

[Chaotix]

Who knows what will be their next project for CK2? May they start developing another expansion for it for future?

Probably not, I'd say. After the end of the CKII timeframe is when their new game, EUIV, begins. However, it is speculated that with the release of EUIV there will be a DLC that you can use to convert your finished CKII game into an EUIV game and start from there.

As for the next big expansion DLC... I am predicting playable Holy Orders. Or perhaps bishops/theocracies in general. But I find it more likely that they'd come up with a mechanic for a player to control a Holy Order as a tool of the crusades, perhaps giving up land to secular rulers of their religion after they have won it from the infidels. It would certainly bring the emphasis of Crusader Kings back onto the Crusades, anyway.

[komnenos]

It would be so amazing. I hope so!

[Monk]

As for the next big expansion DLC... I am predicting playable Holy Orders. Or perhaps bishops/theocracies in general. But I find it more likely that they'd come up with a mechanic for a player to control a Holy Order as a tool of the crusades, perhaps giving up land to secular rulers of their religion after they have won it from the infidels. It would certainly bring the emphasis of Crusader Kings back onto the Crusades, anyway.

This is one of the biggest pieces missing from the crusades, currently. Right now if you want to give land to holy orders that are above a count tier they will automatically become independent. You have to use console trickery to get them back to being a vassal. If there was a system in place that allowed greater interaction with holy orders (And mercenaries in general!) that would be a worthy addition to the game.

[Visor]

Picked up Old Gods and a bunch of CK2 DLC. Was not disappointed.

Played as Alfred of Wessex (an Earl under Aethelred (his brother?)) plotted to assassinate him, suceeded, then branched out to take Welsh territories, eventually won a Holy War on the Norfolk vikings. Then started taking more land from Wales and the vikings who had split off from the main host. Took part of Mercia (who was still alive), then formed the Kingdom of England, invited Mercia, they accepted, took part of Scotland, Isle of man etc. Then Alfred I the Just died, and his son Alfred II who was still a child (as the first and second sons had both died, but the first son had a child so he was in line first). Unfortunately, a lot of the english nobles though that Prince Ceorl was a much better candidate to rule, so I was deposed, but I wasn't going to stand for that. I plotted to assassinate him, and started a faction to get myself back the kingship. He died, a queen became the ruler, and I gave her an ultimatum. She declined and everyone joined me as we crushed the resistance and installed the rightful king Alfred II as ruler. He then proceeded to destroy some more vikings and is considering an invasion of Ireland at some stage to form the empire.

[Myth]

I decided to try some Muslim goodness last night. Started at the Old Gods start date with Egypt. Do you guys know if I can become the Caliph of Sunni Islam? Do I have to take out the current Caliphate? I started crawling towards Mecca but one province at a time followed by a long truce period is so slow...

On the other hand the Mamluks make me by far the most lethal Muslim nation (apart from the invadin Seljuks but the ERE seems to be doing pretty well, raising stacks of 35 thousand troops).

How can Muslims take over entire De Jure Kingdoms (I saw this discussed a number of times).