First Impressions?

[Graphic]

Its unlocked on Steam. Got my key from Sega.

What do you think?


My random thoughts and impressions:

- Engrish bad

- Everything else good

- Campaign map is larger...not just because it has new islands but, for example, the main island is noticeably thicker. I also like the toned down mountains, in hindsight Shogun 2's map felt pretty constrictive.

- 40 UNIT BATTLES WHAAAAAT!?

- It's pretty hard.

[SalmonSoil]

I tried to expand at my normal rate but oh god modernization + anti-imperial resentment and now all of my neighbors are at war with me. It seems like neighbors will switch allegiance before attacking you, both Tosa and Hiroshima have done this to me (I am Choshu), as well a Tsukumi or whatever that faction to the west of Bizen is.

Also naval bombardments rock.

[cr2]

Gatling guns, awesome, came in handy when I was faced with an enemy army x2. I also like the option that you can now beat the campaign with allies as opposed to having to be at war with absolutely everyone. I was slow to build my navy at first and paid the price in enemy ship bombardments.

[Grin]

So far I'm very impressed. The balance between traditional and modern units feels good. I was concerned that the traditional units would be more rapidly overwhelmed. Every unit seems to have it's place, even if like the other campaigns it's difficult to justify expensive niche units, particularly as you modernize and get more powerful line units.

And God bless the return of functional battlefield artillery.

[Veho Nex]

Man, Im rollin scrubs so hard in MP. So far 11-1 in ranked battles where my only loss was because of a bad map where the enemy could shoot my guys and i couldn't shoot back.

Love the battles, so atmospheric. It's by far my favorite total war since Rome was released.

[Graphic]

Going out on a limb and calling this track from the game one of the best thing Jeff van Dyck has made:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

It reminds me of the depressing and empty (yet beautiful) tracks from Civ V after reaching the modern period. This makes me giggle when imagining how goosbumpingly beautiful Jeff van Dyck's soundtrack for an ACW:TW would be.

[Sp4]

Oh teh smoke everywhere o\

Also, why did they have to do away with the Japanese language and make everyone speak really accented Engrish?

Also.. Gatring guns at ze ready.


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A bit deeper first impression...

Stuff dies way too fast =p

Lack of tutorial for the new navies, or lack of tutorial in general is pretty lame for what used to be the price of a new game but I guess, in this modern age, 30 quid for an expansion is normal.
Several annoying sound bugs and an unecessary battle announcer who talks bullshit half the time anyways, but hey, this is Total War, so we're kinda used to laughing at advisors/announcers.
Campaign map feels empty... really empty. I kinda miss the busy campaign map from RTW or M2TW, where there were carts and ships all over the place but that carried over from S2 I suppose.

Hmmm... I shall post some more, as I play some more =p

[andrewt]

They have Shogun 1 style Japanese-accented Engrish? Awesome!

[Sp4]

Why did a certain recent patch (trololol) enable you to queue up arts in Shogun 2, yet the same does not work for Fall of the Samurai?

[Marshall Louis-Nicolas Davout]

Has anyone noticed that was the same in Medieval 2? The voice over was for the other foregin factions, I must agree on one thing,the campagin, while I have nothing against the Game itself, does feel a bit empty.

And this voiceover for the japanese english is not good. No, retain original japanese.

[Voigtkampf]

Personally, I would prefer the speeches in the game to be less ridiculous. Shamefuru dispaay and all that crap, leave that at home, or for a parody. Oh, and during the last siege the US foreign adviser with that heavy southern accent actually hurt my ears. What the hell, is that necessary? are you trying to annoy us?

I love Empire and the specific languages, I want to hear my Prussian troops speak German, the French troops are supposed to speak French, not "engrish" with horribiru accent-O!

[frogbeastegg]

My opinion on FotS is pretty mixed. There's some bits I like, some I don't, and a lot I'm withholding judgement on until I'm less of a newbie. Some of this feedback applies to Shogun 2 as well, as yesterday's patch back-ported a lot of the UI and AI changes.

The good.

• Lots of UI tweaks, most of which are beneficial. I particularly like having tooltips on the building browser, saves me a lot of time when planning my development.
• The UI artwork is nicely done, very atmospheric.
• More music, and every bit as excellent as the music from S2 and RotS. It fits in very well.
• Unit movement is slower, about the same sort of speed I modded them to in S2. Happy days.
• I've been playing the historical battles a bit, and they're pretty enjoyable. Normally I don't care for them much. The first in the series is a real eye-opener on the power of artillery in FotS.
• AI turns cycle much faster, I'd say around twice as fast.
• Fleshed out diplomacy info is nice.
• Economy on hard is very tight. Not much money to go around in the early days.
• No more trade nodes!
• The encyclopaedia seems more responsive. No 3 second pause between page changes, and pages scroll faster.
• Opening movie sets the scene nicely for the campaign.
• Strong newbie support: there's a comprehensive series of video tutorials. I watched a couple out of curiosity and they're great for people new to the series. I recommend newbies take the time to watch them.

The bad.

• I loathe, detest, and despise the new battle announcer's voice with the fire of a thousand burning suns. No, that's not an exaggeration.
• Naval battles. I've done a few. I guess they're a bit better. I still don't care for them. Slow, limited, boring, unless you really like cannons going bang.
• Much more resource intensive on my PC. I had to spend a few hours tweaking settings before I could get it running smoothly. The large quantities of smoke are a particular frame rate killer.
• I've seen a few bizarre AI moves, including a naval battle where it sat there and never moved.
• Glitches. I've seen a bunch of graphical glitches, from diplomatic avatars with an ... unfortunate crotch, to armies sitting down on invisible seats. I had a pair of units get stuck in the ground and refuse to move during a battle. One of my trade treaties vanished into thin air; I was not notified that it had been broken, and could not locate any gameplay reason for it breaking. Steam's taken away an achievement I did earn (requiem for the dead) and replaced it with one I never will (a MP avatar one).
• Now I can understand what my units are saying, I wish they'd be quiet. Endless choruses of "The enemy is in sight!" and "Hold steady!", unit after unit saying the same limited phrases every 30 seconds or so. I much preferred it when they spoke Japanese, and spoke less often.
• New character growth trees. Gain 1 point per level, and all abilities cost 1 point to max out. That means you are always gaining something new, rather than pumping up an existing ability.
• Load times are improved according to the patch notes. It doesn't feel like it. Rather the opposite.

Withholding judgement:

• The tech tree. It's segmented according to your development, which makes it harder to use a deep/focused style of research. They may or may not be too restrictive, will have to play on and see.
• Difficulty. Either hard mode lives up to its name (hurrah!), or it will get easier when I have some clue as to what I'm doing. Time will tell. Despite a few questionable moves by the AI, the game does have challenge and appears smart, same as S2.
• Gun battles. Guns are not my cup of military tea, and I haven't had chance to explore many tactical options yet. So far it's not exactly edifying.
• Artillery. I am scoring scary kill-counts with entry-level cannon. I hate to think how devastating the later guns will be, and fear that such strong artillery will make battles less exciting in the long run.
• Zones of control for armies and navies. Now that the map is bigger, the zones of control around each army/navy feel a bit on the small side. It's too easy for the enemy to bypass you.
• Happiness. Lots of happiness penalties as you modernise, not so many ways to counter. Not sure what the eventual balance will be. Could be good, could be tiresome to deal with.

So, in summary, mainly a case of liking the refinements, hating the voice-overs, having some tech problems, and needing to play the game a lot more before I can fairly judge the gameplay.

I started with Satsuma on hard. By the time I'd got it running smoothly, I realised I didn't like their clan bonuses much. I quit, and started to mess around with historical and custom battles instead in order to doublecheck performance. Next time, I'll begin a new campaign with a different clan.

Why did a certain recent patch (trololol) enable you to queue up arts in Shogun 2, yet the same does not work for Fall of the Samurai?

Queuing techs works for me, provided I stay within the unlocked tech tiers.

[Graphic]

Stuff dies way too fast =p

In this case it's historically accurate, even if it was by accident. When you combine Napoleonic tactics with rifles and accurate artillery, you get devastating attrition rates. The Battle of Antietam is still the bloodiest day in American military history.

[easytarget]

I'm a bit lost on how the tech tree works now. Could someone give me the short paragraph on what changed. Right now I appear to be stuck researching both trees to get to the next branch, surely that's not how this works and I'm missing a trick here.

[Veho Nex]

I'm a bit lost on how the tech tree works now. Could someone give me the short paragraph on what changed. Right now I appear to be stuck researching both trees to get to the next branch, surely that's not how this works and I'm missing a trick here.

There are buildings that can be built that increase your modernization. If you just want to focus the military side you will have to plan your production to make up for the lost modernization on the civil side.

[Sp4]

In this case it's historically accurate, even if it was by accident. When you combine Napoleonic tactics with rifles and accurate artillery, you get devastating attrition rates. The Battle of Antietam is still the bloodiest day in American military history.

But le boring =O

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Has anyone noticed how the marching sound (the sound of the steps) for just about any unit is completely out of pace?

[easytarget]

There are buildings that can be built that increase your modernization. If you just want to focus the military side you will have to plan your production to make up for the lost modernization on the civil side.

I usually focus on the other side, and for whatever reason the game I just re-started let me get to 2nd level of the tree w/o forcing me to do military development first, so I'm guessing upgrading the cities or something else must of allowed it.

Like I said, need someone to come along and explain what's up with economy now. W/O trade nodes to spam, got to get a handle on what are the new keys to running economy. I mean I know upgrading ports and that side of tech tree, but what else? And is there a road option to improve? Because this map spreads out, and allies box you requiring a long hike many times. Further, it also seems like many of the upgrades are pretty expensive.

[Voigtkampf]

Besides roads and trade nodes disappearing, there is not much difference from before. Suffice to say I don't pay much attention to economy, that thing levels itself out. I'd say the most important thing is establishing as many trade agreements at the very beginning of your campaign and picking out the most profitable trading partner is essential.

Oh, and yes, no roads, but you will get the railroad eventually, which should speed up the troop and agent movements.

What is the deal with the ninja movies and the likes? They seem to be gone now, is there a possibility to turn them back on?

[SalmonSoil]

I have played more of a campaign as Satsuma and feel I can give a proper impression now.

The map is larger and it seems to take ages to move anything anywhere. I think this is meant to be alleviated by railways but if I'm right railways are part of the telegraph chain, which there are none of on Kyushu so being Satsuma kind of sucks. The map itself is really nice with routes between provinces and a different art style making it feel really fresh. I intend to play a clan closer to Hokkaido next campaign to let me play up there. I also like that the value of koku has decreased. At the moment economy is tough but I think its because I don't yet understand what to build. Also monitoring your provinces modernization and happiness can be really tough.

I actually like the increased casualty rates of land battles, makes it feel quite accurate. I too wish the American adviser would shut up. It kind of breaks my immersion unless there happens to be an American foreign veteran in my army. And yes the soldiers should return to Japanese, the only excuse I can take on this issue is that CA couldn't afford Japanese voice actors.

Naval battles are interesting. I like the actual look of the boats. The battles seem very low casualty. I hardly ever seem to lose cannons or crew, however ships still seem to waver quick enough and I've seen a few ships explode/sink. The monotony of cannons is a bit boring but I think mostly due to the fact that I have only had low tech sea battles so far. Torpedo boats should spice things up, and ramming is really fun. Played a multiplayer battle which finished with a game of chicken between our two command boats. I wanted to see what would happen if two boats rammed each others front, but he started veering to the side so we broadsided each other and then I rammed the back of his ship, causing the back half to sink. Basically what I'm trying to say is sea battle can seem boring, but can sometimes be really tense and also cinematic.

[easytarget]

I agree, it takes ages to get around, or at least it feels like it, which is why I asked about roads, I need some way to speed this up besides railroads, which in my opinion are just in the game as a hook you never get to use while it matters because it develops too late or you can't connect it all to where you need to get to. But whatever.

I keep coming back to this thread just to discuss more things as I find them. The latest thing puzzling me, where's the province specialty info? I looked at my own province last night where I had a mine or something, I forget what, and the province tab is now blank showing no specialties?! So, with the fog of war covering it all up rather nicely, is this a game of concentration now where I just have to know by staring at a blank map where stuff I want to grab is located? I must be missing something here, because I can't for the life of me understand why you would take one of the strategic considerations out of the players hands, yet leave it in the game? Because the specializations are still there. You want the player to have more strategic options to consider not fewer, give him or her the info and let them decide what to prioritize in the battle plans of their campaign. I regularly in S2 and ROTS consider what's available to be developed in making my decisions on what to attack next.

In short, someone help me make sense of this intensely ugly manure colored map so I can plan my campaign with resources as part of it.

[Grin]

The specialties are still marked on the map, the icons are just really bizarre.

[easytarget]

Yeah, i see they are there, or at least I assumed that's what they were, but I can't make heads or tails out of what they represent.

[Graphic]

"The wealthy invest their wealth to create more wealth. Riches are no longer only taken from the land, but from dark factories and foundries, new ideas given solid form. The workers labour to survive, working to live another day or week. Capital must have its profits to reward the wealthy and invest anew. The peasant may leave the fields, but his new master puts a new foot on his neck."

I love the depressing descriptions of modern technologies. It really makes you feel like Japan is losing her soul.

[easytarget]

There are buildings that can be built that increase your modernization. If you just want to focus the military side you will have to plan your production to make up for the lost modernization on the civil side.

Yep, figured that one out. The new challenge, keeping the peasants happy and down on the farm instead of revolting. Modernization on the shogunate side means I'm stuck wasting units in back provinces much more than I'm accustom to, which of course has recurring costs associated with it I didn't have to deal with in the first two iterations of the game.

Still having a blast figuring it out. Got to say, still don't have a handle on economics either, I'm basically just upgrading stuff to see what happens, same with ports. But that's half the fun.

[Veho Nex]

Yep, figured that one out. The new challenge, keeping the peasants happy and down on the farm instead of revolting. Modernization on the shogunate side means I'm stuck wasting units in back provinces much more than I'm accustom to, which of course has recurring costs associated with it I didn't have to deal with in the first two iterations of the game.

Still having a blast figuring it out. Got to say, still don't have a handle on economics either, I'm basically just upgrading stuff to see what happens, same with ports. But that's half the fun.

What i found as the most effective way, at least during my time playing, is to bring your taxes down as you go higher in modernization. You may look at that and think; "But Veho! If my taxes are down my income is down and I will make no money!", Don't fret though. You will, I guarantee it, make considerably more through your trade ports. I found a ratio of 5 trade for every military to be the best for income and protection. It makes having a massive fleet your most vital aspect. I always found myself with 3-4 defending fleets as well as 6-7 patrolling fleets during war times. The major drawback to this tactic is that you will notice massive drops in income per port hit. You can support several large navies with many ports so constantly keeps your protected.

As for maintaining a land presence you only need maybe 1 or 2 half stacks patrolling the homelands with 1 or 2 full stacks for the attack. After a few wars those stacks will be vetted to a point that you will not worry about much.

[Grin]

Just a few quick things I've noticed.

Levy troops are generally a poor investment. They no longer have a size advantage over regular troops and aren't much cheaper.

Line infantry at least until those unlocked by the modern rifles tech require support from dedicated melee troops.

It doesn't appear possible to 'tech down'. Once you increase your development level you can never revert back.

Replenishment now seems to slowly reduce units experience levels.

Wooden cannons are dumb. Seriously guys, what the crap?

[Graphic]

Wooden cannons are dumb. Seriously guys, what the crap?

Something for Katsumodo roleplayers to use, I suspect.

[Voigtkampf]

Well, the did exist and were actually used a bit in Boshin war, so I guess that - kind of - justifies their introduction in the game.

[easytarget]

Anyone here care to explain what the point is in marriage inside your own clan or children for that matter? None of these events are going to benefit you w/in the time frame of the campaign.

As a result, it would be nice if CA had actually given this some proper thought and addressed it by providing more frequent offers to convert a unit to a general.

Because in my current campaign, if I manage to kill off just a couple folks, I'm going to quickly start turning peasants in leaders of my clan.

[Sp4]

Wtf pathfinding...

I now have to restart the battle of Osaka (historical battle) for the 5th time because my only artillery got stuck inside the town outside of the city, unable to set up or move at all and it is kind of hard to do it without the artilley.

Also units seem to like getting stuck on cover.