Black Egyptians

[The Unbreakable]

Unbreakable, you seem to be under the assumption that we are rejecting all your evidence - we are not. The issue is your interpretation of it.

I'm just wondering because you appear to completely ignore every peer reviewed study that has accompanied my stance, and yet continue to make statements which are completely contrary to what they indicate. Now you are also saying that I might be misinterpreting some of these studies, but as stated you aren't even acknowledging them. I have a hard time believing that anyone can seriously obfuscate the implications of the studies findings that the skeletal remains of these ancient Africans on the African continent having "Negroid" cranial morphologies and tropical limb proportions like the Africans further to the south. What else could these findings possibly implicate if not that the general Egyptian populace was "black"?

You are not applying a critical filter to the evidence, and your continued attempts to paint modern scholars as essentially racist is offensive.

I don't recall labeling anyone "racist". I cited the Oxford Encyclopedia of Ancient Egypt (an authoritative source) who acknowledges not only that based on consistent anthropological data that the ancient Egyptians would be considered "black", but also that early Egyptologist outright refused to even consider that ancient Egypt was a product of black Africans. Instead they viewed ancient Egypt as the product of either Europeans or a mixture Hamites (in-migrating southwest Asians) and blacks. He (Donald Redford) stated that this view was racist (which any logical person IMO should have no problem with agreeing upon) not me.

Hammering past scholars is not edifying, especially given that many of them were clever (not more right) than the current generation.

As stated earlier by two modern scholars cited, past scholars (including the famed Frank Yurco) have been reluctant (to say the least) in acknowledging the fact that ancient Egypt was founded by the black Africans of the ancient Sahara. There always had to be some sort of "unknown" race of people (who weren't black) who were major contributors to the creation of ancient Egypt, according to many of them. Then again there are some scholars who will simply call them "African", yet refuse to examine the evidence which specifies what kind of "Africans" they were. It is according to them "Afrocentric" for anyone to read passages like this from reputed biologist:

Archaeological evidence suggests that the ancient Egyptian Nile Valley was peopled in large part by immigrants from the Sahara and more southern areas, who brought neolithic traits there (Hassan, 1988). Some movement from the Levant is also postulated. Possibly the earliest indigenous African full neolithic tradition (called Saharo-Sudanese or Saharan) is found in the Western (Nubian) Desert of Egypt, near the Sudanese border (Wendorf and Schild, 1980; Hassan, 1988) and is dated to the seventh millinneum BC. Common core cultural traits are noted in the Saharan neolithic and Nile Valley predynastic sites, with some Near Eastern influence in the north (Arkell and Ucko, 1965; Hassan, 1988). Predynastic Egyptian culture is most parsimoniously explained by a fusion of Saharan and Nilotic peoples (Hassan, 1988>. The predynastic cultural sequence of southern Egypt is accepted as leading directly to the dynastic culture.

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Whose findings confirm a Nilotic African basis for the civilizations of the Nile and conclude that these people were black Africans. Why is that? The evidence is not shaky, but sound. As the Nytimes article that I posted had stated, "Our own Western prejudices" (no need in denying that they still exist) are the root of why some refuse to consider ancient Egypt in it's proper black African context. Basil Davidson noted this in his famed documentary:



The continuation of this early Egyptian culture is seen modern day Nilotic peoples of the Upper Nile:

Beyond that, if proponents of a "Black" Egypt wish to be taken seriously they must address those in their camp who make absurd claims about figures like Cleopatra - because not doing so is evidence of sloppy scholarship.

Well firstly who decides if what should be taken seriously, actual scholars or layman interpreters? Last time I checked the Manchester, Cambridge (and all institutes associated with them including Oxford and Fitzwilliam) were as mainstream as academia gets. They all seem to be on board with the clear biological and cultural implications of the origins of ancient Egypt. The only problem seems to come layman interpreters who not wish to accept what is clearly implicated.

This statement is also quite silly, in that it implies that there is some uniform opinion amongst a broad group of people. I am not responsible for some guy in Harlem going around claiming the if Cleopatra was black or not. Rather than attribute such an irrelevant straw man such as that to my argument, why not address what I'm actually putting forward. Interestingly another scholar from Manchester actually seems to suggest that Cleopatra (like her sister) had African (Egyptians) ancestry and was mixed race. Here is her lecture . Also note how she (an actual scholar) laughingly dismisses the negative comments that she received (for showcasing Cleopatra as a mulatto in a discovery channel documentary) on the daily mail website as silly western rubbish.

Now, if you want me to engage with you on a deeper level I am going to need to look up the full bibliographical citations, that will take time.

That's fine, and I would like to offer this for you to read.

The main point though, is that this doesn't really matter all that much, making Egyptians "Black" rather than a mixed people is in no way edifying to black people today, nor does it detract from "white" achievements.

What do any of ancient Africa's civilizations:





Nubia







Mali





On-Nigeria





Loango



Ancient Ghana









(and so forth) have to do with the current state of Africans and Whites? Should they or the accomplishments of these civilizations somehow not be mentioned, because it won't change anything today? Likewise why can't we acknowledge the fact that ancient Egypt was also a black African civilization?

Even if some Egyptians are depicted as "Black" you STILL have to account for all those well known examples, several of which you have posted, which depict a fairer people more in common with modern North Africans, a hard "black£ explanation simply fails to do this.

Who ever denied the presence of non black people in Egypt? What I am stating is that the general native Egyptian populace all the way up until to the New Kingdom was black African, and I think that I have provided more than enough biological evidence and contextualization of this evidence to support my view.