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  1. #1
    Old Town Road Senior Member Strike For The South's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Castration of Boxing

    Quote Originally Posted by Vuk View Post
    Really, then why throughout history have people done it succesfully? It is called conditioning, genius. You need to condition your fists to be able to take heavy impacts on hard objects. There are many sophisticated ways of doing this, but I used to just practice on a concrete wall. Start out slow and light, and build up.
    Bull. People throughout history have not fought in "boxing" style. The skull is unforgiving and will shatter your bare hand. Matches lasted that long because boxers kept their distance and threw safer punches.

    I've punch people in the face, and not broke my hand, and I've been punched in the face by someone who did not break their hand. You will only break your hand if you are an untrained idiot or have exceptionally bad luck. Also, you are not supposed to target the hardest areas of people's skulls!
    You are not a trained boxer. I'm willing to wager you're not a trained fighter at all.
    There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford

    My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.

    I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.

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    Old Town Road Senior Member Strike For The South's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Castration of Boxing

    As has been pointed out, gloves made the sport much more dangerous.
    There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford

    My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.

    I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.

  3. #3
    In the shadows... Member Vuk's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Castration of Boxing

    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    Bull. People throughout history have not fought in "boxing" style. The skull is unforgiving and will shatter your bare hand. Matches lasted that long because boxers kept their distance and threw safer punches.
    People throughout history have punched each other in the face, and done it for sport. The sport of 'boxing' has evolved over the years, and at one time barely resembled what it has degraded to today.
    Shatter your bare hand? Really? Is that why the Romans would use stiff leather thongs to fasten steel or lead plates over their knuckles?
    I dare say that was a lot less forgiven (esp when thrown to an enemies skull), and still, they did not 'shatter' their hands.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kadagar_AV View Post
    In a racial conflict I'd have no problem popping off some negroes.

  4. #4
    Old Town Road Senior Member Strike For The South's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Castration of Boxing

    its grouped with brass knuckles....
    There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford

    My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.

    I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.

  5. #5
    Amphibious Trebuchet Salesman Member Whacker's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Castration of Boxing

    Quote Originally Posted by Vuk View Post
    People throughout history have punched each other in the face, and done it for sport. The sport of 'boxing' has evolved over the years, and at one time barely resembled what it has degraded to today.
    Shatter your bare hand? Really? Is that why the Romans would use stiff leather thongs to fasten steel or lead plates over their knuckles?
    I dare say that was a lot less forgiven (esp when thrown to an enemies skull), and still, they did not 'shatter' their hands.
    Seriously Vuk, come on.

    He didn't use the 100% exact correct phrasing, but anyone who knows anything about fighting will know what he's talking about. Punching someone along most of their skull will most likely break bones in your hand, possibly very badly as in compound fractures, hence STFS saying "shatter".

    Also, about Cent's point of gloves there to protect the boxer's hands. Was your response sarcasm, because that's how I read it... ? If so, then seriously bro? Ever heard of a boxers fracture? That's just one of the more combat injuries. Why do you think all major contact sport fighters wrap the crap out of their hands and then put on gloves beforehand? It's not just western boxing, look at muay thai, kickboxing, MMA in general, pankration, or any other combat sport. When we put on gloves to fight, it's to protect our own hands, not you or your face.

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  6. #6
    In the shadows... Member Vuk's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Castration of Boxing

    Quote Originally Posted by Whacker View Post
    Seriously Vuk, come on.

    He didn't use the 100% exact correct phrasing, but anyone who knows anything about fighting will know what he's talking about. Punching someone along most of their skull will most likely break bones in your hand, possibly very badly as in compound fractures, hence STFS saying "shatter".

    Also, about Cent's point of gloves there to protect the boxer's hands. Was your response sarcasm, because that's how I read it... ? If so, then seriously bro? Ever heard of a boxers fracture? That's just one of the more combat injuries. Why do you think all major contact sport fighters wrap the crap out of their hands and then put on gloves beforehand? It's not just western boxing, look at muay thai, kickboxing, MMA in general, pankration, or any other combat sport. When we put on gloves to fight, it's to protect our own hands, not you or your face.
    I know that you can break your hand by punching someone's skull, but you are not supposed to be punching crown of the skull. If you condition your hands well, you will have no problem punching someone in the chin or nose hard enough to disorient them and possibly knock them out. Of course you punch differently when you don't wear gloves. You don't punch as hard, but you also don't need to.
    Also, yeah, gloves protect your hand, but they also protect your opponent.

    I'll tell you what Wacker, you should try something that my bros experimented with. Find a sparring partner, and one of you use 16 oz boxing gloves, and the other use 4 oz. UFC gloves. See who wins, then switch.
    Then, one of you use just hand wraps, and the other use 4.oz UFC gloves. See who wins.
    When my bros did this, the person with 'less protection' won every time. They didn't need to punch nearly as hard to do as much and more damage, so their punches were quicker and more abbreviated, and still had more of an impact.

    I think that if you do that you will come away feeling as I do, that boxing without the 'protection' of gloves is far more effective for you.
    Hammer, anvil, forge and fire, chase away The Hoofed Liar. Roof and doorway, block and beam, chase The Trickster from our dreams.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kadagar_AV View Post
    In a racial conflict I'd have no problem popping off some negroes.

  7. #7
    Old Town Road Senior Member Strike For The South's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Castration of Boxing

    Quote Originally Posted by Vuk View Post

    I'll tell you what Wacker, you should try something that my bros experimented with. Find a sparring partner, and one of you use 16 oz boxing gloves, and the other use 4 oz. UFC gloves. See who wins, then switch.
    Then, one of you use just hand wraps, and the other use 4.oz UFC gloves. See who wins.
    When my bros did this, the person with 'less protection' won every time. They didn't need to punch nearly as hard to do as much and more damage, so their punches were quicker and more abbreviated, and still had more of an impact.
    The padding in MMA gloves is mostly positioned by the knuckles to dissipate the majority of the force.

    You punch harder with boxing gloves on. You are lying.
    There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford

    My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.

    I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.

  8. #8
    In the shadows... Member Vuk's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Castration of Boxing

    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    The padding in MMA gloves is mostly positioned by the knuckles to dissipate the majority of the force.

    You punch harder with boxing gloves on. You are lying.
    16 oz. Boxing gloves have a lot more padding on the knuckles and dissipate a lot more of the force than 4 oz. MMA gloves.
    Let me explain to you the mechanics behind damaging someone with a punch, as you obviously have no idea.
    Depending on where you punch someone, you need different amounts of energy to damage them significantly. You goal is to transfer as much KE as possible into the smallest place possible over the shortest time possible.
    The smaller the POC (Point of Contact), the more locational damage you will do. This of course goes both ways, as the smaller a part of your body you hit with, the great a chance you have of damaging it if striking a hard surface.
    The overall amount of energy you transfer into your opponent is almost insignificant. What really matters is energy over time. You can do a lot more damage with much less energy transfered over a far shorter time than you can more energy over a longer time.
    With bare knuckles and a fast punch, you have a very quick transfer of a lot of energy. With gloves, your POC is a lot larger, allowing you to strike with increased KE at hard targets, but because of the padding, this energy is transfered over a longer period of time (thus lessening its affect on your opponent). Also, a large POC means that you do less locational damage as well as less damage from a fluid shock wave. The more padding, the larger the POC, and the more time it takes to full transfer energy.

    You think I am lying? Try it out yourself. Give a friend a pair of each gloves and have him punch you in the gut. Tell me which does more damage. Then have him do it bareknuckle, and tell me which was the worst.
    Hammer, anvil, forge and fire, chase away The Hoofed Liar. Roof and doorway, block and beam, chase The Trickster from our dreams.
    Vigilance is our shield, that protects us from our squalid past. Knowledge is our weapon, with which we carve a path to an enlightened future.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kadagar_AV View Post
    In a racial conflict I'd have no problem popping off some negroes.

  9. #9
    Old Town Road Senior Member Strike For The South's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Castration of Boxing

    You seem to be assuming there are no bones in the hand. YOU WILL BREAK YOUR HAND IF YOU TRY TO BOX WITHOUT GLOVES.
    There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford

    My aim, then, was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. Fear is the beginning of wisdom.

    I am tired and sick of war. Its glory is all moonshine. It is only those who have neither fired a shot nor heard the shrieks and groans of the wounded who cry aloud for blood, for vengeance, for desolation.

  10. #10
    In the shadows... Member Vuk's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Castration of Boxing

    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post
    The padding in MMA gloves is mostly positioned by the knuckles to dissipate the majority of the force.

    You punch harder with boxing gloves on. You are lying.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gelatinous Cube View Post
    UFC fighters often still break their hands, there's been talk about switching to heavier gloves for years. Boxers still break their hands too, although not as often.

    Your head is pretty solid, guys. It can take a hit. The gloves are for the hands.
    Were just a few of the posts. Everyone on the thread was either arguing that less padding=less damage or were agreeing with them.
    Hammer, anvil, forge and fire, chase away The Hoofed Liar. Roof and doorway, block and beam, chase The Trickster from our dreams.
    Vigilance is our shield, that protects us from our squalid past. Knowledge is our weapon, with which we carve a path to an enlightened future.

    Everything you need to know about Kadagar_AV:
    Quote Originally Posted by Kadagar_AV View Post
    In a racial conflict I'd have no problem popping off some negroes.

  11. #11
    Philologist Senior Member ajaxfetish's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Castration of Boxing

    Quote Originally Posted by Vuk View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South
    The padding in MMA gloves is mostly positioned by the knuckles to dissipate the majority of the force.

    You punch harder with boxing gloves on. You are lying.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gelatinous Cube
    UFC fighters often still break their hands, there's been talk about switching to heavier gloves for years. Boxers still break their hands too, although not as often.

    Your head is pretty solid, guys. It can take a hit. The gloves are for the hands.
    Were just a few of the posts. Everyone on the thread was either arguing that less padding=less damage or were agreeing with them.
    Let's see.

    • StfS says that the padding in UFC gloves is placed to protect the striker's hands rather than to protect the strikee's head, and that strikes with gloves on are harder than with gloves off. No mention of the weight of the gloves having any effect on the force of the punch, just presence vs. absence.
    • GC says that UFC fighters (with lighter gloves) break their hands more often than boxers, so heavier gloves provide more hand protection, and mentions talk of the UFC switching to heavier gloves, presumably to provide more protection. No mention of harder hits with more padding.


    Can you find any actual instances of people in the thread claiming heavier gloves allow harder hits, or only more instances of people saying heavier gloves provide more protection?

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