When Can We Start Breaking Things?

[Strike For The South]

http://www.theamericanconservative.c...t-of-the-rich/

We meet in the midst of a nation brought to the verge of moral, political, and material ruin. Corruption dominates the ballot-box, the Legislatures, the Congress, and touches even the ermine of the bench. The people are demoralized. … The newspapers are largely subsidized or muzzled, public opinion silenced, business prostrated, homes covered with mortgages, labor impoverished, and the land concentrating in the hands of capitalists. The urban workmen are denied the right to organize for self-protection, imported pauperized labor beats down their wages. … The fruits of the toil of millions are boldly stolen to build up colossal fortunes for a few, unprecedented in the history of mankind, and the possessors of these, in turn, despise the Republic and endanger liberty. From the same prolific womb of governmental injustice we breed the two great classes—tramps and millionaires.

The back of the middle class grows weaker and weaker. I hope the job creators are able to continue using us a stepping stone until they can safely make it to the Bahamas. The rot gut of inequality, which has been the bane of human civilization is rearing its ugly head again. A long and steady uptick of equality and enfranchisement is slowly backsliding into lives that are nasty brutish and short.

Fear is the name of the game today, neighbors are pitted against each other over sexual fetishes while the robber barons make off with 16 trillion dollars. Smokescreens and black noise cloud the fact that we are falling deeper and deeper under the joint yoke of the rich and the government

The saddest part is there is no smoke filled room. It is merley a disconnect between them and us

[a completely inoffensive name]

Is this worse than the Gilded Age? Don't we always have the opportunity to recreate the French Revolution?

[tibilicus]

Capitalism has always had a vulgar side but since the 1980s its reared its head more frequently. No, I'm not a socialist. I used to vote Conservative before I realised the whole thing was a sham. I will not however be an apologist for guys who make obscene amounts by using the people bellow them with no regard for their livelihoods or economic sustainability. I expect an incoming of vulture capitalists to defend such men so to you I ask, why do you defend those who openly mock you? Why are you working your ass off for a depressingly average existence when the CEO of Barclays can break the law and face no punishment.

Something has got to give if the world is going to work. I despise the state of affairs as they stand. My generation will be burdened with the debts and selfishness of the masses who were duped by the few into thinking they had "never had it so good."

[Fragony]

So what if some have so much more. Good for them. I can get by and can still do fun things I don't need that much more, I am satisfied with that.

[a completely inoffensive name]

So what if some have so much more. Good for them. I can get by and can still do fun things I don't need that much more, I am satisfied with that.

I don't think you got the point. Those at the top seem to treat money as a zero sum game and want to walk away holding all of it. You are in the middle class and less people are living your life everyday. Will you say the same when you get kicked out as well?

[tibilicus]

So what if some have so much more. Good for them. I can get by and can still do fun things I don't need that much more, I am satisfied with that.

You may be comfortable for now. But good for them? You know the same bank which would love to take your house also probably laundered money for Iran or rigged the entire system. You know, that same system we all need to get by? Riddle me this. What do you think would happen to me if I laundered money for an indvidual from a country my country had an embargo against. Would I be sat here now typing this?

I'm glad you're happy with your place in the grand scheme of things. That happiness will stop you really thinking about the guys who cannot fail. They know they can do what they want and act how they want. They truly are above our laws and care nothing for the common sense of humanity. For them its all a game and money is a key component. They've turned our lives into a literal version of Hasbro's Monopoly and its so perverse and disgusting yet well just accept it. IF we get by on a middle income job that seems like our crowning glory before we sink into the see of mediocrity like everyone else. Any hopes of youth we once had replaced with the ideal model of taking it on the chin and getting by. I hope there's more than this. If this is it then whats the point of it all?

[Papewaio]

You can freely break that which you can repair.

You can do away with something if by doing so improves the situation.

If your system is broken, then fix it. Don't wait for equality or health or wealth to be given. Don't play their game. Define your game and what the stage of life is to you.

Decide what is happiness to you. You need to pursue it with zest and determination. Do as you please, please as you do.

Your choices, your purpose, your life.

[Fragony]

I don't think you got the point. Those at the top seem to treat money as a zero sum game and want to walk away holding all of it. You are in the middle class and less people are living your life everyday. Will you say the same when you get kicked out as well?

Economy just isn't doing very fine right now, but I don't mind it that some people are filhy rich, they are not the cause of he problem. People find it unfair that they get tax-cuts but Inthink it's unfair there isn't a cap on the amount of money that can be taxed

[a completely inoffensive name]

Economy just isn't doing very fine right now, but I don't mind it that some people are filhy rich, they are not the cause of he problem. People find it unfair that they get tax-cuts but Inthink it's unfair there isn't a cap on the amount of money that can be taxed

Except they did cause the problem. Rich people looking to sell their bundled up whatevers get other rich people to commit fraud by labeling them as AAA++++ would buy again. Housing meltdown triggering a cascade of other meltdowns as the bubble bursts. Meanwhile the average citizen who never majored in finance doesn't know how to play the stock market and doesn't realize why his bank would give him a loan if he wasn't good for it. All because it's better for the bottom line to have long term debt slavery then for responsible people to get their money, pay it off and be on their way.

[tibilicus]

Economy just isn't doing very fine right now, but I don't mind it that some people are filhy rich, they are not the cause of he problem. People find it unfair that they get tax-cuts but Inthink it's unfair there isn't a cap on the amount of money that can be taxed

They are the exact cause of the problem. They speculate, they gamble and when it all comes crashing down, we foot the bill. Coffee is a naturally produced substance and it has been for millions of years. One day we decided we needed guys to decide how much it's worth though. Guys who could speculate on its wealth and tell us if it was worth more or less. They usually did so for their own gain and if their little game put the price down thus destroying the lives of the suppliers, they didn't care. They were too busy in the City drinking champagne and cheating on their wives who would still adore them like the gods of Mammon we've made them out to be.

As for taxes, it isn't them being taxed too much, its the fact they don't pay tax. This money could have sorted out the budget deficits for this year of numerous nations. The USA only had a deficit of $1.2 trillion whilst the rich hoarded 12 trillion like Smaug the dragon. They expect our stupid consumer society to pay for them. We work jobs we hate so we can buy rubbish we don't need. We give them money and they give us nothing back. They just continue to speculate on our lives. The ultimate aim of any good city boy is to make a heap of money. Not for us but for himself. It is irrelevant how he makes this money. He can lie, cheat, sell his soul, make a pact with the devil and even kill. It doesn't matter. All that matters is he makes money. We are his thralls and we rely on his benevolence as only he can guide our lives to betterment through his economic insights. We sold our souls to morons and they plan to make or lives a misery till we cant give them any more money. Then they'll discard us like their strip club receipts.

[Fragony]

Except they did cause the problem. Rich people looking to sell their bundled up whatevers get other rich people to commit fraud by labeling them as AAA++++ would buy again. Housing meltdown triggering a cascade of other meltdowns as the bubble bursts. Meanwhile the average citizen who never majored in finance doesn't know how to play the stock market and doesn't realize why his bank would give him a loan if he wasn't good for it. All because it's better for the bottom line to have long term debt slavery then for responsible people to get their money, pay it off and be on their way.

Your government is kinds guilty of that, they enforced programs in risky area's, read up on the 'community reinforcement act'. It looked good untill the housing market suddenly collapsed and the banks were stuck with loans they would otherwise never have given. We have a similar bubble here, people live in houses that rised in value fast, and they used that fictional money. When prices will drop they are in trouble because they spend the additional value that was given. Glad I never fell for that I have just payed my debt.

[a completely inoffensive name]

Your government is kinds guilty of that, they enforced programs in risky area's, read up on the 'community reinforcement act'. It looked good untill the housing market suddenly collapsed and the banks were stuck with loans they would otherwise never have given. We have a similar bubble here, people live in houses that rised in value fast, and they used that fictional money. When prices will drop they are in trouble because they spend the additional value that was given. Glad I never fell for that I have just payed my debt.

Yeah our government, which is filled with.....rich people. Guess what percentage of the US Senate is made of millionaires.

[Fragony]

They are the exact cause of the problem. They speculate, they gamble and when it all comes crashing down, we foot the bill. Coffee is a naturally produced substance and it has been for millions of years. One day we decided we needed guys to decide how much it's worth though. Guys who could speculate on its wealth and tell us if it was worth more or less. They usually did so for their own gain and if their little game put the price down thus destroying the lives of the suppliers, they didn't care. They were too busy in the City drinking champagne and cheating on their wives who would still adore them like the gods of Mammon we've made them out to be.

As for taxes, it isn't them being taxed too much, its the fact they don't pay tax. This money could have sorted out the budget deficits for this year of numerous nations. The USA only had a deficit of $1.2 trillion whilst the rich hoarded 12 trillion like Smaug the dragon. They expect our stupid consumer society to pay for them. We work jobs we hate so we can buy rubbish we don't need. We give them money and they give us nothing back. They just continue to speculate on our lives. The ultimate aim of any good city boy is to make a heap of money. Not for us but for himself. It is irrelevant how he makes this money. He can lie, cheat, sell his soul, make a pact with the devil and even kill. It doesn't matter. All that matters is he makes money. We are his thralls and we rely on his benevolence as only he can guide our lives to betterment through his economic insights. We sold our souls to morons and they plan to make or lives a misery till we cant give them any more money. Then they'll discard us like their strip club receipts.

But you do get something back, you have a job there and you get payed for it. I find the notion that their money really belongs to the community becausev hey happen to have more of it rediculous. Aren't we suppsed to have a quid pro quo situation with the state, how does paying a tenfold or thousandfold then others make sense.

[a completely inoffensive name]

But you do get something back, you have a job there and you get payed for it. I find the notion that their money really belongs to the community becausev hey happen to have less of it rediculous. Aren't we suppsed to have a quid pro quo situation with the state, how does paying a tenfold or thousandfold then others make sense.

Every job doesn't stem from wall street. People have harvested coffee, refined coffee, sold coffee and bought coffee long before there was a wall street.

[Fragony]

Every job doesn't stem from wall street. People have harvested coffee, refined coffee, sold coffee and bought coffee long before there was a wall street.

They still do, we call it the 'real economy' here, what people actually buy and move. I am not all that worried about that undercurrent ever failing.

[a completely inoffensive name]

They still do, we call it the 'real economy' here, what people actually buy and move. I am not all that worried about that undercurrent ever failing.

But it is failing, right now. Because people's savings are lost by speculators.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

But it is failing, right now. Because people's savings are lost by speculators.

This is possibly your most perceptive point ever.

[a completely inoffensive name]

This is possibly your most perceptive point ever.

Thank you. Hopefully I will make more like it in the future.

[Strike For The South]

You can freely break that which you can repair.

You can do away with something if by doing so improves the situation.

If your system is broken, then fix it. Don't wait for equality or health or wealth to be given. Don't play their game. Define your game and what the stage of life is to you.

Decide what is happiness to you. You need to pursue it with zest and determination. Do as you please, please as you do.

Your choices, your purpose, your life.

This is nothing but empty rhetoric. We are forced into the game, and the carrot we are given is a middle class exsistance, only attainable by the few the system hasn't absolutely destroyed. Just stupid enough to consume while a select few make off like bandits.

They have us chasing a dream of suburbia that is just plausible enough to make us keep our heads down, just stupid enough to shut up and consume.

I do not want to fix the system, I am not some pre pubescent girl trying to find happiness. This is not some meta-crisis brought on by lack of self esteem. I do not need dime store lines about how I shape my destiny.

I want to bring the Sodom down on its head.

[Noncommunist]

This is nothing but empty rhetoric. We are forced into the game, and the carrot we are given is a middle class exsistance, only attainable by the few the system hasn't absolutely destroyed. Just stupid enough to consume while a select few make off like bandits.

They have us chasing a dream of suburbia that is just plausible enough to make us keep our heads down, just stupid enough to shut up and consume.

I do not want to fix the system, I am not some pre pubescent girl trying to find happiness. This is not some meta-crisis brought on by lack of self esteem. I do not need dime store lines about how I shape my destiny.

I want to bring the Sodom down on its head.

Call in fire from heaven and anyone who turns around turns into a pillar of salt?

[Montmorency]

Well, by international standards even the poorest in the West are middle-class.

I think we can look forward to a middle-class lifestyle for quite a while, depending on how middle-class the rest of the world gets.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Thank you. Hopefully I will make more like it in the future.

I should quit while you're ahead - but then I didn't, I'm pretty sure I've entered a terminal decline where the things I say become ever more strident, outlandish and unreasonable.

But maybe not, so I keep posting.

[Montmorency]

What does each make of the resurgence of old-school Calvinism in the American South, in the context of these several threads?

[Strike For The South]

What does each make of the resurgence of old-school Calvinism in the American South, in the context of these several threads?

It's not surprising. When the economy is good and you're the hyper-power, Joel Osteen squares with your world view. When everything goes tits up, it's comforting knowing you had no control.

I have always felt American protestants eschew traditional charity championed by the vicar of Rome (in theory) in favor of this bastardization of the just world theory.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

What does each make of the resurgence of old-school Calvinism in the American South, in the context of these several threads?

As a Wesleyan I dislike Calvin intensely, I think John Hooker had the right of it and I refuse to countenance Calvin's doctrine of preordained damnation.

HOWEVER, the rest is most welcome provided the theology is taught properly AND pre-Reformation theologians like Augustine are taught also, along with men like Luther, Tynedale, Wyclif, Crammer...

What is not acceptable is to teach "Christianity according to Calvin" any more than to teach Roman orthodoxy.

[naut]

Don't worry Strike, we're only one major food shortage away from global crisis!

So what if some have so much more. Good for them. I can get by and can still do fun things I don't need that much more, I am satisfied with that.

Like the family dog? Content with table scraps and the occasional pat?

[PanzerJaeger]

Economic equality is a fallacy and the pursuit of such a notion is and will always be a disastrous folly.

[Lemur]

Economic equality is a fallacy and the pursuit of such a notion is and will always be a disastrous folly.

Can you imagine any level of inequality that would be dangerous for social cohesion? Or is that impossible?

[Strike For The South]

Civil equality is a fallacy and the pursuit of such a notion is and will always be a disastrous folly.

See how vapid this statement is?

Hell, I am not even speaking about equality

[naut]

Economic equality is a fallacy and the pursuit of such a notion is and will always be a disastrous folly.

I do believe you've missed the point to hide behind this red herring.

Monetary "equality" is not the issue Strike has raised. Monetary "extraction" is the problem at hand. Where:

[J]ob creators are able to continue using us a stepping stone until they can safely make it to the Bahamas.

All elements of American society lose out. Regardless of social stature. When all the money is taken out of the system and hidden under rocks floating in ocean it is no wonder that there is less money for society, individuals, companies and governments to put to use to undertake projects and purchase for their needs. Can we agree that money represents value, of time, of skills, of physical resources. When the money is extracted and not reflected by something of value in the physical world, the value of all else is corroded.