Objections to the Sex Trade

[Vuk]

You have no idea what you are talking about, little boy.

These women were with me voluntarily, they are not slaves and I broke no laws. Did you even read my post? What makes you think I would spit on any of them? The PI is not dirt poor.

I did not have sex with underage girls, they could not prove their ages so I sent them away, as I had no way for sure of knowing their age. I suggest you take a step back before calling a pedophile
again.

I knew well before I posted this that you would give me guff. Just because I would rather spend my money on booze and woman than shooting pig carcasses with my hillbilly family does not require your judgement. Most of the women I met there I still maintain contact with. Bu hey, why do I need to justify myself to you, who has proven time and time again that his reasoning, his ethics and his common sense are all null and void. Go back to your hole and fabricate conspiracies about the shootings being a left-wing plan to enact gun control. You have problems, dude

You think those women would even look at you if they did not think they would get money? Justify it any way you want, but you are just another blot on humanity.
Having a thriving sex-tourism trade does does nothing to improve the status of women in a country, and you are supporting that system. Do you think if these women were as financially well off as most Americans they would even bother talking to you? No, most would not. They are doing it because they are poor, and because some of them have poor family members pressuring them to do it. You think they really want to have sex with you? Of course not, they just need the money. You are having sex with women who probably mostly do not want to have sex with you because you can. And don't tell me about how much they liked you and wanted to have sex with you, because that is what they are paid to do; to make stupid men feel like some hot foriegn woman likes them and wants to have sex with them. If you wanted to feel like Mr. nice guy and help them out, you could have given them the money and not slept with them. You knew you were taking advantage of them, and you gave them a bunch of extra-money to justify what you did and make yourself feel like a nice guy instead of a dick.
Call me what you want MRD, but what you think of me has nothing to do with what you have been bragging about doing. I wasn't going to come out and say it quite this way, but hey, you did it first.

[Kadagar_AV]

You think those women would even look at you if they did not think they would get money? Justify it any way you want, but you are just another blot on humanity.
Having a thriving sex-tourism trade does does nothing to improve the status of women in a country, and you are supporting that system. Do you think if these women were as financially well off as most Americans they would even bother talking to you? No, most would not. They are doing it because they are poor, and because some of them have poor family members pressuring them to do it. You think they really want to have sex with you? Of course not, they just need the money. You are having sex with women who probably mostly do not want to have sex with you because you can. And don't tell me about how much they liked you and wanted to have sex with you, because that is what they are paid to do; to make stupid men feel like some hot foriegn woman likes them and wants to have sex with them. If you wanted to feel like Mr. nice guy and help them out, you could have given them the money and not slept with them. You knew you were taking advantage of them, and you gave them a bunch of extra-money to justify what you did and make yourself feel like a nice guy instead of a dick.
Call me what you want MRD, but what you think of me has nothing to do with what you have been bragging about doing. I wasn't going to come out and say it quite this way, but hey, you did it first.

Ah damn... I tried to pick it apart but it's just true.

I still prefer someone screaming in a pimps face "GET A JOB" compared to 99% of humanity though. He has done something factual against it...

[Major Robert Dump]

You think those women would even look at you if they did not think they would get money? Justify it any way you want, but you are just another blot on humanity.
Having a thriving sex-tourism trade does does nothing to improve the status of women in a country, and you are supporting that system. Do you think if these women were as financially well off as most Americans they would even bother talking to you? No, most would not. They are doing it because they are poor, and because some of them have poor family members pressuring them to do it. You think they really want to have sex with you? Of course not, they just need the money. You are having sex with women who probably mostly do not want to have sex with you because you can. And don't tell me about how much they liked you and wanted to have sex with you, because that is what they are paid to do; to make stupid men feel like some hot foriegn woman likes them and wants to have sex with them. If you wanted to feel like Mr. nice guy and help them out, you could have given them the money and not slept with them. You knew you were taking advantage of them, and you gave them a bunch of extra-money to justify what you did and make yourself feel like a nice guy instead of a dick.
Call me what you want MRD, but what you think of me has nothing to do with what you have been bragging about doing. I wasn't going to come out and say it quite this way, but hey, you did it first.

I think I made it quite clear fairly early on that I had no illusions that these women would be interested in me were it not for money. And considering "security" is typically right up on the top of the list when women are polled with what they look for in a man, it is not unreasonable to believe that they would go with me, as I will clearly demonstrate when I travel to Cebu.

I suggest that you visit a strip club in Dallas or Houston if you think the phenomenon is specific to Asia. You may need to put on a tie, though, which you probably do not own. I also recommend googling something like, oh Backpage+Indianapolis+Escorts and see what you find.

You are apparently unaware that men, for a few thousand years, have a tendency to be attracted to young women. And that some men, at some point, decide that the drama of relationships is a little too much and perhaps they would just rather, you know, pay for sex. And that there are plenty of women, to include your neighbors and relatives and the girl at the barista, who will gladly exchange money for a few hours of such activity.

You are obviously unaware of the huge, educated middle class in the PI that is making them the go-to country for outsourcing for IT, customer service and manufacturing, and you seem to think that the only way for a woman to make money in the PI is to sell herself. Call a credit card hotline or a big bank hotline, and you will likley be talking to someone from the Philippines, assuming you have a credit card.

You are obviously unaware that their problems stem not from a poor economy, but from a lack of space to expand, which results in even middle class families living in what we would consider rough conditions.

You are obviously unaware that another major issue facing them is overpopulation, which stems from both Catholicism (no birth control) and their open sexuality.

You are obviuously unaware that they have a virtually unregulated firearms ownership system, which lends greatly to the crime rates in the country, and gives them 3rd world crime rates when in fact they are not third world.

You apparently do not realize that Filipinos are not xenophobes, like you, and typically judge a race or nationality based on their merits and experience with said nationaility, and they have a tendency to really like Americans, British and Australians, even when we behave like asses, for reasons that go back a few generations but you probably do not know because you are too busy wrestling with your brothers.

Believe me, dude, if the ugly sex tourists didn't visit the PI, the women in the PI would still be doing what they are doing now, they would just make a lot less money doing it. There are "local rates" and "foreigner rates" just like anywhere else.

Me not visiting the PI will affect what is happening there about as much as you will affect Wal Mart by not shopping there.

You seem to think I came here to brag, or be viewed as a hero. This is not the case. I am sharing a story and photos, oh bearer-of-womens-rights that you are. I went to an emerging economy, and I had sex with a lot of women and paid them for it, just like I do with women in the United States; I established some business networks, and I did some nice things for people. That is the story.

Save your outrage for the countries who import Filipino labor, take their phones, take their visas and treat them like slaves. I didn't make this world, I just live in it, and I am having a lot of goddamned fun

** You apparently missed the parts where I gave women money and did not sleep with them. On many occasions in fact. But of course not 100% of the time, because some of them are such effective sales ladies, and by god I am creating jobs

[Major Robert Dump]

Vuk, you gotta get out of the States and see the wider world. Your particular application of morality does not work in the third world (or, really, the second or first either..).

He has been out of the states, and his critique of european food made him the laughing stock of the Org as he did not like dipping his bread in that "oily junk" or whatever he said. And his next thread I believe was about who mae the best fast food burgers.

I suspect he is near Clark County, Nevada, this very moment preparing to protest the Bunny Ranches

[Vuk]

He has been out of the states, and his critique of european food made him the laughing stock of the Org as he did not like dipping his bread in that "oily junk" or whatever he said. And his next thread I believe was about who mae the best fast food burgers.

I suspect he is near Clark County, Nevada, this very moment preparing to protest the Bunny Ranches

Yes, because I did not like dipping bread into olive oil. Oh heavens, what is wrong with me! How dare I not like a Mediterranean diet?!
Or pardon me, are you criticizing me for not hiring prostitutes in Bosnia?

Vuk, you gotta get out of the States and see the wider world. Your particular application of morality does not work in the third world (or, really, the second or first either..).

So you are saying that because there are assholes elsewhere in the world we should be assholes too?

I suggest that you visit a strip club in Dallas or Houston if you think the phenomenon is specific to Asia. You may need to put on a tie, though, which you probably do not own. I also recommend googling something like, oh Backpage+Indianapolis+Escorts and see what you find.
First of all, when did I say that because something happens in the US it is good? Second of all, it is usually a different situation in the US. The women in the US are far more likely to be there by choice, generally have better opportunitties, and have better legal protection. I am not saying it is right, but what you partook in was even worse.

You are apparently unaware that men, for a few thousand years, have a tendency to be attracted to young women. And that some men, at some point, decide that the drama of relationships is a little too much and perhaps they would just rather, you know, pay for sex. And that there are plenty of women, to include your neighbors and relatives and the girl at the barista, who will gladly exchange money for a few hours of such activity.
I am sure you do sleep with you relatives in Oklahoma, but that doesn't happen where I come from. Also, again, you know it is BS. There is a very good chance that those women you were paying are being pressured into what they do by male family members (and would not do it otherwise), and may not even be getting a cut of the money. You really have no idea. Also, by bringing your money in and paying these girls, more people will see that there is money in it, and even if you are not sleeping with women who are being coerced into the industry, when others see the money that is to be made from foriegn whores, they will start coercing women into prostitution.

You are obviously unaware of the huge, educated middle class in the PI that is making them the go-to country for outsourcing for IT, customer service and manufacturing, and you seem to think that the only way for a woman to make money in the PI is to sell herself. Call a credit card hotline or a big bank hotline, and you will likley be talking to someone from the Philippines, assuming you have a credit card.

No, I am not unaware that there is a middle-class in the Phillipines, but you are also aware that they are a minority, and people with those opportunities are not working as prostitutes! You mentioned several times in your post about the squalor the women were living in. Say whatever you want, but the women you are taking advantage of are not well-to-do.

You are obviously unaware that their problems stem not from a poor economy, but from a lack of space to expand, which results in even middle class families living in what we would consider rough conditions.
So you would describe the economy as good?

You are obviously unaware that another major issue facing them is overpopulation, which stems from both Catholicism (no birth control) and their open sexuality.
What makes you assume I am not aware of this? Also, how does you knocking up women help with that?

You are obviuously unaware that they have a virtually unregulated firearms ownership system, which lends greatly to the crime rates in the country, and gives them 3rd world crime rates when in fact they are not third world.
Yes, an overcrowded, crime ridden country...sounds like a dream! There is wealth in the PI, but it is concentrated in a fairly small amount of the population. 26.5% of the population lives in poverty (by their standards). Someone in the PI working minimum wage (about half of their workforce) makes about $1,920 a year. Yeah, they have a high GDP and businesses do well, but you know as well as I do that the average person does very poorly.http://www.nscb.gov.ph/secstat/d_income.asp

You apparently do not realize that Filipinos are not xenophobes, like you, and typically judge a race or nationality based on their merits and experience with said nationaility, and they have a tendency to really like Americans, British and Australians, even when we behave like asses, for reasons that go back a few generations but you probably do not know because you are too busy wrestling with your brothers.
1. What does that have to do with anything? 2. When did I say they were xenophobes? 3. Yes, I am aware that we have good relations with them.

Believe me, dude, if the ugly sex tourists didn't visit the PI, the women in the PI would still be doing what they are doing now, they would just make a lot less money doing it. There are "local rates" and "foreigner rates" just like anywhere else.
If a woman in the PI is making peanuts doing that, her handler does not stand to make a big profit off of her, and his incentive and her's for working in that industry is lessened. She is more likely then to look for better opportunities. They funny way that that works is that when you look for a better opportunity you are more likely to find it then when you do not. If a woman hooking can make a relatively lot of money from foreigners, pimps will be much more likely to coerce them into the industry. It is not that there are no opportunities, it is just that they will never look for them when someone else makes more money off forcing them into bedding foreigners.

Me not visiting the PI will affect what is happening there about as much as you will affect Wal Mart by not shopping there.
If you don't buy, there is no market. If you are not going to do something about the problem, you at least don't have to make it worse.

You seem to think I came here to brag, or be viewed as a hero. This is not the case. I am sharing a story and photos, oh bearer-of-womens-rights that you are. I went to an emerging economy, and I had sex with a lot of women and paid them for it, just like I do with women in the United States; I established some business networks, and I did some nice things for people. That is the story.
Oh no, you are not bragging. And you are right, I don't give a rat's ass about women's rights. I care about human rights, whether they are female or not.

Save your outrage for the countries who import Filipino labor, take their phones, take their visas and treat them like slaves. I didn't make this world, I just live in it, and I am having a lot of goddamned fun
You didn't create the suffering, but you will get pleasure from exploiting it. Makes an aweful lot of sense to me. Sorry dude, but any respect I still had for you evaporated after this thread. I'll save saying what I think about you, as it would probably get me banned if I posted it here.

** You apparently missed the parts where I gave women money and did not sleep with them. On many occasions in fact. But of course not 100% of the time, because some of them are such effective sales ladies, and by god I am creating jobs
As I said, you are a hero!

Let me give you a bit of advice that my dad told me when I was a kid: Imagine how you would want a stranger to treat your sister or daughter, and that should serve as your guide.

[Kadagar_AV]

Let me give you a bit of advice that my dad told me when I was a kid: Imagine how you would want a stranger to treat your sister or daughter, and that should serve as your guide.

Word.

[Major Robert Dump]

Yes, because I did not like dipping bread into olive oil. Oh heavens, what is wrong with me! How dare I not like a Mediterranean diet?!
Or pardon me, are you criticizing me for not hiring prostitutes in Bosnia?


So you are saying that because there are assholes elsewhere in the world we should be assholes too?


Let me give you a bit of advice that my dad told me when I was a kid: Imagine how you would want a stranger to treat your sister or daughter, and that should serve as your guide.

You are staunchly anti porn and anti prostitution, and you do not approve of sex without love. You make that very clear both here and in the past.

I, on the other hand, see no difference in spending time and money courting a woman to get into her pants, or simply cutting to the chase and paying for what I want if she is willing.

The idea of these women being trapped in a prison of human trafficking is greatly exaggerated, and virtually non existent, in the business districts of the cities of the PI. It happens to be government regulated. I was not in Burma. I was not in Ecuador. There were no chaved orangutans. Does it happen in the PI? Of course it does, and I did not go to those places.

This may be the only job some of these women can find. I very well understand that. And you may think I am only making this worse by participating. Not only do I disagree with you, but you cannot prove this in any tangible way other than pulling at the heartstrings. In fact, I am making it better for them by being the best customer I can be in the event I decide to make the purchase. Talk all you want about being part of the problem or part of the solution. That's real big talk, and it doesn't work.

I got propositioned EVERYWHERE, and by women who were not girls working in the trade. Of course, you would know this if you bothered to read. I got propositioned in the mall. I got propositioned at the car lot. I got propositioned by girls working in coffee shops and girls leaving nursing schools. The poorer the area you go to, the more the propositions come. And these were by women, I am not even talking about all the shady guys who come up and make me offers.

And, you subtley call me a pedophile, which you have yet to apologize for.

And, you suggest that I have nothing to offer these women other than money and have no game, when in fact the second half of my tris was nothing but innocent dating of random girls I met here and there. And before you say they are using me as a green card, be advised that I was not born yesterday, and compared to most Filipino men, Al Bundy would be a good catch because he at least goes to work and doesn't beat them.

It is abundently clear that you are skimming over what I write. On one hand, you accuse me of playing hero. Then you tell me I could just give the girls money and move on. When say I have done this, you sarcastically say I am playing hero again. Obviously, nothing I do is right.

I have made it clear several times that I plan on pursuing commercial ventures in the pacific, and that I am also trying to make friends, but you apparently didn't catch that. I also recall mentioning that I am still in contact with most of those girls. I say *most* because the ones who I do not talk to have not returned emails or phone calls. We use facebook, skype, email, yahoo and I have an international calling plan and I talk to several per week. I have continued to send gifts for birthdays and plan on sending christmas presents.

We obviously are not going to agree on this. If you want to continue to troll me and insult me, go right ahead, and understand I will return the favor in full. Or you can just go away, which I am sure everyone would appreciate.

**And I impregnated no one
**And I do not have a daughter and I hate my sister
**And were I a woman, or if I was a muscle head, I would be stripper or a hooker, so you are arguing against something that I would engage in myself given the poortunity. When I was 19 I slept with a 45 year old once to get a summer job, does that count?

[Kadagar_AV]

Edit: It takes all kinds of people to make a world.

[Major Robert Dump]

I am not arguing this one way or the other, because both cases are true. Some would and some wouldn't. As it stands I am in contact with several who would disagree with you. One girl I went on a date with happens to be studying criminal justice and law and can help me with some legal issues I will encounter, so I will probably pay her to consult me. One keeps proposing to me and I keep telling her to cool it. One harasses the others of FB and says I am hers.

Now, if by "be with" we are talking about them using me for money and a green card, then yeah, and the sky is also blue. And so what. People marry for money all the time. If I am the one getting the hot wife half my age who can give me healthy children, believe me, I am not the sucker. The suckers are my friends in unhappy marriages with women who look like Bea Aurthur.

Four nights ago, I picked up a 22 year old in my hotel bar and didn't pay her a cent. In fact, I was on FB shortly after bragging to one of my Org friends about it, amazed that is was free sans a few drinks. Would be great if he would chime in here. So please, all this talk of me "not having it" is comical. I've got it, I just usually don't feel like using it. I am sure there are uglier people than me in the world



The idea that the Filipino women would be appalled by me is laughable if you consider not only some of the western blokes they marry, but also the slim pickins of quality Filipino men. Throw in the fact that many of them blindly worship our culture and it is a no-brainer.

Did we miss the part where I picked girls up outside of the bars? Did we miss the part where they initiated it? Did we miss the part where they left work early and sought me out? Did we miss the part about the behaviors I saw/heard of regarding other visitors and how a modicum of respect goes a long way?

I am not sure why I am defending myself, as it makes it look like I am seeking validation. Were I seeking that, I could have just posted photos with no stories and lied and said I picked all those girls up in a disco. I am trying to be honest.

** Actually, I know why I am responding. It's because I am trying to finish the other chapters and am sitting at the computer, so I see every time someone says something

[Fragony]

You are staunchly anti porn and anti prostitution, and you do not approve of sex without love. You make that very clear both here and in the past.

I, on the other hand, see no difference in spending time and money courting a woman to get into her pants, or simply cutting to the chase and paying for what I want if she is willing.

The idea of these women being trapped in a prison of human trafficking is greatly exaggerated, and virtually non existent, in the business districts of the cities of the PI. It happens to be government regulated. I was not in Burma. I was not in Ecuador. There were no chaved orangutans. Does it happen in the PI? Of course it does, and I did not go to those places.

This may be the only job some of these women can find. I very well understand that. And you may think I am only making this worse by participating. Not only do I disagree with you, but you cannot prove this in any tangible way other than pulling at the heartstrings. In fact, I am making it better for them by being the best customer I can be in the event I decide to make the purchase. Talk all you want about being part of the problem or part of the solution. That's real big talk, and it doesn't work.

I got propositioned EVERYWHERE, and by women who were not girls working in the trade. Of course, you would know this if you bothered to read. I got propositioned in the mall. I got propositioned at the car lot. I got propositioned by girls working in coffee shops and girls leaving nursing schools. The poorer the area you go to, the more the propositions come. And these were by women, I am not even talking about all the shady guys who come up and make me offers.

And, you subtley call me a pedophile, which you have yet to apologize for.

And, you suggest that I have nothing to offer these women other than money and have no game, when in fact the second half of my tris was nothing but innocent dating of random girls I met here and there. And before you say they are using me as a green card, be advised that I was not born yesterday, and compared to most Filipino men, Al Bundy would be a good catch because he at least goes to work and doesn't beat them.

It is abundently clear that you are skimming over what I write. On one hand, you accuse me of playing hero. Then you tell me I could just give the girls money and move on. When say I have done this, you sarcastically say I am playing hero again. Obviously, nothing I do is right.

I have made it clear several times that I plan on pursuing commercial ventures in the pacific, and that I am also trying to make friends, but you apparently didn't catch that. I also recall mentioning that I am still in contact with most of those girls. I say *most* because the ones who I do not talk to have not returned emails or phone calls. We use facebook, skype, email, yahoo and I have an international calling plan and I talk to several per week. I have continued to send gifts for birthdays and plan on sending christmas presents.

We obviously are not going to agree on this. If you want to continue to troll me and insult me, go right ahead, and understand I will return the favor in full. Or you can just go away, which I am sure everyone would appreciate.

**And I impregnated no one
**And I do not have a daughter and I hate my sister
**And were I a woman, or if I was a muscle head, I would be stripper or a hooker, so you are arguing against something that I would engage in myself given the poortunity. When I was 19 I slept with a 45 year old once to get a summer job, does that count?

Got to make a case for Vuk, where you are right now is a sex destination for people looking for it. I trust you on being a decent person but a lot of these girls want something in return and it just could be that you let them down there. I am sure you are a handsome guy but Vuk isn't all that far off probably. It's a sex haven for people with tendencies, you are being too harsh on him, you just might not fully understand what is going on there. Doesn't make you stupid, but a bit naive, absolutely that.

[SoFarSoGood]

There us no way this guy is a real Major.

[Major Robert Dump]

Got to make a case for Vuk, where you are right now is a sex destination for people looking for it. I trust you on being a decent person but a lot of these girls want something in return and it just could be that you let them down there. I am sure you are a handsome guy but Vuk isn't all that far off probably. It's a sex haven for people with tendencies, you are being too harsh on him, you just might not fully understand what is going on there. Doesn't make you stupid, but a bit naive, absolutely that.

You have to be kidding me.

Of course there is a sex trade here, it is a fraction of the tourist income. It is practically sanctioned by the government. And I hear you are allowed to gamble in Las Vegas, as well.

Of course there are women here are looking to be swept off their feet and whisked away to paradise.

Believe me, frags, I understand the country very well.

I'm not going to go easy on him

He called me a pedophile
He called me the blight of humanity
He basically said in the legal bar scene in the PI it is not okay, but in the illegal bar scene in the states its not so bad because the women have other choices, which incidentally contradicts why he thinks adult entertainment should not be legal, because the women are all victims and didn't get there by free will. My head is spinning.
He chided me for not giving them money in exchange for nothing, and when I pointed out that I did, he chided me again.

I did not engage street walkers. Read again. I went to legal, regulated establishments that treat there workers sooooo poorly that they get free medical care and one of them just uploaded her pictures onto FB from a bar-paid trip for a week in Boracay, Holy cows, I am practically a slave trader.

My god, if you people got half as outraged about real crimes and the robber barons bankrupting us all, we might actually get somewhere.

I cannot wait for the judgement to come rolling in when I get into the christian matchmaking service in Cebu