Is Islam true?.

**The Stranger** · 12-01-2012, 01:58

Originally Posted by Kadagar_AV

I think You got atheism wrong... We don't defy any God more than any other. Atheists are saying that there are no evidence for a God at large, and that the different religions of the world probably got things wrong.

If you are an atheist, You also accept that science might one day prove the existence of a deity.

It's just that all the guys trying to prove the existence of a deity has failed so far. Failed quite hard, too.

that sounds more like agnosticism, tho its not even that really. atheism denies the existence of god, what you made of it is some sort of agnosticism based mixed with some science. and on a sidenote, my experience is that most athiests only accept that science will one day prove that god doesnt exist, not the other way around. that atheism doesnt defy any god more than any other is true, they defy/deny all gods equally.

edit: it kinda depends on how narrow you define atheism i guess

**Kadagar_AV** · 12-01-2012, 02:06

Originally Posted by The Stranger

that sounds more like agnosticism, tho its not even that really. atheism denies the existence of god, what you made of it is some sort of agnosticism based mixed with some science. and on a sidenote, my experience is that most athiests only accept that science will one day prove that god doesnt exist, not the other way around. that atheism doesnt defy any god more than any other is true, they defy/deny all gods equally.

edit: it kinda depends on how narrow you define atheism i guess

Well, I said an atheist have to accept that science might one day prove the existence of a deity. A proper atheist would however consider it HIGHLY unlikely that any of the now surviving religions have got it right.

Just like if someone would say that there is a huge Chinese ninja figure behind the moon. It's hard to prove him wrong, but you'd deem it highly unlikely that he was right.

But yeah, agnosticism and atheism is very close, and I'm not sure there is a definite line drawn between them.

**The Stranger** · 12-01-2012, 02:12

well as I conceive it the line is that the atheist denies the existence of god (hardline) or denies that the belief in god is rationally justified (softline) while the agnost suspends judgment on the matter and simply says god may or may not exist while the believer ofcourse says God exists.

im not sure how far you have to leave the door open in order to go from atheist to agnost, but if there is a thin line between them i think your position is on it.

**Kadagar_AV** · 12-01-2012, 02:18

Originally Posted by The Stranger

well as I conceive it the line is that the atheist denies the existence of god (hardline) or denies that the belief in god is rationally justified (softline) while the agnost suspends judgment on the matter and simply says god may or may not exist while the believer ofcourse says God exists.

im not sure how far you have to leave the door open in order to go from atheist to agnost, but if there is a thin line between them i think your position is on it.

You might be right, I have always had a hard time with those two terms. I would find it strange if an atheist would say that there definitely is no God though, as comprehensible data enough for an analysis simply are missing.

From what I have got, atheists are open for the idea that there might be stuff we have no idea of. They do however attack hard when people start saying that they have an idea of what that stuff is, without sufficient evidence to back them up :)

**The Stranger** · 12-01-2012, 02:23

i suppose there are different kind of atheists, just as there are different kind of believers. many atheists, call them radical or fanatical or militant atheists simply deny the existence of god (or close enough to make no matter) and often are as radical in their belief and faith in that their position is true as the religious believers they oppose. they often make the same baseless claims as well. and like i said, from my experience with them, many of these people believe that it is only a matter of time before science will prove everything, thus including that god doesnt exist.

it is my firm belief that the majority of the people i just described would be fanatically burning witches 300 years ago, in the name of god ofcourse.

**Kadagar_AV** · 12-01-2012, 02:27

Originally Posted by The Stranger

i suppose there are different kind of atheists, just as there are different kind of believers. many atheists, call them radical or fanatical or militant atheists simply deny the existence of god (or close enough to make no matter) and often are as radical in their belief and faith in that their position is true as the religious believers they oppose. they often make the same baseless claims as well. and like i said, from my experience with them, many of these people believe that it is only a matter of time before science will prove everything, thus including that god doesnt exist.

it is my firm belief that the majority of the people i just described would be fanatically burning witches 300 years ago, in the name of god ofcourse.

Oh, I agree with everything you say.

I have way more in common with a moderate of opposing beliefs than I have with fanatics of my own.

I know many an "atheist" who wouldn't say that it would be impossible for some "force" like... force... to exist... To use Star wars terminology. So I guess it also depends on the definition of God.