The Toeies.

[InsaneApache]

Ha ha ha ha oh my aching sides. You'd need a heart of stone not to laugh. At this rate they'll be gone by the end of the decade. Good riddance to bad rubbish.

First the cast iron referendum, that we may or may not have in, say five years, if they get re-elected. (Unlikely)

Gay marriage and more claptrap when we have a meltdown in the economy.

Insulting voters as swivel eyed loons, racists, fruitcakes, clowns and gadflies.

Insulting your own party members as swivel eyed loons.

Promoting only the guys who went to your school and you play tennis with.

The only lunacy I can see is emanating from No10.

Piss of back to Bullingdon you chinless wonder 'Call me Dave'. We wont miss you. It takes some doing to be more hated by your own party than 'grocer' Heath but I think you may well have achieved it.

I'd weep but they would be tears of laughter.

[Greyblades]

Aww, but I like my toeies, they're the best parts of my footsies.

[ICantSpellDawg]

I look forward to UKIP replacing them completely in the next 10 years. They can become a throwback novelty party (lib dems) for the extreme elderly and historical re-enactors. The liberal-conservative factionalism is dying. I can forsee a UK that is politically dominated by progressive devolution libertarians at UKip and big government, Eurocentric status quo labour. It will take a while to settle in.

[Greyblades]

Of course you like Ukip, they're the tea party but they actually has a point to them. One point.

[Sir Moody]

don't be so sure ICSD - their current support is purely because of Europe, if the public knew what else they stand for most would back away from them - if we do leave Europe then their support will basically drop off a cliff...

[ICantSpellDawg]

don't be so sure ICSD - their current support is purely because of Europe, if the public knew what else they stand for most would back away from them - if we do leave Europe then their support will basically drop off a cliff...

But until that happens they will likely grow and influence. I can't imagine a world that, over the table and without any shadow maneuvering, gives up the hard fought right to govern itself. This goes as much for sovereign states as it does for sovereign individuals. Those days of rights sacrifice have to be over. Progress in the future is expanding rights and safeguarding them against Statism. This is the radical idea, that individuals have rights and can govern themselves with a minimal State as a servant, rather than as a master.

This is the new idea, this is not a conservative idea. The idea of state as benefactor or moral arbiter is the old idea and must be thrown into the dustbin.

[HoreTore]

The grass is always greener on the other side, isn't it?

[Idaho]

Ukip are Tories.

Watching the tories meltdown over Europe is always entertaining.

[Beskar]

Gay marriage and more claptrap when we have a meltdown in the economy.

Yes, because talking about the economy forever will fix it. Any solution will take years for it to be fully implemented. It is a "make changes, then wait and see" game.
Also, Gay Marriage will boost the economy. Think of all those extra weddings! A new rise in the tailoring industry too to fix suits for women and dresses for men.

[InsaneApache]

Ukip are Tories.

Watching the tories meltdown over Europe is always entertaining.

You'd think so wouldn't you. However South Shields paints a rather different picture. Since Labour abandoned the working classes it's all up for grabs.

Yes, because talking about the economy forever will fix it. Any solution will take years for it to be fully implemented.

Oh yes that's just what we need, more clueless politicos blathering on about how they are going to fix the thing they buggered up in the first place.

Politicians don't fix anything. It's business that will get the economy sorted. You know the guys who actually do something.

[Greyblades]

You'd think so wouldn't you. However South Shields paints a rather different picture.

yeah, it turns out they're even worse than the tories. The conservative party does what it does because they benefit personally from thier policies. Ukip are actually so crazy they have come to actually believe what they do is in the UK' best interests.

[Sir Moody]

personally the funniest thing I find about UKIP is the PR job they have pulled on Nigel Farage

They have successfully made him out as a "man of the people" by sticking him in pubs for all of his interviews etc - what profession do you think he made his fortune in?

Investment Banking - the second most hated profession after career politicians... now that's top spin doctoring

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Yes, because talking about the economy forever will fix it. Any solution will take years for it to be fully implemented. It is a "make changes, then wait and see" game.
Also, Gay Marriage will boost the economy. Think of all those extra weddings! A new rise in the tailoring industry too to fix suits for women and dresses for men.

Not really - there'll be a sudden upswing followed by numbers dropping off a cliff. Gay people are politically more-left leaning than straight people as a group (for historical reasons) so they're less likely to get married to begin with, and they don't have the imperative to marry for the children, or the same need to hook up and get busy to produce said children.

Then there will be the court cases, the accusations of religious people being "homophobes" which will cause them to further withdraw from society, which will hurt charities because religious people give more in time and material to religious charities than secular people give to secular ones.

Then there's the waste of time - which which might profitably have been spent finding the money to pay for more destroyers to be built in Northern Shipyards, or fixing the benefit system so that it works, or practically anything other than the pointless changing of a word of a contract.

[Greyblades]

So in other words we've wasted our time over something that shouldnt have been an issue.

90% of politics in a nutshell.

[InsaneApache]

The absurdity of it all....



34 years later and you nippers wonder why I'm so cynical....

[Greyblades]

No we just wonder why you're for the ultra tories.

[InsaneApache]

Who are they and why do you think I am for them?

[Husar]

It's business that will get the economy sorted. You know the guys who actually do something.

The guys who actually do something are mostly on minimum wage. Someone has to earn all the money for the golden parachutes and for the bailouts for those who are "too big for golden parachutes". It's really tough to be at the top.

The solution is Marxism.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

So in other words we've wasted our time over something that shouldnt have been an issue.

90% of politics in a nutshell.

Yes - but more so in this case.

Political capital has been spent here on all sides and acrimony has been fostered - that will make it harder to do something important - this is the AV referendum all over again.

[Greyblades]

Who are they and why do you think I am for them?

Ukip and you keep saying so.

[InsaneApache]

Ukip and you keep saying so.

You'd better head north east then and tell all those ultra tories in South Shields.

I'd wear a hard hat though if I were you.

[Rhyfelwyr]

You'd better head north east then and tell all those ultra tories in South Shields.

I'd wear a hard hat though if I were you.

UKIP have some credence with disaffected working-class voters because they are anti-immigration, and offer a more respectable protest vote than the BNP.

I suspect if these people were actually aware of UKIP's other policies, they would change their tune very quickly. UKIP are going to take away a lot of their income if they are on benefits, as many of them are.

[Idaho]

You'd better head north east then and tell all those ultra tories in South Shields.

I'd wear a hard hat though if I were you.

Sorry but even a glance at the 2010 and 2013 South Sheilds results shows quite clearly that UKIP's support is basically just disaffected Tories.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_S...ons_since_2000

2010 Results - 36,000+ voters, 57% Turnout

Labour - 18,900 votes
Con - 7,800 votes
Lib - 5,100 votes

2013 Results - 27,000+ voters, 39% Turnout

Labour - 12,400 votes
UKIP - 5,900 votes
Con - 2,800 votes

Hmm... conservative vote drops by about 5,000... and UKIP vote goes up by about.. well who'da thunk it - 5,000! Dismal show by the Libs and the generally poor turnout made it a fairly irrelevant by election.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Sorry but even a glance at the 2010 and 2013 South Sheilds results shows quite clearly that UKIP's support is basically just disaffected Tories.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_S...ons_since_2000

2010 Results - 36,000+ voters, 57% Turnout

Labour - 18,900 votes
Con - 7,800 votes
Lib - 5,100 votes

2013 Results - 27,000+ voters, 39% Turnout

Labour - 12,400 votes
UKIP - 5,900 votes
Con - 2,800 votes

Hmm... conservative vote drops by about 5,000... and UKIP vote goes up by about.. well who'da thunk it - 5,000! Dismal show by the Libs and the generally poor turnout made it a fairly irrelevant by election.

Except, if that's true, then UKIP are gaining ground because they managed to get the disaffected Tories out in Force, but Labour couldn't marshal all their voters. That means UKIP is generating a base - and it's unlikely that they're ALL Conservative voters, because that would mean everyone who voted in the General Election for the Cons decided to turn out for a By-Election with an 18% lower turnout.

I don't buy it - a bigger truth is that the Lib-Dems are filthy with government, more so than either of the other parties.

[Idaho]

I don't think labour are getting their vote out. By elections usually favour opposition parties. However this was already a safe seat for the main opposition party. I just don't think it tells us anything other than ukip are going to kill the Conservative party, the liberals are in free fall and no one is rushing to vote Labour.

[LittleGrizzly]

I don't think labour are getting their vote out. By elections usually favour opposition parties. However this was already a safe seat for the main opposition party. I just don't think it tells us anything other than ukip are going to kill the Conservative party, the liberals are in free fall and no one is rushing to vote Labour.
.......................................................

All of which brings me back to who the hell am I supposed to vote for...

[Greyblades]

Considering the options are:
A condecending cabal of rich kids who've messed up the economy and by doing so have done the exact opposite of the only thing we consider voting them in for,

A bunch of racists, extremists and loons, hidden behind a showman with one, single, solitary but all encompassing point that does nothing but distract from aforementioned racists, extremists and loons.

A bunch of aimless fools lead by an intergity-less idiot

And labour, the tentative lesser of 4 evils who got us all into this mess in the first place... well they have my vote, for how little I value it anymore.

[Idaho]

I am more than happy to stick the boot into labour, but the current economic mess is down to the investment banks. Their proxies, the conservatives have done a good job of convincing everyone that it was labour what bankrupted the country (the fact that all the western economies tanked at the exact same time is pure coincidence).

[Greyblades]

Uh, I wasnt thinking about the economy I was referencing thier jackassery that let the conservatives in.

Particually blair running away from his resposibility and sticking Brown in the PM's seat when he clearly wasnt ready to take on Cameron.

[LittleGrizzly]

I may well have to vote Labour unless I want to abstain or just not bother at all...