Why Does Scotland Want To Be Independent?

[Empire*Of*Media]

Empire, I have never insulted you, and I was always open to hearing what you had to say.

i know dear friend !! i alwayse appreciate your Tolerance & Understandablity !! i forgot to write, that despite many only know to hate and offense and attack, i have many friends especially in UK in here,and even non-friends that dont insult or offense to anyone just because he does not like his ideas !! cheer to you friend !!

Its not that they hate you - its that you are completely misrepresenting the Historical facts to "score points"

the English did not "colonize" Scotland - the Scottish successfully kicked the English out several centuries before the act of Union - Scottish Independence from the Kingdom of England was gained during the second war of independence which ended in 1357 - the act of the union was in 1707.

bro, i did not read too much about scotland, as they never revolted or raised against colonization since after William Wallace, i thought Scotland is like Northern Ireland, so excuse me that i misunderstood, i dont say i am god like many think in here !!
i just said that the english crown is Deceiving , because the people that really demand to be free and independence is not SCOTLAND but the suppressed NORTH IRELAND !!
but they dont, they know Scottish people dont care to be independent and many see it not good, so they will Propaganda with "Hey we gaved the scots independence they didnt want-so we are a good government with democracy!!",but no one says those poor Irish people gaved lives & Martyrs to only to reach their independence & Freedom, why you dont give those rights to them ?!! you know, not just north ireland, the republic of ireland reached independence with giving many martyrs and many freedom fighters that were executed or jailed in english prison!! im surprised why those damned monarchs dont leave that little n.ireland !! maybe to show they dont bow to them?!!

[Pannonian]

i know dear friend !! i alwayse appreciate your Tolerance & Understandablity !! i forgot to write, that despite many only know to hate and offense and attack, i have many friends especially in UK in here,and even non-friends that dont insult or offense to anyone just because he does not like his ideas !! cheer to you friend !!



bro, i did not read too much about scotland, as they never revolted or raised against colonization since after William Wallace, i thought Scotland is like Northern Ireland, so excuse me that i misunderstood, i dont say i am god like many think in here !!
i just said that the english crown is Deceiving , because the people that really demand to be free and independence is not SCOTLAND but the suppressed NORTH IRELAND !!
but they dont, they know Scottish people dont care to be independent and many see it not good, so they will Propaganda with "Hey we gaved the scots independence they didnt want-so we are a good government with democracy!!",but no one says those poor Irish people gaved lives & Martyrs to only to reach their independence & Freedom, why you dont give those rights to them ?!! you know, not just north ireland, the republic of ireland reached independence with giving many martyrs and many freedom fighters that were executed or jailed in english prison!! im surprised why those damned monarchs dont leave that little n.ireland !! maybe to show they dont bow to them?!!

Not only are you ignorant about Scotland, you're even more ignorant about Northern Ireland, less forgiveable since it's recent history. England does not deny Northern Ireland its freedom. The British fought in Northern Ireland to maintain the position of letting Northern Ireland have whatever political status it wants. Whether Northern Ireland wants independence, or union with the UK or Ireland, is up to them, a position fought for by the British. If the NI assembly votes for any of these positions, the UK parliament will support its right to choose.

But rather than that, your good self would rather impose a freedom on Northern Ireland as defined by you, which is severance from England. Thus overriding the political wish of the Northern Irish people. I'd like to know where you're from, since democracy and self-determination appear to be alien concepts to you.

[Empire*Of*Media]

Not only are you ignorant about Scotland, you're even more ignorant about Northern Ireland, less forgiveable since it's recent history. England does not deny Northern Ireland its freedom. The British fought in Northern Ireland to maintain the position of letting Northern Ireland have whatever political status it wants. Whether Northern Ireland wants independence, or union with the UK or Ireland, is up to them, a position fought for by the British. If the NI assembly votes for any of these positions, the UK parliament will support its right to choose.

But rather than that, your good self would rather impose a freedom on Northern Ireland as defined by you, which is severance from England. Thus overriding the political wish of the Northern Irish people. I'd like to know where you're from, since democracy and self-determination appear to be alien concepts to you.

please, learn to discuss before you type !!! we have a say in here "The Response of ignorants, is silence" !!
im not have to answer your fully hatred and racist post !!

[Pannonian]

please, learn to discuss before you type !!! we have a say in here "The Response of ignorants, is silence" !!
im not have to answer your fully hatred and racist post !!

Can you point out where the above post is racist? Highlight any sentence, sentences, or part of a sentence, or any combination thereof.

[Empire*Of*Media]

my last post with you in here ,, i think you must read your past posts, and you can see how you insulted Kurds and Kurdistan just because of me you pointed to all AND i said things you dont like !!!
this hows how much your ignorant and hatred is high toward those things you think is unlikely !!

[Hax]

And he considers Muslims stupid for feeling offended all the time.

[Rhyfelwyr]

i know dear friend !! i alwayse appreciate your Tolerance & Understandablity !! i forgot to write, that despite many only know to hate and offense and attack, i have many friends especially in UK in here,and even non-friends that dont insult or offense to anyone just because he does not like his ideas !! cheer to you friend !!

Thank you.

But as for Northern Ireland, I must disagree with you. The conflict there has been between two communities that have both been there long before the United Kingdom came into existence. Generally speaking, Catholics want to be part of the Republic of Ireland, Protestants want to be part of the UK. Protestants have always been the majority, and this is why Northern Ireland did not join the Republic of Ireland when it gained independence.

You might be surprised to learn that the British government is not always sympathetic to the Protestants. For example, Winston Churchill, the WWII war criminal, was chased out of Belfast by a Protestant mob who were angry at his support for ceding Northern Ireland to the Irish Republic. He was actually sheltered by Catholics inside the football ground of Belfast Celtic, because the Protestant mob were ready to kill him!

As for executing Republican prisoners, that happened in the war that gave the Republic of Ireland its independence, but it never happened during the more recent conflict over Northern Ireland. The only prisoner to be executed by the British Government was in fact a Protestant and a unionist! And that happened just 16 years ago.

In saying all this I don't mean to imply that Catholics have not been persecuted - I am simply saying that the conflict is much more complicated than a case of 'freedom fighters' versus the imperialists.

[HoreTore]

16 years? Seriously, 1987?

I thought the last hanging was back in the 60's or something.... And how is that even possible, when EU law prohibits death sentences?

[Rhyfelwyr]

16 years? Seriously, 1987?

I thought the last hanging was back in the 60's or something.... And how is that even possible, when EU law prohibits death sentences?

1997, I thought I was out of touch, lol. It wasn't official obviously.

[HoreTore]

1997, I thought I was out of touch, lol. It wasn't official obviously.

Haha yeah... I'm still living in the good ol' days of 2003, back when I was innocent to the horrors of the world... Anyway, care to expand? How, who and why? My google-fu isn't of much use...

[Pannonian]

I heard of a particularly rabid anti-peace agreement unionist being knifed or something in an alley, with stories going around of the authorities giving his killers the go ahead on the understanding that there would be a blind eye turned to it. Dunno if that's what Rhyfelwyr is referring to.

[Rhyfelwyr]

I heard of a particularly rabid anti-peace agreement unionist being knifed or something in an alley, with stories going around of the authorities giving his killers the go ahead on the understanding that there would be a blind eye turned to it. Dunno if that's what Rhyfelwyr is referring to.

Well that's happened on countless occasions, I'm talking about actively taking part in the murders. The case I am talking about is that of Billy Wright.

[HoreTore]

Well that's happened on countless occasions, I'm talking about actively taking part in the murders. The case I am talking about is that of Billy Wright.

Every time I read about NI, I feel the west looses a bit more of its moral high ground in its dealings with "primitive violence" elsewhere in the world....

The difference with, say, Iraq, is about as low as it can get.

[InsaneApache]

The discourse in the backroom has sunk so very low from it's heyday about 8-9 years ago.

However this thread is priceless, on the same level as that Backtia thingy. Except that was funny.

This is just pointless and sad.

[johnhughthom]

It's unfair to tar all the contributors with that, a number of people have tried to make reasoned posts.

[a completely inoffensive name]

@Empire Of Kurdistan-Medya

I'm sorry for the hostility you have gotten from some of the members here in the backroom, the problem is that we have gotten a few people coming in here for a period of a month or two, who tries to completely control a conversation with a viewpoint that is 99% of the time very ill thought out and ridden with hidden racism or conspiracy theories.

I don't want to pass judgement on anything you have said, I very much disagree with almost you have said but I want to make the effort to have you stick with the backroom and not get fatigued by the constant bombardment of opposing views filled with snark or mean words.

For the most part, any opinion is welcome here, people may disagree but they are willing to challenge it in an honest manner and have a conversation as long as you are open enough to change your views. However, there is some basic internet protocols that must be observed here that I promise will help you get your point across in this forum if you follow them.

1. Don't use any punctuation more than once per sentence. So no "!!!!" or "?!?!". These only serve to give the impression of impatience or excessive passion.

2. Don't call anyone else ignorant or any other name calling. Yes, people in this very thread have done just that to you and others! But they are in the wrong, and while everyone makes mistakes, it ruins the conversation to constantly have it happen within a single thread. If you make a better effort than others in following this rule, you will receive respect a lot faster.

3. It is ok to preface a post with "I don't know" and "From my understanding". It does not hurt your argument in anyway and it also serves to let people know where you are coming from so that they do not misinterpret what you are trying to say.

Example: When you say that Scotland has suffered years of colonization, you should expect some hostility from the residences here who identify as British or even Scottish. Such a statement is very inflammatory unless you make an effort to define the word colonization as you see it first. Otherwise, the conversation (which we have seen) regresses instead of progresses. They need to know why you think Scotland has suffered colonization because to many people, the relationship between Scotland and England has been a very harmonious and peaceful union and that the recent vote for independence is merely some silliness by radical nationalists who wish to take advantage of the current economic situation.


I hope you take this advice, especially point 1 to heart so that we may get some more structured viewpoints from someone who obviously has a unique perspective on world events to share.

[johnhughthom]

Well said, acin.

Empire Of Kurdistan-Medya, I know little about the Kurds, their history, or their situation today. Therefore I do not make sweeping, uninformed statements regarding Kurds or their political status. It's not too much to ask for you to show the same respect in terms of Scottish independence, or the situation in Northern Ireland, subjects on which your knowledge appears to be as extensive as mine on Kurdish history and politics.

Like acin said, it's always nice to hear a fresh perspective, so please don't feel anyone in here hates or insults you. Don't forget it works both ways, as a Northern Irish Unionist, it would be very easy for me to consider some of your remarks as accusing me of being an oppressor. If I can forgive you for that, perhaps you should be a little more forgiving of some of us?

[Strike For The South]

Looks like some of you can't handle a free Kurdistan.

Fascists, the lot of you

[Empire*Of*Media]

dear Rhyfelwyr, the religious conflict is one of the problems, the other is that they are sticked to their republic, but they are in English rule! and i just forgot the name of that freedom fighter that was in jail for more than 25 years and got popular....ah damn it! i really dont remember! but his existence in history shows the Colonization and oppression and dirtiness of English Crown.

Dear a completely inoffensive name, i greatly thank you for your attention and politeness. i surprised your 1st point! i didnt think my punctuations cause some bother! im just habited with that! i hope stop it. and about your 2nd point, im surprised again how you tell that to me!! in non of the posts that i've started, i havnt insulted anybody or calling ignorant by myself.look, when i want a discussion, and when i get offenses and insults in reverse, despite i tolerated it too much to not to attack too , but hey! shouldnt i defend myself ?! when someone insults you you want to calm him down, you do this again and again, but when you see he is attacking again and again with insults and offensive words, wouldnt you defend yourself at last ?!! i had no choice! i have a tolerance limits too, im not Gandhi or Jesus!! i have never said im perfect that you say confess that you dont know, but when someone brings new ideas or perspectives, he/she will always be attacked, and alone. and im very alone here, i just dissaponted with people in so called 1st world! i thought there is a better place! i didnt know there too, is a place that they tell you undirectly how to live & Believe!
at all i thank you at least you could be calm against me and despite you dont agree with me, while i respect that of yours, you stopped being like them to offense!

Dear johnhughthom, i thank yu too friend! i just got really happy saw some in here not narrow-minded and offensive! i always respect ideas that dont hate or assault. and friend, i can always forgive if he/she desist of offensing,insulting,or to impose his liked and favored thoughts and what he THINKS(Suppose!) it is the perfect right! and i ask forgivness to whom i've insulted that if it was by myself started, or it was just defending.

DEAR Strike For The South, i thank you too because of your non-racism and open minded thoughts, indeed you pointed good thing, FASCISTS!!
i think THEY know who is your pointing!! i will not name !!

[Brenus]

“i havnt insulted anybody or calling ignorant by myself” I suggest you to read the post where you are telling me that I am a liar.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

The discourse in the backroom has sunk so very low from it's heyday about 8-9 years ago.

However this thread is priceless, on the same level as that Backtia thingy. Except that was funny.

This is just pointless and sad.

The bactia thing was a hoot, I concur.

I too miss Red Harvest and Gawain and Tribesman bashing heads...quite fun. Red drifted off after Katrina, Gawain never really got back into it after his brother was murdered (r/l) and Tribes got the boot somehow (self?)....sad

[Beskar]

Tribes got the boot somehow (self?)....sad

Tribesman said "Ban member x or I will leave", member x wasn't banned, so he left.

[Strike For The South]

The backroom is nothing but a place were self important, mouth breathing, socially retarded trolls come to opine about their superiority.

Faux libereal, faux high brow circle jerk

[The Lurker Below]

Trolling hard in the paint

You just missed the guy wide open for three.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

The backroom is nothing but a place were self important, mouth breathing, socially retarded trolls come to opine about their superiority.

Faux libereal, faux high brow circle jerk

Oh rubbish - I'm not any kind of Liberal.

To Whit - Empire's charactarisation of Scotland is faulty. It reads the Kurdish experience in the Middle East onto Scotland. The comparison might be applied to Wales or pre-Republican Ireland but not to Scotland after the Act of Union.

The essential point is that Scotland chose to merge with England -it was negotiated and agreed to Scotland's benefit.

[Pannonian]

Oh rubbish - I'm not any kind of Liberal.

To Whit - Empire's charactarisation of Scotland is faulty. It reads the Kurdish experience in the Middle East onto Scotland. The comparison might be applied to Wales or pre-Republican Ireland but not to Scotland after the Act of Union.

The essential point is that Scotland chose to merge with England -it was negotiated and agreed to Scotland's benefit.

The best bit in Empire's version of history was how England occupied Scotland in 1600 AD. Another example of English imperialism, just like how England occupied Normandy in 1066.

[HoreTore]

The best bit in Empire's version of history was how England occupied Scotland in 1600 AD. Another example of English imperialism, just like how England occupied Normandy in 1066.

Yeah, shame on you all.

That was my ancestors prime hunting grounds for fair maidens to ravage, you know!

[Papewaio]

Now with democracy and cheap airfares the maidens fly to you for the hunting in your local.

[Pannonian]

Yeah, shame on you all.

That was my ancestors prime hunting grounds for fair maidens to ravage, you know!

Ah yes, the Norse. Ravaging fair maidens in northern France, and ravishing skinny monks in northern England.

[Samurai Waki]

Stuff Cameron into a cannon and fertilize a lovely field with 'im, and even the Scottish will forget that Scotland exists.