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Thread: Shakespear vs Poe

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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Shakespear vs Poe

    Who is the endboss of English(language) literature. I was discussing it with a mate and we concluded it is either Shakespear, or Poe. He is rooting for Shakespear, I think Poe is the better writer.

    Both epic as can be,

    Merchant of Venice, Shylock speech http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hfA_mKHT1_I
    The Raven, http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cLSmhpwLdEQ

    Take your pick or pick your own

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    Ni dieu ni maître! Senior Member a completely inoffensive name's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Mark Twain.
    In all these papers we see a love of honest work, an aversion to shams, a caution in the enunciation of conclusions, a distrust of rash generalizations and speculations based on uncertain premises. He was never anxious to add one more guess on doubtful matters in the hope of hitting the truth, or what might pass as such for a time, but was always ready to take infinite pains in the most careful testing of every theory. With these qualities was united a modesty which forbade the pushing of his own claims and desired no reputation except the unsought tribute of competent judges.

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    The Black Senior Member Papewaio's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Would have to be an Irishman as they clearly have the best command of the English language.

    Oscar Wilde for starters.
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Quote Originally Posted by Papewaio View Post
    Would have to be an Irishman as they clearly have the best command of the English language.

    Oscar Wilde for starters.
    So I guess we gotta mention George Bernard Shaw in here.

    Also, James Joyce deserves an honorable mention just for the sheer number of words in Ulysses.
    In all these papers we see a love of honest work, an aversion to shams, a caution in the enunciation of conclusions, a distrust of rash generalizations and speculations based on uncertain premises. He was never anxious to add one more guess on doubtful matters in the hope of hitting the truth, or what might pass as such for a time, but was always ready to take infinite pains in the most careful testing of every theory. With these qualities was united a modesty which forbade the pushing of his own claims and desired no reputation except the unsought tribute of competent judges.

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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Now that we are at it, when it comes to French literature we also have issues to solve. Both undecided on who is better, Michel Houellebecq or the Marquis de Sade. Both often misunderstood, black comedy at it's best. Deprived, violent, perverse, and awesome.
    Last edited by Fragony; 08-19-2013 at 10:08.

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    has a Senior Member HoreTore's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    The French is easy, definitely Dumas.



    ...and yes, I know he didn't write all of it himself.
    Still maintain that crying on the pitch should warrant a 3 match ban

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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Quote Originally Posted by HoreTore View Post
    The French is easy, definitely Dumas.



    ...and yes, I know he didn't write all of it himself.
    I wouldn't call that literature, more of an adventure-novel, fun read but it's Hobbit and LOTR-territory. I learned from Django Unchained that he is actually black. Kinda awesome.

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    has a Senior Member HoreTore's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Quote Originally Posted by Fragony View Post
    I wouldn't call that literature, more of an adventure-novel, fun read but it's Hobbit and LOTR-territory. I learned from Django Unchained that he is actually black. Kinda awesome.
    Half-black, mother from the caribbean, with an awesome 'fro. Had a pretty hard time in Paris because of it.

    And Dumas is the king of awesome, throw your pretentious wannabe-litterature like shakespeare and poe in the bin.
    Still maintain that crying on the pitch should warrant a 3 match ban

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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Dylan, not Bob but Thomas.

    Ja-mata TosaInu

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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Quote Originally Posted by HoreTore View Post
    Half-black, mother from the caribbean, with an awesome 'fro. Had a pretty hard time in Paris because of it.

    And Dumas is the king of awesome, throw your pretentious wannabe-litterature like shakespeare and poe in the bin.
    Read it when I was young. Calling Shakespear pretentious I kinda get but it are mostly the people who read it and love it so dearly who are guilty of having pretentions. I am no sucker for classical literature. Nor opera for that matter. Or anything classical in general. I make an exception for the Merchant of Venice, that is awesome. Edgar Allen Poe is a genius though imho. His poem 'The Raven' is just very very good, I pointed it out and I now have 2 bruised ribs.

    This should still be acceptable, arguing about literature, we do it differently https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v...ps32f2a91e.jpg
    Last edited by Fragony; 08-19-2013 at 11:57.

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    Senior Member Senior Member Ser Clegane's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    I think you are taking the term "poetry slam" way too literal...

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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Quote Originally Posted by Ser Clegane View Post
    I think you are taking the term "poetry slam" way too literal...
    My mate feels really deeply that Shakespear is better than Poe. Not going argue with that for at least two weeks.

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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Also belongs here, not by a famous writer but by a soldier at the Somne who couldn't wake up his friend anymore, finito

    http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rgtsg7QXV7Y

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    Formerly Wigferth Ironwall Senior Member Philippus Flavius Homovallumus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Shakespeare is arguably better than Poe, because while Poe was a great Gothic writer, he lacked range. Basically, you either like Gothic writing, or complex detective puzzles, or he has nothing to offer you.

    Shakespeare had great range - and a greater effect on the English language. He was not, however, the greatest of the Elizabethan playwrights, Kidd and Marlowe were both better but Kidd died in the plague and few of Marlowe's plays survived.

    Geoffrey Chaucer requires mention here, for his breadth of writing, his talent, and his influence over the English language (Shakespeare directly plagiarises him).
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    Formerly Wigferth Ironwall Senior Member Philippus Flavius Homovallumus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Quote Originally Posted by HoreTore View Post
    Half-black, mother from the caribbean, with an awesome 'fro. Had a pretty hard time in Paris because of it.

    And Dumas is the king of awesome, throw your pretentious wannabe-litterature like shakespeare and poe in the bin.
    Half-black father, son of a Nobleman and a General in the French army. As far as I know his mother was French. So, he was 1/4 Caribbean, but his mother might have been Creole rather than African, so possibly 1/8.

    Right about the 'fro though.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexandre_Dumas
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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Quote Originally Posted by Philipvs Vallindervs Calicvla View Post
    Shakespeare is arguably better than Poe, because while Poe was a great Gothic writer, he lacked range. Basically, you either like Gothic writing, or complex detective puzzles, or he has nothing to offer you.

    Shakespeare had great range - and a greater effect on the English language.
    Absolutily something to say for that. I like the way constructs sentences it's pure poetry, and there is just something so unnerving about his stories. But if you look at it yor way he is admittingly narrow in scope granted.

    ps, I can't be the only fan of Brett Easton Ellis, any takers.

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    Dux Nova Scotia Member lars573's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Any answer that's not Grant Morrison is wrong.
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Like PVC I see Poe as a one trick pony. Exceedingly good at his trick mind you. Shakespeare does a fair bit more variety than most, that might due to his prodigious collection.

    The full rendition of The Count of Monte Cristo is preposterously admirable.
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    has a Senior Member HoreTore's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Quote Originally Posted by The Lurker Below View Post
    The full rendition of The Count of Monte Cristo is preposterously admirable.
    I believe Hollywood should receive the death penalty for changing the plot in when they made a movie on it; from the brilliant story of revenge, to a simple love story...
    Still maintain that crying on the pitch should warrant a 3 match ban

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    Just another Member rajpoot's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Quote Originally Posted by HoreTore View Post
    I believe Hollywood should receive the death penalty for changing the plot in when they made a movie on it; from the brilliant story of revenge, to a simple love story...
    I had a friend who watched the movie first and then borrowed the book from me and came back a week later saying he preferred the movie.

    Anyway I would like to nominate Stephenie Meyer for the position of the best writer.




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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    I take it we aren't talking about the movie with Gerard Depardieu as that's a pretty good adaptation

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    has a Senior Member HoreTore's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Quote Originally Posted by Fragony View Post
    I take it we aren't talking about the movie with Gerard Depardieu as that's a pretty good adaptation
    That's a tv-series, isn't it? And yeah, I liked it even though it's been many years since I saw it....

    And I believe it was a british/french work, which automatically makes it better.
    Still maintain that crying on the pitch should warrant a 3 match ban

  23. #23

    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    TCMC just isn't interesting. I hate the Romantic tradition.
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    smell the glove Senior Member Major Robert Dump's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Shakespeare was stupid because all the actors talked funny, at least Claire Danes and Leo got it right. Poe just did the same old thing over and over, his best work was when he put his head in the oven.
    Baby Quit Your Cryin' Put Your Clown Britches On!!!

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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Quote Originally Posted by Major Robert Dump View Post
    Shakespeare was stupid because all the actors talked funny, at least Claire Danes and Leo got it right. Poe just did the same old thing over and over, his best work was when he put his head in the oven.
    All his story's are gothic yes, but he wrote a lot more than story's. Lovecraft I would call a one trick pony, even if he's good at genuinly scaring the crap out of you.


    TCMC just isn't interesting. I hate the Romantic tradition.

    Because of the political developments in the period or just the literature?
    Last edited by Fragony; 08-23-2013 at 09:19.

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    Ni dieu ni maître! Senior Member a completely inoffensive name's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    You know what, you are all wrong. I'm finishing up The Hobbit right now and I'm going to change my answer to J. R. R. Tolkien​.
    In all these papers we see a love of honest work, an aversion to shams, a caution in the enunciation of conclusions, a distrust of rash generalizations and speculations based on uncertain premises. He was never anxious to add one more guess on doubtful matters in the hope of hitting the truth, or what might pass as such for a time, but was always ready to take infinite pains in the most careful testing of every theory. With these qualities was united a modesty which forbade the pushing of his own claims and desired no reputation except the unsought tribute of competent judges.

  27. #27

    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Tolkien is lame too. When entire nations -nations! - are judged and found wanting unto death, put to the sword and tooth and claw in the midst of great lamentation and gnashing of teeth, pregnant women carved open and then penetrated through their new openings for the infinite lust of bestial half-breeds, resistance flailing in the face of towering waves of nihilistic force, and - extinguished - coming to naught, should feel... tragic, not sterile.

    The hearts of men should be laid bare in all their avarice, cruelty, wantonness, and sniveling fear, not idealized and glorified. Kings should flaunt their arrogance and impunity in the name of pride, even as impending annihilation stares them and their people and their race in the face.

    Our bones should vibrate with the shuddering of the earth beneath violent thousands, heaving and snarling in the name of a pitiful and forlorn cause. We should hear the ejection of viscera and the crack of bones, smell the unwashed anuses and the rancid armpits and the trampled earth stained with bloody bowel.

    The dying inhuman races whose forebears were ancient even one-thousand generations of men ago should not be anthropomorphized, they should be revealed for the mad things they are - for no such soul could be anything but utterly insane in our parochial eyes.

    A good story has you rooting for the "villains", or else weeping in horror and despair.
    Last edited by Montmorency; 08-23-2013 at 10:05.
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    Ni dieu ni maître! Senior Member a completely inoffensive name's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Quote Originally Posted by Montmorency View Post
    A good story has you rooting for the "villains", or else weeping in horror and despair.
    Nah, I am getting tired of the anti-hero "realism" phase that popular culture has been embracing. It's a reflection of our apathy and our willingness to discredit those who are trying to make a difference as no different than the clearly evil guys they fight.

    Tolkien gives me something that is needed more than ever in today's society. A full heart and hope.
    In all these papers we see a love of honest work, an aversion to shams, a caution in the enunciation of conclusions, a distrust of rash generalizations and speculations based on uncertain premises. He was never anxious to add one more guess on doubtful matters in the hope of hitting the truth, or what might pass as such for a time, but was always ready to take infinite pains in the most careful testing of every theory. With these qualities was united a modesty which forbade the pushing of his own claims and desired no reputation except the unsought tribute of competent judges.

  29. #29
    smell the glove Senior Member Major Robert Dump's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    A full heart and hope

    HAHAHAHAHA


    Stay away from Charles Bukowski books, then
    Baby Quit Your Cryin' Put Your Clown Britches On!!!

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    Ni dieu ni maître! Senior Member a completely inoffensive name's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shakespear vs Poe

    Quote Originally Posted by Major Robert Dump View Post
    A full heart and hope

    HAHAHAHAHA


    Stay away from Charles Bukowski books, then
    I do. I like narratives that provoke me to be constructive and optimistic about the future. It makes me more productive and more extroverted. Cynical and depressing has its place but too much of it and idolizing it as "real" only makes the bleak dystopia become that much closer to reality imo.

    I am not an intellectual, and I am not a literary critic. I am just an average dude who needs a reason to get up in the morning like everyone else. Maybe I understand why Plato was so controlling over the media that his philosopher-kings consumed during their education.
    In all these papers we see a love of honest work, an aversion to shams, a caution in the enunciation of conclusions, a distrust of rash generalizations and speculations based on uncertain premises. He was never anxious to add one more guess on doubtful matters in the hope of hitting the truth, or what might pass as such for a time, but was always ready to take infinite pains in the most careful testing of every theory. With these qualities was united a modesty which forbade the pushing of his own claims and desired no reputation except the unsought tribute of competent judges.

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