Another Gun Control Study

[PanzerJaeger]

If guns aren't the problem you should name the problem and think about what can be done instead of saying nothing can be done, that's defeatist.

Xiahou already identified the problem, and we can't very well ship them back to Africa at this point.

[Husar]

Xiahou already identified the problem, and we can't very well ship them back to Africa at this point.

Oh that's great, now that you're past racism in the USA I guess that's also okay to say.

[ICantSpellDawg]

Oh that's great, now that you're past racism in the USA I guess that's also okay to say.

It is true. In the US we are allowed to say politically incorrect things that are true. As I've stated before, all of America's problems are the result of slavery. Both the importation of forced labor, the dehumanization of those people and the warped culture that has resulted from the trauma.

White subcultures are beginning to mimic the destructive nihilism of America black communities. High out of wedlock birthrates, low educational attainment, high crime rates. While many Black's are trying to get away from this poisonous lifestyle caused largely by mans inhumanity to man, too many whites are eager to take their place. Our homicide rates, even if you extract black and Hispanic high risk populations from the numbers, are still generally a bit higher than western european nations, although homogenous white populations on both sides of the Atlantic are pretty low risk. Violent crime rates for Europeans are much higher than the rates in the American white population, even higher than the rates for all Americans.. White Americans do drive the suicide numbers, but man has a night to kill himself, even though it is immoral to use the right.

I was ok with background checks (even thought they are largely pointless at this stage where everyone owns tons of guns) on all sales in exchange for some gains, but the Democrats can't be trusted to enact anything but a poison pill against gun rights. Unfortunately nobody else understands the art of compromise, its one way or the other. I have nothing against defensive shootings. In the US, people should know that it you assault someone who is alone in the middle of the night, that could be the end of you. Hands to yourself, don't threaten or menace people with violence.

I have no idea how to solve the problem, but I love guns and I love the second amendment, and my (numerous) firearms should never commit a crime, so come and take them.

[Fisherking]

Xiahou already identified the problem, and we can't very well ship them back to Africa at this point.

That is a bad guess.

Oh that's great, now that you're past racism in the USA I guess that's also okay to say.

Hold your horses!

It is the breakdown of the family unit and the rise of a gangster culture if we are tossing out theories. A lack of positive male role models.

This may be more prevalent among modern black males but it is not exclusive to them.

Subcultures that celebrate lawlessness and whacking ones enemies while going out in a blaze of glory.

Instilling such ideals and reinforced by peer pressure is not going to make for a peaceful crime free social network. A society were the heroes shun education, by dropping out of school to get rich selling drugs and killing off the competition (literally) is not going to reduce the crime rate.

It is more a culture of an angry tragic warrior society. Disassembling that is what is needed. It doesn’t matter what weapons are available. Take away one type and you only change their tactics, not their motivation.

How do you foster a sense of community and brotherhood between disparate groups of people who must either live together or resort to barbarism? What creates the bond, or can it be created? I have some ideas, but I'd love to hear yours.

Me too!

[Husar]

Hold your horses!

It is the breakdown of the family unit and the rise of a gangster culture if we are tossing out theories. A lack of positive male role models.

This may be more prevalent among modern black males but it is not exclusive to them.

Subcultures that celebrate lawlessness and whacking ones enemies while going out in a blaze of glory.

Instilling such ideals and reinforced by peer pressure is not going to make for a peaceful crime free social network. A society were the heroes shun education, by dropping out of school to get rich selling drugs and killing off the competition (literally) is not going to reduce the crime rate.

It is more a culture of an angry tragic warrior society. Disassembling that is what is needed. It doesn’t matter what weapons are available. Take away one type and you only change their tactics, not their motivation.

That's a good post, pretty much what I said from the beginning.


The problem with PJ's post is that he seems to blame it all on the blacks and apparently insinuates the only way to solve it is to remove black people from the country. Sending the economoically downtrodden to other countries is what half the third world is trying but it doesn't seem to solve their issues so far. Unless you think the problem is coming from the colour of their skin or their racial heritage, in which case it's pretty much a racist argument.

[Fisherking]

No, it most certainly is not a product of skin color.

The weather gage of a violent society in the past was the number of unmarried young males there were.

With a society that now seems to shun marriage, it has not done much to correct its own ills.

[The Wizard]

The only thing that the article in the OP shows decisively is that the murder rate has to do with much more than the legality of firearms. It emphatically does not show that making guns freely available is A-OK, or that widespread gun ownership has nothing to do with the murder rate.

Very interesting in this regard is an interview Steven Pinker (whom you may know as the guy who published a very successful book which, IMHO, errs on the side of excessive liberal optimism) took of one of my former professors, Pieter Spierenburg. The latter's a historical crimonologist and sociologist who studies the long-term decline of violent crime since the late Middle Ages. It's interesting to note that there's been a slight increase in the rate of violent crime in Western societies since the 1960s, the first rise since the 1400s. A condition of postmodernity?

EDIT: Important, but forgot to mention that there's a long statement on the USA, at 15:00 in the interview recording.

[HopAlongBunny]

Just out of curiosity, how are the finding correlated to lead (Pb) levels?

http://http://www.motherjones.com/en...-link-gasoline

[Husar]

Just out of curiosity, how are the finding correlated to lead (Pb) levels?

http://http://www.motherjones.com/en...-link-gasoline

I brought that up in one of the last gun threads already, I have figured since then that high lead levels are just a result of the American psyche, which is, as most of us seem to agree, the major underlying problem. How to change the American Psyche in regards to lead levels, environmental protection and non-violent problem solving is the real question here. So far sending all black people back to Africa has been proposed and opposed.