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Thread: You want ME to pay? Really?

  1. #1
    Spiritual Jedi Member maestro's Avatar
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    Question You want ME to pay? Really?

    What's with the AI factions in this game?

    I am the largest military might on the planet and some poxy, two-bit nation "offers" me a non-aggression pact. And want me to pay thousands for it? Really?
    I am the largest economic might on the planet and some poxy, two-bit nation "offers" me a trade deal. And want me to pay thousands for it? Really?
    We are at war. I am winning and the enemy has no hope of survival. They offer me a peace treaty. And want me to pay thousands for it? Really?
    They want to say hello. And want me to pay thousands for it? Really?
    I read a book once. And want me to pay thousands for it? Really?
    I took a dump. And want me to pay thousands for it? Really?

    Seriously. Why does the AI insist on making stupid demands for money all the time? They expect you to pay for everything, regardless of circumstance. Why doesn't the AI come begging to the military super power, offering everything they can for survival? Why doesn't the AI try to buy peace instead of selling it? Why does the AI try to offer trade agreements with a 50 turn ROI when we both benefit from just a straight trade agreement?

    Meh.
    Isn't it funny how people trash God and then wonder why the world's going to hell?

  2. #2
    Ranting madman of the .org Senior Member Fly Shoot Champion, Helicopter Champion, Pedestrian Killer Champion, Sharpshooter Champion, NFS Underground Champion Rhyfelwyr's Avatar
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    Default Re: You want ME to pay? Really?

    The AI for diplomacy has never been great in TW games. Remember the old classic from RTW...

    Their Demands: Accept or we will attack
    Their Offers: Please do not attack

    At the end of the day politics is just trash compared to the Gospel.

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  3. #3
    Senior Member Senior Member Barkhorn1x's Avatar
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    Default Re: You want ME to pay? Really?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr View Post
    The AI for diplomacy has never been great in TW games. Remember the old classic from RTW...

    Their Demands: Accept or we will attack
    Their Offers: Please do not attack

    Yep. This game - much like RTW1 - needs a patch.

    "Après moi le déluge"

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    Liar and Trickster Senior Member Andres's Avatar
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    Default Re: You want ME to pay? Really?

    I'd say the AI is an excellent negotiator.

    When you're not in a position to ask anything, you make ridiculous demands, which you then weaken to something more reasonable. At the end, you receive something, while in reality, you should've been glad the other party even bothered talking to you.

    Clearly, the content of your barbarian skull is not able to grasp the refined, advanced and civilised art of diplomacy like the noble and superior AI does.
    Last edited by Andres; 09-16-2013 at 15:14.
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    Nobody expects the Senior Member Lemur's Avatar
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    Default Re: You want ME to pay? Really?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andres View Post
    the refined, advanced and civilised art of diplomacy like the noble and superior AI does.
    Please don't write that sort of thing while I'm still having my morning cuppa coffee. Nearly spit up all over my keyboard and mouse.
    "Those are my principles, and if you don't like them ... well, I have others." — Groucho Marx

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    Οπλίτη Member CaptainCrunch's Avatar
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    Default Re: You want ME to pay? Really?

    Quote Originally Posted by maestro View Post
    ... Seriously. Why does the AI insist on making stupid demands for money all the time? ...
    Can't blame 'em for trying right?

    What campaign difficulty are you playing? I'm on normal and I get paid by the AI on a regular basis... especially for peace treaties, and particularly when they're already at war with at least one other faction. There are of course those few crazies out there that try me on occasion, but overall I get way more money off them, than the other way 'round. Rome paid me over half their treasury to stop blitzing into central Italy once. I like getting grimey with factions I don't like by taking their money to stop my war machine from grinding their bones into dust, and then attacking them a few turns later anyway

    Treacherous destruction for the win!

  7. #7

    Default Re: You want ME to pay? Really?

    I have had them ask for money and also pay out dearly... 89 Turns into playing as Rome right now, Carthage had the balls to request a non aggression pact and an additional 2000! Out of anger I instantly dispatched my fleets and most veteran legion made up of praetorians, veteran legionaries, gladiators, and Velites who throw lighting from there arms and fire from there ass! They came from the Gaelic regions after making the seibu people eat some real German sausage... They sacked carthage and killed every last person there... burning the city to the ground out of spite. Tonight they march on the last remaining strong hold, to enslave the populace and make all know that Rome will not be a puppet of any nation.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Senior Member ReluctantSamurai's Avatar
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    Default Re: You want ME to pay? Really?

    They sacked carthage and killed every last person there... burning the city to the ground out of spite
    The world of fantasy mimicking the real world?











    High Plains Drifter

  9. #9

    Default Re: You want ME to pay? Really?

    Quote Originally Posted by ReluctantSamurai View Post
    The world of fantasy mimicking the real world?
    Lol, I thought same thing. A couple of days ago, I found myself idly wishing that Corinth also existed in the game, just so in some campaign I could arrange a same-year razing of both Carthage and Corinth. I guess I could do it with Larissa or Sparta as closest proxiesy, but just wouldn't be the same...

  10. #10
    Senior Member Senior Member ReluctantSamurai's Avatar
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    Default Re: You want ME to pay? Really?

    I found myself idly wishing that Corinth also existed in the game
    Considering Corinth's role in the history of the Peloponnesus, that's a rather surprising omission by the CA staff
    High Plains Drifter

  11. #11

    Default Re: You want ME to pay? Really?

    You would need a ton of Greek city states then. Not sure if that's a bad thing

  12. #12

    Default Re: You want ME to pay? Really?

    Quote Originally Posted by AntiDamascus View Post
    You would need a ton of Greek city states then. Not sure if that's a bad thing
    Speaking of which, I always liked playing as the Greek factions. Ever since Rome 1 I've thought I'd rather like an expansion/dlc campaign that focuses in more detail on Greece and the surrounding colonized areas during the heroic or (more historically) the classical age. Add in A LOT more of the city states like Corinth and colonies and go into detail with the subtle differences in government and military styles. Maybe a map that ranges from the Rhodes/the coast of Asia Minor to the Western coast of Greece, or even magna grecia if they feel like stretching the map out more. Of course the armies would still be much more similar to each other than in the base game, so maybe the return of Shogun 2 style Hero units for uniqueness, which would probably fit well within the scenario of the Greek heroic age. In fact now that I type this all out it sounds like it could work really well as a total conversion of S2. Too bad I have absolutely no idea how to mod...

    Oh, but back to the original topic. I too see that the diplomats are rather irrational. It's always either threatening me and/or asking for ridiculous sums in exchange for deals, or a random one town faction from the other side of the map will willingly offer to be my vassal even though I'm much too far away to ever reasonably protect them. Though some of it may have to do with the balance of power system. The indicator on diplomacy never seems quite right. I can batter an enemy and destroy 95% of their military but in diplomacy their relative strength is about equal to mine. If this is a factor in their decisions, it could be behind some of the more foolish actions.

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  13. #13
    Liar and Trickster Senior Member Andres's Avatar
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    Default Re: You want ME to pay? Really?

    Quote Originally Posted by Antonius Rex View Post
    Speaking of which, I always liked playing as the Greek factions. Ever since Rome 1 I've thought I'd rather like an expansion/dlc campaign that focuses in more detail on Greece and the surrounding colonized areas during the heroic or (more historically) the classical age. Add in A LOT more of the city states like Corinth and colonies and go into detail with the subtle differences in government and military styles. Maybe a map that ranges from the Rhodes/the coast of Asia Minor to the Western coast of Greece, or even magna grecia if they feel like stretching the map out more. Of course the armies would still be much more similar to each other than in the base game, so maybe the return of Shogun 2 style Hero units for uniqueness, which would probably fit well within the scenario of the Greek heroic age. In fact now that I type this all out it sounds like it could work really well as a total conversion of S2. Too bad I have absolutely no idea how to mod...
    Hello and wecome, @Antonius Rex

    That sounds like an excellent idea for either a conversion mod or stand-alone expansion.

    I consider the similarity of the different units as a plus, since it will lead to a more balanced game. Wasn't fond of Hero units and ended up not using them at all in Shogun II.
    Andres is our Lord and Master and could strike us down with thunderbolts or beer cans at any time. ~Askthepizzaguy

    Ja mata, TosaInu

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