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The roma "trained" Maria to dance for alms
The blond angel was purchased in Greece for 500 euro from a Bulgarian mother
The littel girl which was found in a roma encampment and dubbed "the blond angel" in Greece, was bought for 500 euro from its Bulgarian mother, claims the local press cited by Nova tv.
According to the press, the biological mother of the littel girl resides in Athens, and Bulgarian roma in the region knew enough details to be of help to the investigation.
The police in our southern neighboring state is already working on the version of an existing illegal cannal for smuggling pregnant women from Bulgaria, which then give birth in Greece, after which the children are being sold.
The Greek television Alpha showed video clips of Maria from Youtube:
Youtube Video
In the footage one can see how the little girl was forced to belly dance under the strict gaze of an elderly roma woman, who on several occasons pulls the girl and forces her to dance.
It is assumed that relatives of the couple which has been "taking care of" the child, have spread the footage.
Maria was discovered in a gypsy slum on Wednesday in Farsala in central Greece, and the DNA tests have proven that the man and woman with which the girl lived are not her mother and father.
The director of social services in in Larissa - Kostas Yanopulus. declared that the couple who have abducted the girl have treated her like a "dancing bear".
The director is certain that the innocent child has been savagely exploited for begging.
Greek police states that this Roma family has received over 8000 euro in social care for its 14 children.
***
So?! Germany pays billions of bailout so Greece can feed this scum of society, these parasites that leech 8000 euro per month in social care? People who exploit children and even if given extraordinary amounts of money for free, still choose to live in slums and resort to begging, theft and child trafficking? Please, tell me more about how we must integrate them. No really. Especially our resident Norwegian since "You are idiots and don't know how to integrate them. Gypsies in Norway have university degrees".
The roma "trained" Maria to dance for alms
The blond angel was purchased in Greece for 500 euro from a Bulgarian mother
The littel girl which was found in a roma encampment and dubbed "the blond angel" in Greece, was bought for 500 euro from its Bulgarian mother, claims the local press cited by Nova tv.
According to the press, the biological mother of the littel girl resides in Athens, and Bulgarian roma in the region knew enough details to be of help to the investigation.
The police in our southern neighboring state is already working on the version of an existing illegal cannal for smuggling pregnant women from Bulgaria, which then give birth in Greece, after which the children are being sold.
The Greek television Alpha showed video clips of Maria from Youtube:
Youtube Video
In the footage one can see how the little girl was forced to belly dance under the strict gaze of an elderly roma woman, who on several occasons pulls the girl and forces her to dance.
It is assumed that relatives of the couple which has been "taking care of" the child, have spread the footage.
Maria was discovered in a gypsy slum on Wednesday in Farsala in central Greece, and the DNA tests have proven that the man and woman with which the girl lived are not her mother and father.
The director of social services in in Larissa - Kostas Yanopulus. declared that the couple who have abducted the girl have treated her like a "dancing bear".
The director is certain that the innocent child has been savagely exploited for begging.
Greek police states that this Roma family has received over 8000 euro in social care for its 14 children.
***
So?! Germany pays billions of bailout so Greece can feed this scum of society, these parasites that leech 8000 euro per month in social care? People who exploit children and even if given extraordinary amounts of money for free, still choose to live in slums and resort to begging, theft and child trafficking? Please, tell me more about how we must integrate them. No really. Especially our resident Norwegian since "You are idiots and don't know how to integrate them. Gypsies in Norway have university degrees".
Look at the bright side, she's still too young to prostitute. She looks like she comes from Scandinavia she has very Nordic features
If your blood simmers... let it cool before taking action. (Harald Hårfagre)
I have watched this case and the Bulgarian spin on this is new.. It might be one of the several leads they mention in our news.
One theory is that this is a kid born in Greece by a Scandinavian decent parent (father.. no mother mentioned) and that allegedly died at birth. The parents suspected fishiness and demanded the grave opened, whereupon they found it empty. The girl apparently looks like children in his family and was born/died in 2009. Father demands DNA test... (although our articles says that one was taken to prove that the captors was not her parents).
This is just an example of history. We were warned as children that the gypsies will take you if you walk too far off "our street". I guess it is rooted in something.
I have watched this case and the Bulgarian spin on this is new.. It might be one of the several leads they mention in our news.
One theory is that this is a kid born in Greece by a Scandinavian decent parent (father.. no mother mentioned) and that allegedly died at birth. The parents suspected fishiness and demanded the grave opened, whereupon they found it empty. The girl apparently looks like children in his family and was born/died in 2009. Father demands DNA test... (although our articles says that one was taken to prove that the captors was not her parents).
This is just an example of history. We were warned as children that the gypsies will take you if you walk too far off "our street". I guess it is rooted in something.
Young children are blonde around that age. Later on their hair goes darker (at least in Bulgaria). Me at 5 years of age - I was a curly, blond haired kid. Now I'm chestnut/auburn coloured. Her ethnicity doesn't matter - there are blond, blue eyed ethnic Bulgarians (coutresy of our Slavic blood mix). What matters is that yet again, the gypsies are the one doing this crap. They're the ones who live in slums, mooching off of wellfare and conditioning young children to beg, to be used to being sold (gypsies here have a habit of purchasing adolescent brides) and worse.
And if anyone brings this up (God forbid if we ask for the law to crack down on thefts being unanswered, 13 year old gypsy mothers giving birthe etc.) we have 50 Soros funded NPOs and a number of EU comissions saying ""Noo! Noo! Do not discriminate them. Integrate them!
So how do we integarate them? Give them free housing - they turn brand new apartment blocks into derilict slums that make post-war Berlin look like current day NYC. Give them free utilities? Force them to send their children to school? Give them free money so they can produce 14 chilren and live off welfare? Why isn't another ethnic part of Balkan society in such a condition? Ethinc Bulgarians and Romaians go to the western countries to work and be educated (especially the German education opportunites are wonderful). Ethnic gypsies go to live in slums and steal (like in France) or even eat the swans swimming in Enlgish parks.
Uh oh, it's the education man! It's the racism! Surely.
And if anyone brings this up (God forbid if we ask for the law to crack down on thefts being unanswered, 13 year old gypsy mothers giving birthe etc.) we have 50 Soros funded NPOs and a number of EU comissions saying ""Noo! Noo! Do not discriminate them. Integrate them!
So how do we integarate them? Give them free housing - they turn brand new apartment blocks into derilict slums that make post-war Berlin look like current day NYC. Give them free utilities? Force them to send their children to school? Give them free money so they can produce 14 chilren and live off welfare? Why isn't another ethnic part of Balkan society in such a condition? Ethinc Bulgarians and Romaians go to the western countries to work and be educated (especially the German education opportunites are wonderful). Ethnic gypsies go to live in slums and steal (like in France) or even eat the swans swimming in Enlgish parks.
Uh oh, it's the education man! It's the racism! Surely.
Originally Posted by Sigurd:
This is just an example of history. We were warned as children that the gypsies will take you if you walk too far off "our street". I guess it is rooted in something.
What's to fear, you get to go to Norway and get a degree.This is just an example of history. We were warned as children that the gypsies will take you if you walk too far off "our street". I guess it is rooted in something.
Of course you won't be a victim of organ trade or prostitution. I also can't stress enough that you won't be sitting all drugged up a subway-station in Paris with amputated legs.
Originally Posted by Myth:
So?! Germany pays billions of bailout so Greece can feed this scum of society, these parasites that leech 8000 euro per month in social care? People who exploit children and even if given extraordinary amounts of money for free, still choose to live in slums and resort to begging, theft and child trafficking? Please, tell me more about how we must integrate them. No really. Especially our resident Norwegian since "You are idiots and don't know how to integrate them. Gypsies in Norway have university degrees".
Did the fact that the child was bought from a Bulgarian child trafficker(in your story) completely escape you while you were ranting?So?! Germany pays billions of bailout so Greece can feed this scum of society, these parasites that leech 8000 euro per month in social care? People who exploit children and even if given extraordinary amounts of money for free, still choose to live in slums and resort to begging, theft and child trafficking? Please, tell me more about how we must integrate them. No really. Especially our resident Norwegian since "You are idiots and don't know how to integrate them. Gypsies in Norway have university degrees".
Also, the only Bulgarians working here are prostitutes anyway. Let's burn down those evil Bulgarian pimps now, eh? Where's NATO when you need 'em?
Child trafficker? The stoy says her own mother sold her, which is another problem entirely. The only Bulgarians working there are prostitutes? What about those MBA gypsies you were talking about? Or do you just conveniently forgot? Want me to remind you? Bulgarians study and work in Germany. So do Turks, and Armenians, and anyone else who actually wants to study/work! Not these parasites though, they're too good for this. It's better to get free stuff and stick to what they know.
That there are cheap eastern European prostitutes (not just Bulgarian) that are mostly victims of human trafficking and abuse is as much our society's problem as it is YOURS (since you are the ones providing demand and not caring how it's supplied).
And do you have anything to say in defence of the "innocent, misunderstood Roma who are abused by idiot estern European countries and not integrated like in glorious Norway"? Anything to say of them leeching 8000 euro in social care and still doing stuff like this? Anything to say that this is the norm for them but not for virtually any other ethinic minority in Europe?
That there are cheap eastern European prostitutes (not just Bulgarian) that are mostly victims of human trafficking and abuse is as much our society's problem as it is YOURS (since you are the ones providing demand and not caring how it's supplied).
And do you have anything to say in defence of the "innocent, misunderstood Roma who are abused by idiot estern European countries and not integrated like in glorious Norway"? Anything to say of them leeching 8000 euro in social care and still doing stuff like this? Anything to say that this is the norm for them but not for virtually any other ethinic minority in Europe?
Originally Posted by HoreTore:
Did the fact that the child was bought from a Bulgarian child trafficker(in your story) completely escape you while you were ranting?
Did the fact (in his story) that they bought a child escape your judgement on human trading? Work in sex industry anyway? The sun is always shining in the land of unicorns and rainbows I suppose, screw reality in scandirapia for free, woosh, it's gone. The sadness of one of the most cynical trades in the world gone, prestoDid the fact that the child was bought from a Bulgarian child trafficker(in your story) completely escape you while you were ranting?
Update, I was probably right she is probably Norwegian. The father was told she was dead and demanded the grave to be opened, it was empty. He is now making work of it.
Originally Posted by HoreTore:
In Scandinavia, Roma take higher education.
In Bulgaria, Roma does not take higher education.
Yeah, you'd need to be a genius to figure that one out...
In Scandinavia, Roma take higher education.
In Bulgaria, Roma does not take higher education.
Yeah, you'd need to be a genius to figure that one out...
Originally Posted by HoreTore:
Hilarious.
I have no idea if any Roma get higher education in Bulgaria. Given the regimes there, it wouldn't surprise me that much if the number was zero or close to zero.
In civilized states built on enlightenment and law as opposed to tribalism and oppression however, Roma do attend university and integrate into society.
Can you get some distinquished roma scholars to comment on them buying kids and living off wellfare in Greece and other countries outside Bulgaria? I'm sure Prof. Dr. Mango or Dipl.-Ing. Asan will have some very good comments on this.Hilarious.
I have no idea if any Roma get higher education in Bulgaria. Given the regimes there, it wouldn't surprise me that much if the number was zero or close to zero.
In civilized states built on enlightenment and law as opposed to tribalism and oppression however, Roma do attend university and integrate into society.
Frags can you post some relevant news articles?
Originally Posted by Myth:
Can you get some distinquished roma scholars to comment on them buying kids and living off wellfare in Greece and other countries outside Bulgaria? I'm sure Prof. Dr. Mango or Dipl.-Ing. Asan will have some very good comments on this.
Frags can you post some relevant news articles?
Ha I got family in Denmark and Norway, Horetore is kinda full of it, they behave there exactly as they do at your place.Can you get some distinquished roma scholars to comment on them buying kids and living off wellfare in Greece and other countries outside Bulgaria? I'm sure Prof. Dr. Mango or Dipl.-Ing. Asan will have some very good comments on this.
Frags can you post some relevant news articles?
One difference though, they call it 'criminal French'. Those are the Roma's France kicked out.
Gotta love Scandinavia and their political correctness
8000 Euros a month for fourteen children. So about $6 per child per meal plus clothes plus warmth plus etc.
8000 might feed 14 kids if properly used. But there isn't going to be much left for clothing and housing.
8000 might feed 14 kids if properly used. But there isn't going to be much left for clothing and housing.
Originally Posted by Papewaio:
8000 Euros a month for fourteen children. So about $6 per child per meal plus clothes plus warmth plus etc.
8000 might feed 14 kids if properly used. But there isn't going to be much left for clothing and housing.
Nope. The prices for food in Greece are identical to (and sometimes lower) than those in Bulgaria. I have friends and colleagues who go to rent villas in Greece and shop in their supermarkets and cook/barbeque for themselves. Feeding one person is more expensive than two people, believe it or not, since cooking for one rarley makes sense.8000 Euros a month for fourteen children. So about $6 per child per meal plus clothes plus warmth plus etc.
8000 might feed 14 kids if properly used. But there isn't going to be much left for clothing and housing.
So increasing the members in a family does not exponentially increase the cost for food. Sure it goes up, but it diminishes per person, since cooking large quantities of food is actually more cost effective. Making a huge bowl of soup or a cooked meal can feed 14 people just fine at a relatively low cost. 8000 euro is PLENTY. Sure they won't be the most well-dressed, but they will be warm and fed if old man Ahmet didn't drink hard liquor and smoke 2 packs of cigarettes costing 5 euro each per day.
8000 euro is 16000 leva in Bulgaria. Feeding a 14 person family with home cooked meals would cost about 3000 leva per month (1500 euro. And I said, prices are similar in Greece). That leaves a whopping 6500 euro for clothes, utility bills, rent and whatnot, excluding any income the parents may have. Seriously. Shopping a trunk full of food in a store would cost you about 100 euro tops, if you stay awy from luxury stuff like liquour, fine wine, imported cheese and so on. That could last you for 3 days probably, depending on how and what you cook.
Can't deny that Myth has some points... the Karoli family comes to mind, as does those who travel around despite having apartments in Oslo.
Usually summertime they hitch their trailers on to their Mercedes and comes to the west coast, settles down on a camping site and... well Myth explained it. BUT I think they are bad apples as there are bad apples in every case.
Luckily have have personal knowledge of fresh apples both from Romania and Bulgaria working in Norway.
I am not too worked up by this... It only gives evidence of criminal specimen in a larger group of people which is quite normal.
Usually summertime they hitch their trailers on to their Mercedes and comes to the west coast, settles down on a camping site and... well Myth explained it. BUT I think they are bad apples as there are bad apples in every case.
Luckily have have personal knowledge of fresh apples both from Romania and Bulgaria working in Norway.
I am not too worked up by this... It only gives evidence of criminal specimen in a larger group of people which is quite normal.
Originally Posted by Papewaio:
8000 Euros a month for fourteen children. So about $6 per child per meal plus clothes plus warmth plus etc.
8000 might feed 14 kids if properly used. But there isn't going to be much left for clothing and housing.
Get less children. In romenia they used to cut out the plumbing after it got too insane and we were all ohohoh but it's a pretty good idea if they keep throwing out what we don't need. So let's cap any aid at 2, no benefits after that.8000 Euros a month for fourteen children. So about $6 per child per meal plus clothes plus warmth plus etc.
8000 might feed 14 kids if properly used. But there isn't going to be much left for clothing and housing.
About the 14 kids... In our news, the Greek police couldn't find that many children at the residence of the culprits and local politicians is quite upset that it is too easy to register kids to parents in Greece. Apparently there are no safety checks.
And there will always be people who will exploit benefits. But let's not make it too hard to receive benefits because of exploits. The benefit program has become quite the nightmare here for people genuinely deserving it.
I had a few rounds in the system when I got sick back in 2010 but gave it up... I couldn't fight a rigid system designed to fight abuse. The state owes me a few months worth of support.. but it is not worth fighting the system for it. And I am not suffering as I have other means. But those who really need it and have to fight... I genuinely feel sorry for them. I'd vote for a less rigid system despite it being easier to abuse. So let these people have their 8000 Euro as long as others who need the same get them as easily.
And there will always be people who will exploit benefits. But let's not make it too hard to receive benefits because of exploits. The benefit program has become quite the nightmare here for people genuinely deserving it.
I had a few rounds in the system when I got sick back in 2010 but gave it up... I couldn't fight a rigid system designed to fight abuse. The state owes me a few months worth of support.. but it is not worth fighting the system for it. And I am not suffering as I have other means. But those who really need it and have to fight... I genuinely feel sorry for them. I'd vote for a less rigid system despite it being easier to abuse. So let these people have their 8000 Euro as long as others who need the same get them as easily.
Originally Posted by Sigurd:
About the 14 kids... In our news, the Greek police couldn't find that many children at the residence of the culprits and local politicians is quite upset that it is too easy to register kids to parents in Greece. Apparently there are no safety checks.
Just for your consideration, this what the houses of the end of the foodchain look like About the 14 kids... In our news, the Greek police couldn't find that many children at the residence of the culprits and local politicians is quite upset that it is too easy to register kids to parents in Greece. Apparently there are no safety checks.
http://updatedhome.com/architectural...gypsy-castles/
You will find many more if you google 'gypsie castles'
Originally Posted by Fragony:
Just for your consideration, this what the houses of the end of the foodchain look like
http://updatedhome.com/architectural...gypsy-castles/
You will find many more if you google 'gypsie castles'
Linked blocked on my network.. but google gave some ideas. Just for your consideration, this what the houses of the end of the foodchain look like
http://updatedhome.com/architectural...gypsy-castles/
You will find many more if you google 'gypsie castles'
Let them have their extravaganza. Fizzil laughed at me when I told him how much I paid to build my house. He said I could have gotten two palaces in UAE.
Let the Romanian authorities worry about this, I wouldn't be caught dead in a house like that or in a Mercedes...
Originally Posted by Sigurd:
Linked blocked on my network.. but google gave some ideas.
Let them have their extravaganza. Fizzil laughed at me when I told him how much I paid to build my house. He said I could have gotten two palaces in UAE.
Let the Romanian authorities worry about this, I wouldn't be caught dead in a house like that or in a Mercedes...
Not my *ahum* taste either. But there are hundreds of these, it are criminal organisations.Linked blocked on my network.. but google gave some ideas.
Let them have their extravaganza. Fizzil laughed at me when I told him how much I paid to build my house. He said I could have gotten two palaces in UAE.
Let the Romanian authorities worry about this, I wouldn't be caught dead in a house like that or in a Mercedes...
Kinda curious why that link was blocked though, but alas, it's Norway they think different about freedom of speech and logical conclusions there.
They have criminal French.
Oh Gypsies...
Originally Posted by Myth:
Child trafficker? The stoy says her own mother sold her, which is another problem entirely. The only Bulgarians working there are prostitutes? What about those MBA gypsies you were talking about? Or do you just conveniently forgot? Want me to remind you? Bulgarians study and work in Germany. So do Turks, and Armenians, and anyone else who actually wants to study/work! Not these parasites though, they're too good for this. It's better to get free stuff and stick to what they know.
That there are cheap eastern European prostitutes (not just Bulgarian) that are mostly victims of human trafficking and abuse is as much our society's problem as it is YOURS (since you are the ones providing demand and not caring how it's supplied).
And do you have anything to say in defence of the "innocent, misunderstood Roma who are abused by idiot estern European countries and not integrated like in glorious Norway"? Anything to say of them leeching 8000 euro in social care and still doing stuff like this? Anything to say that this is the norm for them but not for virtually any other ethinic minority in Europe?
I have very little to say to ignorant racists who believe in the craziest stuff on the planet, like the US government bombing WTC. I don't see any need to have an actual conversation with people who are looking for delusions instead of facts.Child trafficker? The stoy says her own mother sold her, which is another problem entirely. The only Bulgarians working there are prostitutes? What about those MBA gypsies you were talking about? Or do you just conveniently forgot? Want me to remind you? Bulgarians study and work in Germany. So do Turks, and Armenians, and anyone else who actually wants to study/work! Not these parasites though, they're too good for this. It's better to get free stuff and stick to what they know.
That there are cheap eastern European prostitutes (not just Bulgarian) that are mostly victims of human trafficking and abuse is as much our society's problem as it is YOURS (since you are the ones providing demand and not caring how it's supplied).
And do you have anything to say in defence of the "innocent, misunderstood Roma who are abused by idiot estern European countries and not integrated like in glorious Norway"? Anything to say of them leeching 8000 euro in social care and still doing stuff like this? Anything to say that this is the norm for them but not for virtually any other ethinic minority in Europe?
And I still find it hilarious how you manage to say that a mother selling her child is not a child trafficker.
edited.
edited
edited
Funny as it is to read... I believe we should up the argument sans ad hominem.
Originally Posted by Sigurd:
Funny as it is to read... I believe we should up the argument sans ad hominem.
What good what that be, I wouldn't be able to compare Norway to the Shephord Wives if I can't offend anyone, that's just cruel.Funny as it is to read... I believe we should up the argument sans ad hominem.
Originally Posted by Fragony:
What good what that be, I wouldn't be able to compare Norway to the Shephord Wives if I can't offend anyone, that's just cruel.
Frolic with the nation as much as you like... but personal insults is just so yesterday.What good what that be, I wouldn't be able to compare Norway to the Shephord Wives if I can't offend anyone, that's just cruel.
Originally Posted by Myth:
... Turns out (surprise, surprise) he doesn't know jack and he resorts to logical fallacies to get out of uncomfortable arguments (and he does this constantly).
Just mention Vålerenga and you got him by the horns (also called insult by proxy).... Turns out (surprise, surprise) he doesn't know jack and he resorts to logical fallacies to get out of uncomfortable arguments (and he does this constantly).
Originally Posted by Sigurd:
Just mention Vålerenga and you got him by the horns (also called insult by proxy).
Why?Just mention Vålerenga and you got him by the horns (also called insult by proxy).
I is back, and he will lead us to the promised land eventually. What matters now is to ensure that the (censored) in Nedre Pukerud don't steal the gold away from moustacheland.
Well, as Horetore correctly notes, this is human/child trafficking pure and simple. It is a crime to be on either end of such a market exchange because of our basic belief -- acknowledged virtually everywhere -- that humans are not and should not be treated as property.
Sadly, the selling of one's children by poor families -- particularly the girl children -- has a long and cross-cultural history. Moreover, one of the saddest elements is that the sellers often believe, because of their own poverty-stricken status in most cases, that they are doing "the right thing" for their child. Sad.
Sadly, the selling of one's children by poor families -- particularly the girl children -- has a long and cross-cultural history. Moreover, one of the saddest elements is that the sellers often believe, because of their own poverty-stricken status in most cases, that they are doing "the right thing" for their child. Sad.
I can understand that you consider the gypsy way of life odd compared to that of the rest of us. Perhaps, I can even come to understand how one deems it difficult to match with our way of living.
But to go from there, taking the brush of the gypsie child trafficker and then paint an entire group of people as teh evil, goes a step too far and reeks of blatant racism.
It's one thing to express an opinion on the problems, difficulties and tensions our completely different ways of life may cause, but it becomes something completely different if you start demonising the entire group and depict them as evil creatures.
Regardless of opinions or viewpoints, no more ad hominems or this thread gets locked.
But to go from there, taking the brush of the gypsie child trafficker and then paint an entire group of people as teh evil, goes a step too far and reeks of blatant racism.
It's one thing to express an opinion on the problems, difficulties and tensions our completely different ways of life may cause, but it becomes something completely different if you start demonising the entire group and depict them as evil creatures.
Regardless of opinions or viewpoints, no more ad hominems or this thread gets locked.
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