responding to common objections to bible part 7

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

I am sorry but i am not sure what your saying so i will respond to what i think your arguing, that the bible is not the only religious book of Prophecy, and it does not Prophecy because it does not mention the fall of troy.


could you name another book with Prophecy,clear fulfilled Prophecy? a religious book claiming to be gods word? specific Prophecy like the bible has?


troy? why must it? if it was only a book of Prophecy and mentioned everything in future, than you could ask this. But it is gods word to us on salvation with Prophecy in it. Having it not mention one thing [it does not about of allot of things to come] does not take away from what it does.

The recorded Prophecies of the Oracle at Delphi, to name one, were said to predict the fall of Troy and the coming of the "Sea Peoples" who overthrew the Civilisation that Moses knew, yet the Bible says nothing about these people - for all that they laid low Mycenae, Krete, and Egypt, possibly even the Hittites.

Later prophecies foretold the coming of the Persians into Greece and their eventual defeat.

This also, is not recorded in the Bible.

The prophecies in the Bible are only the prophecies of the People of Israel.

[total relism]

The recorded Prophecies of the Oracle at Delphi, to name one, were said to predict the fall of Troy and the coming of the "Sea Peoples" who overthrew the Civilisation that Moses knew, yet the Bible says nothing about these people - for all that they laid low Mycenae, Krete, and Egypt, possibly even the Hittites.

Later prophecies foretold the coming of the Persians into Greece and their eventual defeat.

This also, is not recorded in the Bible.

The prophecies in the Bible are only the prophecies of the People of Israel.

would you mind showing me specifics of these oracles? when first written and when fulfilled, just what they actually say. However the bible does mention Alexander, but even if the bible only contains prophecies of isreal or concerning isreal/messiah, how does that not make it a prophetic work?. If there is true accurate fortellings by this other writing, i am very interested. I would love to see them if you can provide for me.

[Pannonian]

would you mind showing me specifics of these oracles? when first written and when fulfilled, just what they actually say. However the bible does mention Alexander, but even if the bible only contains prophecies of isreal or concerning isreal/messiah, how does that not make it a prophetic work?. If there is true accurate fortellings by this other writing, i am very interested. I would love to see them if you can provide for me.

I'd have thought that someone who is posting in a TW fan forum would be familiar with at least some of the Delphic oracles. Such as the one about wooden walls. Or the one about the King falling in battle. Or indeed the one about the crippled King. That's just a few off the top of my head, which generated considerable discussion at the time, so we know the timings of these oracles. And we certainly know how events turned out.

Also, if the bible is indeed a prophetic work for the people of Israel, and the Delphic oracle also a prophetic work of equal accuracy for the Greek people, does this mean the divine power behind the Delphic oracle is no less valid than the divine power behind the biblical prophecies? Does this mean, gasp, that the biblical god is not the only god out there with oracular credibility?

[total relism]

I'd have thought that someone who is posting in a TW fan forum would be familiar with at least some of the Delphic oracles. Such as the one about wooden walls. Or the one about the King falling in battle. Or indeed the one about the crippled King. That's just a few off the top of my head, which generated considerable discussion at the time, so we know the timings of these oracles. And we certainly know how events turned out.

Also, if the bible is indeed a prophetic work for the people of Israel, and the Delphic oracle also a prophetic work of equal accuracy for the Greek people, does this mean the divine power behind the Delphic oracle is no less valid than the divine power behind the biblical prophecies? Does this mean, gasp, that the biblical god is not the only god out there with oracular credibility?

I must confess i have never heard of delphic b-4. I would say to your question, first we need to see these delphic claims, investigate them.

[HoreTore]

I must confess i have never heard of delphic b-4. I would say to your question, first we need to see these delphic claims, investigate them.

What Greek literature(besides the bible, obviously) have you read, then?

Wiki has an easily accessible article on the subject.

Anyway. Just like several religions have ex nihilo creation myths, so do several religions have prophecies as a central part of their religious practice and beliefs, like the Romans, the Greeks, heck even New Age is big on prophecy. Their claims of prophecy are as "accurate" as those of the bible.

[Pannonian]

What Greek literature(besides the bible, obviously) have you read, then?

Wiki has an easily accessible article on the subject.

Anyway. Just like several religions have ex nihilo creation myths, so do several religions have prophecies as a central part of their religious practice and beliefs, like the Romans, the Greeks, heck even New Age is big on prophecy. Their claims are as "accurate" as those of the bible.

Apparently the 300 refers to the number of Philistines Samson killed when he pulled those pillars down, and Themistocles is the name of the arch enemies of the Bionicles.

[Pannonian]

I must confess i have never heard of delphic b-4. I would say to your question, first we need to see these delphic claims, investigate them.

Bloody hell, investigate these Delphic oracles? People have already formed policies and fought and won/lost wars and kingdoms based on them. I daresay there has been far more historical study of the events surrounding these oracles than there has been of the events surrounding the biblical prophecies. Are there any concrete pieces of evidence dating back to when any of the biblical prophecies were made, with accurately dated historical records confirming the existence of the prophecy story, and the response to it? Because we know about the wooden walls oracle, and we have concrete proof of Athenian action based on their interpretation of that oracle, which we can date to within a year of the oracle being made (since we know the sequence of events in detail).

[total relism]

What Greek literature(besides the bible, obviously) have you read, then?

Wiki has an easily accessible article on the subject.

Anyway. Just like several religions have ex nihilo creation myths, so do several religions have prophecies as a central part of their religious practice and beliefs, like the Romans, the Greeks, heck even New Age is big on prophecy. Their claims of prophecy are as "accurate" as those of the bible.

you have yet to provide any creation of time/space/matter. You have provided none. as for oracles, i read first few they did not seem to fit a prediction or give time and fulfillment. Could you please provide the best one you have, with time written, than time fulfilled?, in same life time while could be true, does not count,.

Bloody hell, investigate these Delphic oracles? People have already formed policies and fought and won/lost wars and kingdoms based on them. I daresay there has been far more historical study of the events surrounding these oracles than there has been of the events surrounding the biblical prophecies. Are there any concrete pieces of evidence dating back to when any of the biblical prophecies were made, with accurately dated historical records confirming the existence of the prophecy story, and the response to it? Because we know about the wooden walls oracle, and we have concrete proof of Athenian action based on their interpretation of that oracle, which we can date to within a year of the oracle being made (since we know the sequence of events in detail).

I figured you were messing with me b-4. good laugh.

[HoreTore]

Could you please provide the best one you have

No, you will have to do that job yourself.

We're here to laugh at your ignorance, not educate you.

(and Pannonian has already given the most famous one anyway)

[Pannonian]

you have yet to provide any creation of time/space/matter. You have provided none. as for oracles, i read first few they did not seem to fit a prediction or give time and fulfillment. Could you please provide the best one you have, with time written, than time fulfilled?, in same life time while could be true, does not count,

In the same lifetime does not count? Are you aware that Greek states formed policies based on these oracles?

Example 1:
Athens sends to Delphi for an oracle seeking for advice on what to do about the coming Persian invasion. The oracle tells them to put their faith in their wooden walls. The Athenian strategists debate what this means. Some side with the interpretation that they should defend their city walls and make a stand on the Acropolis. Themistocles suggests that the wooden walls refers to their navy, Eventually they take this interpretation, and evacuate the whole of the Athenian population to Troizen across the bay, and if need be, elsewhere. Athens, left empty, is burned by the Persians. However, the Athenian strategy, based on their reading of the oracle, makes itself felt, as the military strength of the Greeks and principally the Athenians, transferred to their ships, defeats the Persians in the naval battle of Salamis. Thus we have the oracle, the discussion of the oracle and the formation of policy based on the oracle, and the fulfilment of the oracle.

Is there anything so substantial in the historical concerning the prophecies of the bible? Another oracle from that time resulted in Leonidas leading his 300 Spartans to Thermopylae to make a stand. We know the historicity of that stand because Alexander referred to it when he sent back 300 suits of Persian armour after Granicus, with a note singling out the Spartans for their absence.

Go read some history books. Heck, go read some books that aren't the bible.

[Kadagar_AV]

you have yet to provide any creation of time/space/matter.

As have you.

Ignorant rambling does not equate proving the bible shows a perfect understanding of the universe. I am just guessing here, but I don't believe knowledge of physics to be your strongest ability.

[Idaho]

I just started reading the bible. I got as far as Genesis 1.29. Cool. I'm off to plant some ganga and opium.

[Brenus]

“notice what he did there, he avoided all presented,made more baseless claims [jews copied] avoided the clear fact he had never read the two by his earlier statment made”.
Ahhh, now we are in the “smear” campaign… Hmm: I will make it clear (as I did but apparently TR English is becoming deficient): I read in FRENCH the Book of Gilgamesh.
Now, TR is so corned (and up-set) than he resorts to claim that I am lying, and he KNOWS my intention.
I present all evidences that the Book of Gilgamesh and the Bible are very similar and explain why some details had changed (language and adaptation from Poly to Monotheism).
All what your so-called studies just do the same than you, thinking that repetition make truth. I read them (not all, I confess, too boring and all this non-sense…, in English and in French).

TR, for info, the Flood never happened. It is a tale, a Myth.
I do not give more value to the account of Gilgamesh or the one from the Bible.

You prefer to avoid reality and run away from contradiction in your own books in order to keep for faith. It is what I said from the start, and you prove my “predictions” true more than I was expecting, thanks.

[Sarmatian]

I must confess i have never heard of delphic b-4. I would say to your question, first we need to see these delphic claims, investigate them.

Long story short, there were these people called the Delphs, who everyone hated and wanted to destroy. Their most prominent emperor, Fabulous II, built the oracles to warn them of the Persian invasion.