ISIS on the offensive in Iraq

[Crandar]

http://rudaw.net/english/interview/29092014
As our Turkish friend used to say, colour me surprised.

In the meantime, the caliphate's ministry of propaganda is pretty busy.

[Fragony]

He's from Iran if we are talking about our resident Kurd. But there is something fishy about the drawlines situated on the Kurdish territories.

[GenosseGeneral]

The whole strategy seems to hinge on the locals being up to the combat side of the mission. Just wondering, did the Kurds ever actually get the weapons they were promised? (you know, to put them on some kind of parity with ISIS?)

From what I know, they currently train kurds over here to use MILAN missiles. Afterwards they will get those, as they were aged surplus anyway and delivering them to Kurdistan is cheaper than dismantling them in accordance with European environmental standards.

[HoreTore]

Chop chop cut *gurggle* another day another head. War-reporters know the risk but this man was there to help. Even Al Quaida asked for his release. Rest in peace in pieces.

Meh, savages.

Still no number, eh?

[Fragony]

Still no number, eh?

Not that hard to find. Could be that you are too leftist to actualy see it, I never know with leftist people if they ignore facts or that they just can't register them.

[a completely inoffensive name]

The day I can read the validity and reliability tests that demonstrate beyond reasonable doubt that someone has developed a culture-neutral measurement instrument for IQ, then we can start considering these kinds of comparatives.

Until that point, we are more or less trying to calculate the weight of a bag of oranges using a meter stick.

Are you telling me that that Facebook test where I identified which polygon would appear next was wrong in saying I am the smartest man alive?

[Husar]

Not that hard to find. Could be that you are too leftist to actualy see it, I never know with leftist people if they ignore facts or that they just can't register them.

Do you even know what number he is talking about?

Hint: It's still the number that he asked for several pages ago and that you still haven't given.

You say all kinds of things, but none of them answer this important question, I never know whether you just ignore those important questions or whether you just can't register them...

[Fragony]

Ask again, not going to read 25 pages for a post I may have missed

[HoreTore]

Ask again, not going to read 25 pages for a post I may have missed

You're cute when you're clueless.

[Fragony]

You're cute when you're clueless.

I am cute by default, what was your question

[HoreTore]

I am cute by default, what was your question

How large the difference in IQ has to be in order to notice a difference between people. Since this is the 7th time I've asked it, I'll just give the answer:

You need to move beyond one standard deviation to notice a slight difference between two people. 2 standard deviations is (easily) noticeable.

Now, a couple more questions for you:

1. How large is one standard deviation on the IQ scale in absolute numbers, assuming a 200 point scale with a 100 point average?

2. Lynn's map includes several countries with an IQ average of 70 or below. How many people in the world have an IQ of 70 and below?

EDIT: To make things easier, here's a picture you might find helpful:

[Noncommunist]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...yria-town.html

Now a Kurd is doing a suicide attack against ISIS.

[CrossLOPER]

How large the difference in IQ has to be in order to notice a difference between people...

Why do you people keep giving him attention? He has been doing this on this forum site as well as others for at least a decade.

Let me make it clear for you: You are indulging his fetish. You keep doing it over and over and over again. You know exactly how he is going to respond and what he is going to say and yet you continue to press him for some sort of coherency while he continues giving vague side-steps like he always does.

Why would you do that?

[HoreTore]

Why would you do that?

Maybe that's my fetish?

[Fragony]

How large the difference in IQ has to be in order to notice a difference between people. Since this is the 7th time I've asked it, I'll just give the answer:

You need to move beyond one standard deviation to notice a slight difference between two people. 2 standard deviations is (easily) noticeable.

Now, a couple more questions for you:

1. How large is one standard deviation on the IQ scale in absolute numbers, assuming a 200 point scale with a 100 point average?

2. Lynn's map includes several countries with an IQ average of 70 or below. How many people in the world have an IQ of 70 and below?

EDIT: To make things easier, here's a picture you might find helpful:

Been a while since I used one of these baby's, I forgot how substitution works, so I just say that I can't answer it.

I would say we take the third generation who are on a level playing field, and see how they do (poorly).

[HoreTore]

Been a while since I used one of these baby's, I forgot how substitution works, so I just say that I can't answer it.

I would say we take the third generation who are on a level playing field, and see how they do (poorly).

No we can't, since IQ is just one a shitton of factors determining academic success.

The average Mensa member is a plumber, for example.

EDIT: I'll give another answer then.

One standard deviation is the first notation away from the zero(either direction) in the above picture. On the IQ scale, this means +/- 15 points, or an IQ range of 85 to 115 where there is no noticeable difference. This accounts for 68.2% of the human population. The second notation is 2 standard deviations. This is the ranges 70 to 85 and 115 to 130. Here you will find a noticeable difference from the average. The lower range is a bit slower, the higher range is a bit sharper. In terms of education, the lower range is likely to receive some additional support in some subjects, while the higher range is going to show good to exceptional ability in a limited number of subjects. This range covers 27.2% of the population. Combined with the group, this makes 95.4% of the world population. Now for the remaining 4.6%:

This is where you will see a large difference. The ones with an IQ of more than 130 will show exceptional ability in almost all subjects. The higher up you go, the greater the chance that there's something else going on as well which is going to screw them up. At my school we get a few of these, roughly 1 student in every year group. The student who graduated 2 years ago was extremely capable in just about anything, capable of high-level mathematics, learning Korean fluently in 3 months(because "she started listening to k-pop"), writing stories with complex plots in a single lesson, and so on. She is now on her second year in a mental institution. We have one in the oldest class this year as well. Last year, the class learned Solid Works, an engineering 3d-modelling tool. They got around a month to create a 3d-model chair along with an investigation and reflections. A couple of days after the submission deadline, she turned up at the teachers office with a large stack of papers. It was her understanding that the teacher didn't really know the program(we got an engineer to teach it), so she figured she'd make a 60 page instruction manual on how to use the program. She's doing fine currently, but we're expecting a mental breakdown in late November.

The other end of the scale, the 70 and below group, consists of the mentally retarded. An IQ below 70 is one of the criteria for conditions like Down's syndrome, and you will be submitted to a special education school or offered an assistant in every class.

Combined, these two groups consists of 280 million people. The number of people with an IQ below 70 is 140 million. Looking at Lynn's chart, he has a number of countries listed with an average IQ of 70 and below. From the looks of it, roughly 1 billion people lives in these countries. Assuming normal distribution, that means he believes 500 million people have an IQ below 70.

This is impossible. You can't have 500 million people with an IQ below 70, as the number of people with an IQ below 70 is exactly 140 million(rounded off). Assuming all people with an IQ under 70 are Muslims(clearly false, as Christians do have Down's), this can only make up one tenth of the Muslim population.


The issue isn't that you're "provocative", Fragony. The issue is that what you're saying doesn't make any kind of sense. It is clearly false, and you are simply not knowledgeable enough to understand why it's false.

[Fragony]

No we can't, since IQ is just one a shitton of factors determining academic success.

The average Mensa member is a plumber, for example.

Than why ask me a number, that's impossible to calculate. That map just shows the average of the results of tests per nation, determening factore aren't on it. It's only a small part of a much broader theory. I haven't read Lynn's books myself mind you.

But also in western countries some ethnic groups perform worse, that's not something I just make up just to be annoying.

[HoreTore]

Than why ask me a number, that's impossible to calculate.

No, it's not. See my edit above.

[Fragony]

No, it's not. See my edit above.

Where did I say all (short answer to a long explanation). What I said is that people from muslim countries have lower IQ on average. Nobody disputes that. The how and the why you can wrap around where you want, but nobody also disputes the effects of inbreeding, and nobody disputes that people from islamic countries marry their own family A LOT, which leads to all sorts of problems.

[Husar]

Than why ask me a number, that's impossible to calculate. That map just shows the average of the results of tests per nation, determening factore aren't on it.

I think what HoreTore is saying, is that either the map is completely made up or his IQ tests were completely broken.

Where are the numbers from? Who tested the people and why can the map only be found on racist sites?
If the numbers do not hold up against a shallow statistical test, one has to ask these questions and the map alone gives absolutely no answer to them.

It seems unlikely that Mr. Lynn went around the world and tested a statistically significant number of people in each country. So how did he get his numbers? Using the "established science" of head measurements?

[Fragony]

I think what HoreTore is saying, is that either the map is completely made up or his IQ tests were completely broken.

Where are the numbers from? Who tested the people and why can the map only be found on racist sites?
If the numbers do not hold up against a shallow statistical test, one has to ask these questions and the map alone gives absolutely no answer to them.

It seems unlikely that Mr. Lynn went around the world and tested a statistically significant number of people in each country. So how did he get his numbers? Using the "established science" of head measurements?

Don't know where he got them from, but is it surprising that racist sites host, was my bad to link it from one. Lynn's work is not without anyone disagreeing on the methods, won't argue with that. I don't know how he got them, but they are pretty much in line with the global development index.

Edit: also controversial but written by Harvard professors http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bell_Curve

[HoreTore]

Where did I say all (short answer to a long explanation). What I said is that people from muslim countries have lower IQ on average. Nobody disputes that. The how and the why you can wrap around where you want, but nobody also disputes the effects of inbreeding, and nobody disputes that people from islamic countries marry their own family A LOT, which leads to all sorts of problems.

Inbreeding in terms of cousin marriage does not cause a lowered IQ, i*m afraid. You will have to go to sibling marriage to get that.

[HoreTore]

I think what HoreTore is saying, is that either the map is completely made up or his IQ tests were completely broken.

It's debunked nonsense, nothing more. It has no value at all. Not only is it wrong, it doesn't even make any sense.

2+2=5 is wrong. Lynn's work is more in the area of 2+Zebra=koala bear.

[Fragony]

Inbreeding in terms of cousin marriage does not cause a lowered IQ, i*m afraid. You will have to go to sibling marriage to get that.

Nonsense and you know that, it's just one of the many problems with cousin-marriages.

Pick any source http://www.nature.com/nature/journal.../266440a0.html

[Sir Moody]

Actually it goes beyond that - Lynn's work has been utterly debunked as cherry picked rubbish.

For a good example the number he used for the "average" Ethiopian was actually not taken from any group living in Ethiopia but taken from Ethiopian immigrants to Israel...

You can "prove" just about anything if you cherry pick data like that.

[HoreTore]

Nonsense and you know that, it's just one of the many problems with cousin-marriages.

Pick any source http://www.nature.com/nature/journal.../266440a0.html

Yes, now dig deeper to discover the actual mechanics, rates and causes. And find an actual source.

Cousin marriage does have negative effects, but they are completely over-hyped and nowhere near large enough to bring down a population.

If it was, humanity would have been doomed 50.000 years ago. Cousin marriage has been the norm through 99% of human history. If it spelled doom, we would've been dead a long time ago.

[Fragony]

Actually it goes beyond that - Lynn's work has been utterly debunked as cherry picked rubbish.

For a good example the number he used for the "average" Ethiopian was actually not taken from any group living in Ethiopia but taken from Ethiopian immigrants to Israel...

You can "prove" just about anything if you cherry pick data like that.

Heard about that one before, does not deserve a price for intellectual integrity. There are more things that are critisised. Wouldn't call it utterly debunked. He answers to his critics in IQ and Global Inequality. Only read about it, not the book itself.

[Crandar]

He's from Iran if we are talking about our resident Kurd.

Yes, I know that, but I was actually talking about another user from twcenter.

Meanwhile, in the Sultanate:
http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/ank...&NewsCatID=510

So, he would like the PYD to be allied with the F.S.A.

By the way, a quick quiz, what's the similarity between the Free Syrian Army and the Holy Roman Empire?

[Kagemusha]

Where did I say all (short answer to a long explanation). What I said is that people from muslim countries have lower IQ on average. Nobody disputes that. The how and the why you can wrap around where you want, but nobody also disputes the effects of inbreeding, and nobody disputes that people from islamic countries marry their own family A LOT, which leads to all sorts of problems.

If inbreeding is such an issue. You must think Finland being the worst country in Europe as 80% of Finnish genes are from single North European population and from modern nationalities Finns are closest to Cro- Magnons in terms of anthropological measurements.
We also have largest percentage of light eyes and light hair colour in our population, so the so called "European" features seem to imply directly at inbreeding. Damned shame if i would give 5 cents about eugenics. No...just no.

[HoreTore]

If inbreeding is such an issue. You must think Finland being the worst country in Europe as 80% of Finnish genes are from single North European population and from modern nationalities Finns are closest to Cro- Magnons in terms of anthropological measurements.
We also have largest percentage of light eyes and light hair colour in our population, so the so called "European" features seem to imply directly at inbreeding. Damned shame if i would give 5 cents of eugenics. No...just no.

That's why you're ranked at the bottom in every PISA test.



No, wait.