New SS 6.4 HS: preparations thread (2 turns per week)

[yuonyuon]

That's what I thougt so... My game won't load this save, anyone has any tips before I re-install it all?

i guess your installation is done wrong

you need expansion: kingdoms

[Tonno]

It says in the FAQ of SS that you don't need it.
I can play sing. games, but I can't load up the HS save. It starts to load and then it just redirects me to the main menu.

[sonnet]

It says in the FAQ of SS that you don't need it.
I can play sing. games, but I can't load up the HS save. It starts to load and then it just redirects me to the main menu.

maybe you need the patch 1.4?

[Tonno]

In the FAQ says I don't need.
But I'll do it tomorow. It's a free day for me.

[Myth]

You absolutely do need Kingdoms for SS to function. Many of it's features are available only in Kingdoms, and some of the units are based on Kingdoms units. It's even hosted in the Kingdoms modifications page on the TWC.

[ebs]

Block 13 ? why is AI ?

[Myth]

The instructions were to keep the Cumans, K-shah and Mongols Ai. I haven't touched them either. @sonnet can you shed some light on this?

[yuonyuon]

Block 13 ? why is AI ?

we need two more players.(England and Persia) there is to much comfort for the Turks :))

i got to say the save is great with a little exceptions(KOJ and Italians )

And that 2 first turn of peace just worsen the situation for the small factions . that gives time to bigger ones to reform

one it s just enough.

[sonnet]

The instructions were to keep the Cumans, K-shah and Mongols Ai. I haven't touched them either. @sonnet can you shed some light on this?

I mentioned it already that I couldn't find a player for the last block .
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...post2053599179

@Myth: again thanks fro your work, but if possible could you rerun the save from the begin?
All I ask is that you run it for about 50 turns, and add -only if needed - no more than one stack to those factions only : Castille-Portugal-TO-Venice-Genoa-Lithuania-HRE, and -again only if they're too powerful call a crusade-jihad on France/Egypt,then make it run for 10-15 more turns until it passes turn 60.
With this save, too many units were added. In particular, KoJ has too many Templar Guards : those are too powerful in AR, really too powerful. If the player decides to choose KoJ rather than Egypt, he could wipe out half Europe. Vikings factions got too many armies too, and given their good position, again if the player for that block chooses Denmark it will be too easy for him to expand.
Moreover some factions got units with high experience (like 5) that could be retrained and kept forever. Something that would give an unfair advantage over the others (many have received units with high exp -like russians got dismounted druzhina-, but someone will keep those as they're cost effective, some other player won't because the units with higher exp aren't cost effective.
That's why I wrote to limit the addition of units to max one stack only for the factions I indicated -and only if needed- and give no experience.
The too many armies, might make the campaign too short for some players without giving him the chance to build up his own campaign. The purpose of the skip-a-few is to have more developed factions that can sustain larger armies and a random setup, but still the player has to build those, rather than having everything already totally set.

I know it took lot of your time, but rerunning shouldn't take much more, as you know everything there's need to know, and you only have to let it auto-run for about 50 turns, then on turn 50 add-if needed some units for the factions I indicated- and again keep running until it passes turn 60.

we need two more players.(England and Persia) there is to much comfort for the Turks :))

i got to say the save is great with a little exceptions(KOJ and Italians )

And that 2 first turn of peace just worsen the situation for the small factions . that gives time to bigger ones to reform

one it s just enough.

I think you didn't see the turkish situation, otherwise you'd see that Turks are in such bad situation that Kwarezm might wipe them out.
In this HS there's only Auto-resolve, so the AI won't be easily beaten. And in Turkish case, Kwarezm have higher power, without having to be concerned about any other neighbor (unlike the Turks).

[Lord Luka]

I think Legourou is England.He shouldn't be absent for more than a day or 2 now.Hopefully he will be able to play regularly after that.

I am not sure if Persia/Mongols/Cumans are viable to play since they haven't been checked.We also don't have another reliable player for them.As far as i am concerned the map cutoff is good enough.

I disagree about the 1 turn peace.I think 2 turns are neccesarry since most of the Catholic factions have an army on the crusade and they would need 2 turns at least to move them back to somewhere safe.Also the rule only applies for human factions and not AI so the smaller factions can just as well bash AI and solidify their position just as the bigger ones.
I also think that the crusade that is in progress should be canceled.
I do agree about KoJ. Those stacks are ridiculous.

One more thing about the rules.I would like to add a rule that forbids destroying buildings in settlements unless you own the settlement for at least 3 turns.That way you won't be able to take the city, destroy it's guild and inn and leave it.
Also i would prefer to see that FM could also be assassinated.But that's just my preference.

[sonnet]

One more thing about the rules.I would like to add a rule that forbids destroying buildings in settlements unless you own the settlement for at least 3 turns.That way you won't be able to take the city, destroy it's guild and inn and leave it.
Also i would prefer to see that FM could also be assassinated.But that's just my preference.

Buildings can't be destroyed at all.
Guilds and inns are exceptions for 2 different reasons:
-Guilds: a player should have the right to choose which guild to have in a certain settlement. So he needs to be able to destroy it in case he wants a different one.
-Inns: they give bad traits to governors. So if a player believe he doesn't need a inn in that settlement, he should be allowed to destroy it.

Yes 2 turns should be fine. We tested it already in Beyond the dark (which also was a skip-a-few) and it was fine.

About Legourou: yes it seems that he'll be back ,so at the most we can sub him for the 1st turn if needed (faction choice will be England 'cause Scotland is simply too hard, regardless of the setup it has a too weak unit-roaster, and it's only suitable to extremely experienced players looking for extreme challenges).


About removing the Templer guards: best thing imo is to rerun the save and only add very few units only to the factions I mentioned if needed. The reason is that if we now start modifying this save under requests we won't get out of it, as anyone will have its own request and in the end someone will be left unhappy (as surely not all the requests will be accepted and for each request accepted there will be someone who will be unhappy). That's why i wanted the intervetion on turn 50 to be kept on the minimum necessary.

[Myth]

It's funny that Jerusalem had 4 golden chevroned TG when I opened the save. The AI had raised and saved them all on its own. I just added more of them to help a player contend wtih Egypt which has so much stuff.

OK, no problem, I'll run it again and be more restrained with adding units. I'm learning this as well, since I haven't ran such a game before (we did a skip through when trying a Mongols .vs the rest game, but we didn't add or remove units).

The problem with Denmark and Norway is that they had very few and very beaten down units. And I'm not sure where Denmark would expand to, as the TO, HRE and the two factions on the british isles are pretty strong too.

[sonnet]

[QUOT]E=Myth;2053599771It's funny that Jerusalem had 4 golden chevroned TG when I opened the save. The AI had raised and saved them all on its own. I just added more of them to help a player contend wtih Egypt which has so much stuff.[/QUOTE]
No, I gave some of them (like 25 of them) at the start.
That's because it's the only way KoJ can survive, since those units are so powerful that can withstand the multiple invasions of Egypt and Jihads too. In the past Skip a Few I set, I tried many times giving KoJ stacks with different units, but they all failed to survive more than 30 turns. Usually a Jihad on Jerusalem is called around turn 20 and KoJ collpases. Only those Templar Guards can do the trick.
The AI can't make it by itself because those are "Citadel" units (you need an armoury to recruit them, the AI makes no exception)

OK, no problem, I'll run it again and be more restrained with adding units. I'm learning this as well, since I haven't ran such a game before (we did a skip through when trying a Mongols .vs the rest game, but we didn't add or remove units).

Don't worry and thanks for your dedication. I had myself to run multiple times in the past and to make this script to get an hanging of how to balance it.

The problem with Denmark and Norway is that they had very few and very beaten down units. And I'm not sure where Denmark would expand to, as the TO, HRE and the two factions on the British isles are pretty strong too.

Denmark and Norway are in a very good position, you don't need to worry about them, because with the 2 turns of peace a player has all the time needed to recruit the necessary units to defend itself. And those factions have an already overpowered unit-roaster, compared to factions like TO or Lithuania (those are good but not as good as the vikings). This skip-a-few is a shortcut to skip all the turns players spend into waiting their settlements upgrade (to get faster recruitment rate, which in SS is very slow on castles and cities, and much higher on Large cities and Fortresses. And in a HS having a high recruitment rate is important as units are lost much faster than in a sp campaign).
But it's still up to the player to make those armies. So having armies it's not important, it's important that settlements upgraded so that players can quickly build armies if they want to

Another example I could make is England: even if it's in a bad situation, its powerful unit roaster+the splendid position along with the 2 of peace the player will start with make so that it's a faction that doesn't need help no matter what's happening to her. Even in the worst case scenario (which I have never seen) that Scotland takes over the British island the player can still choose to take Scotland. So there's no problem in that area.
The only issue are (but only to be checked and intervene once on turn 50):
1-Castille/Portugal: that's because in some simulation, Castille dies and Portugal remains very weak. So in that case the player has only the option to play with a very weak Portugal. That's why, in case it's needed you should give 1 stack (of units like swordsmen militia/jinetes/pavise crossbowmen and 3-4 santiago units, all without experience) on turn 50 and if Portugal and Castille are at war, makes them ally.
2-HRE: the issue here is that France in some simulations takes over HRE. In this case (if france is taking over HRE) the problem is to reinforce HRE to not let France to get too strong. In this case you should give an army composed by zweihanders to the nearest settlements on the French borders. The same apply if one of the Viking factions is getting too strong at the expense of HRE.
3-Venice-Genoa: those factions in some simulations do quite badly. In that case give them a stack of voulgier-genoese crossbow militia (Genoa) or venetian heavy infantry-venetian archers (to venice) where they need the most.
4-TO/Lithuania: in some simulation they don't do well (lithuania gets annihilated if a crusade is called against it in the first 50 turns). On turn 50 if they're at war between each other, make them allies. And give them one stack of units (swords brethern for TO, lithuanian regular spearmen for Lithuania) and put those in settlements where they can expand against other factions.

Last thing very important: after you intervene on turn 50 let all the factions run under control of the AI for at least 10 turns.
Those are the past 2 Skip a few I set up:
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...1#post10597498
And this:
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...1#post12466523

You can run the saves if you like to get an idea.

[LooseCannon1]

In the FAQ says I don't need.
But I'll do it tomorow. It's a free day for me.

You need the 1.5 patch installed. Your data is different than the game save which is why you get kicked back to the main menu.

I can take Kwarzmem if the Caliph promises not to put his first target on my back.

[Tonno]

Yep... I forgot to edit the files to lock off HS... did everything all over again for nothing, smart me.

Soo... we wait for new save?

[sonnet]

You need the 1.5 patch installed. Your data is different than the game save which is why you get kicked back to the main menu.

I can take Kwarzmem if the Caliph promises not to put his first target on my back.

Did you read the first post? (about playing twice a week the same day on a fixed schedule).
If you read it, than pls let me know asap your preferred time to play.
Here's the schedule:
if you could play after midnight (time in london) (between 18:00-24:00 time in Dallas ) it will be very easy to fix you.

Pls let me know asap since eventually I'd have to modify the descr.strat before Myth remake the save.
If you join you'll choose between Mongols-Kwarezm and Cumans (you'll evaluate which factions is in better shape)

[LooseCannon1]

Did you read the first post? (about playing twice a week the same day on a fixed schedule).

Of course, as a local mod I read every post in the main hotseat forum at twc. Some later than others. But I read both first post (here and there) before a second post was made.

If you read it, than pls let me know asap your preferred time to play.
Here's the schedule:
if you could play after midnight (time in london) (between 18:00-24:00 time in Dallas ) it will be very easy to fix you.

Pls let me know asap since eventually I'd have to modify the descr.strat before Myth remake the save.
If you join you'll choose between Mongols-Kwarezm and Cumans (you'll evaluate which factions is in better shape)

The Mongol recruitable roster is terrible. Below fortress level they have nothing.

[sonnet]

Ok guys, I confirm we have a player for the Mongols-Kwarezm-Cumans block.
So the whole map will be playable

The new schedule
day 1:(Tuesday and Friday) [00:00-13:00] Venice-Milan Core7-inside [08:00-21:00, time in Bangkok]
[13:00-17:00] Norway-Denmark Gaius Octavianus [15:00-19:00, time in Bucharest]
[17:00-21:00] Novgorod-kiev Makrell [18:00-22:00, Time in Oslo ]
[21:00-00:00] Moors-Sicily EBS [23:00-05:00, time in Sofia]
[00:00-06:00] Mongols-Kwarezm-Cumans [19:00-01:00, time in Tampa]

day 2:(Wednesday and Saturday) [06:00-12:00] Turks Sonnet
[15:00-19:00] koJ-fatmid Dur3x [17:00-21:00, time in Bucharest]
[19:00-23:00] Castille-Port Yuonyuon [21:00-01:00, time in Bucharest]
[23:00-06:00] England-Scotland Emproment

day 3:(Thursday and Sunday) [06:00-10:00] HRE-Poland Tonno [07:00-11:00,time in Zagreb ]
[10:00-15:30] France- Aragon Jiub [12:00-18:00,time in Bucharest]
[16:00-19:30] ERE-Hungary Lord Luka [17:00-20:30,time in
[19:30-24:00] TO-Lithuania Vipman [21:30-01:00,time in Bucharest]


I also adapted the files for the new player list.
I got a very balanced map which would require nearly no corrections.
http://www.mediafire.com/view/myfiles/#xefav87spn70oo5

Here the files:
http://www.mediafire.com/download/zb...ou39j/HS14.zip

And here is the save I got on turn 56:
https://www.mediafire.com/?ww9mau4ayaqeoj0


So I asked Myth to run 3 times the game with those files and then choose the most balanced map.
Hopefully out of 3 trials he will get something similar, without thus need to work on it (or with very small corrections)

[sonnet]

Of course, as a local mod I read every post in the main hotseat forum at twc. Some later than others. But I read both first post (here and there) before a second post was made.
The Mongol recruitable roster is terrible. Below fortress level they have nothing.

With a skip a few, there will be many fortresses (usually past turn 60 90% of all the castles have upgraded to fortresses)

[Tonno]

I got a very balanced map which would require nearly no corrections.
http://www.mediafire.com/view/myfiles/#xefav87spn70oo5

Here the files:
http://www.mediafire.com/download/zb...ou39j/HS14.zip

What do I need to do with this?

[sonnet]

What do I need to do with this?

Nothing I just posted the results of my last trial and the files associated with it.

[Tonno]

Ok.
I don't lake the save. Poland is weak! :D
I take that back. Poland is solid :D

[sonnet]

Ok.
I don't lake the save. Poland is weak! :D
I take that back. Poland is solid :D

In that save surprisingly HRE is very strong and it's still a possible choice for you.

[Tonno]

In that save surprisingly HRE is very strong and it's still a possible choice for you.

Just saw it. I wanted to give it a shot with Poland.
If we stick with this save, I'll give it shot.

Poor Jerusalem will be eaten up.

[Myth]

Running a new one now guys. Stick around for an hour or so.

[Tonno]

Still waiting... or this annunciation was just a myth... ;)

[Myth]

Unfortunately, the new file Invicta provided I think is actually the vanilla file. Very unbalanced result. KoJ, ERE and HRE are gone, Venice down to 1 city etc. Since the turn order was vanillaesque, i think he mistakenly sent me the vanilla fine in the new archive.

Even more unfortunately, I'm leaving tomorrow with no access to this PC until Sunday.

[LooseCannon1]

Unfortunately, the new file Invicta provided I think is actually the vanilla file. Very unbalanced result. KoJ, ERE and HRE are gone, Venice down to 1 city etc. Since the turn order was vanillaesque, i think he mistakenly sent me the vanilla fine in the new archive.

Even more unfortunately, I'm leaving tomorrow with no access to this PC until Sunday.

There are a few more lines of code in the descr_strat but 800 less in the campaign_script. The turn order is the same at the top of descr_script but in the main part of descr_strat the turn order is TO-Lithuania-Venice where the regular file goes Venice -Sicily-Milan so I think they are different files. It may just be bad rolls on the RNG. Did you try running it 3 times?

[Myth]

No, he sent me other files via PM to accomodate the inclusion of the K-shah in them. I ran it only once as I needed my PC for something else, so the 50 turns took a while. Invicta assures me he has sent me the correct files. I will check again and run it on Sunday, and If you guys don't want to wait I'd be willing to co-admin and somoene else take over.

[sonnet]

No, he sent me other files via PM to accomodate the inclusion of the K-shah in them. I ran it only once as I needed my PC for something else, so the 50 turns took a while. Invicta assures me he has sent me the correct files. I will check again and run it on Sunday, and If you guys don't want to wait I'd be willing to co-admin and somoene else take over.

The ones I sent via pm are supposed to me the same link to mediafire I posted here.
Unfortunately I don't know how to check the pm I sent in this forum to see if the 2 links match (I can see the pm I sent but not the content of them..if anyone can help me on this I'd be grateful )