How do you solve a problem like Tanais?

[williamsiddell]

The problem with Tanais starts the minute you take it. As with others. I'm looking for a solution better than stuffing with units (and other than ZPG). Aye, landlocked cities can be a disappointment. Money makes the world go round - except in RTW that is.

[Vincent Butler]

As ReluctantSamurai has stated, whatever works for you. Usually it is the same cities that cause problems. The only one that regularly kicks me out is Corduba. I will keep in mind what Samurai said, I never really tried to achieve ZPG, just assumed there was no real way to stop population growth without increasing unrest, ie, raising taxes.

[ReluctantSamurai]

I'm looking for a solution better than stuffing with units (and other than ZPG)

There are only several ways to control unrest, AFAICS:

Manipulate the tax rate. This hits a dead end eventually when even at the lowest rate, loyalty continues to drop.

Have a family member with very high influence. This works until that member dies, and there are no guarantees you'll get another like him. Most of my field generals accumulate a pile of influence laurels...but I'd rather have them out expanding my empire than stuck in a city.

Increase your native cultural influence through the building queue. This works well if you can capture a city that has lots of building projects to do. But by mid to late game, many cities already have the maximum governors building (which is the building that has the greatest impact on loyalty). Upgrading other structures if possible helps, but it is the governing building that makes the biggest impact.

Allow revolt>exterminate...rinse and repeat as needed. This is counterproductive to your stated aim of achieving maximum income. Less people=less taxes. If you're getting revolts before the desired end-point in population numbers, then extermination is a very bad method to adopt. There are also inherent risks, as has already been mentioned. If the previous owners faction is still alive (and its not always possible to eliminate them before you start having loyalty problems) then you could see your entire garrison wiped out or at the least, badly mauled by the super units created by allowing the city to revolt.

Zero Population Growth. This is nearly foolproof, and can be done with just about every faction on the board...certainly by any of the "major" factions like Rome, the Greek factions, Egypt, Carthage, and just about every barbarian faction or eastern factions. When a city has reached its maximum potential (24k for major factions, 12k for all the others), there is no point to allowing further population growth. The few tax monies you gain from super-huge cities is not worth the aggravation of keeping those populations under control. Tax money pales in comparison to port trading anyways, so why bother squeezing for a few thousand extra denarii when your treasury contains hundreds of thousands or even millions of denarii??

Me....I'd rather do without the headaches, concentrate on expanding my empire through conquest, rake in the many thousands of denarii I'm already making, with the supreme confidence that I don't ever have to worry about one single revolt anywhere in the territories I've already conquered.

Now if you can figure out another system other than those I've mentioned for controlling population loyalty, then I'm all ears because noone I've ever been involved with in discussions about this, has figured out another way either. And I'm speaking of not resorting to modding to create a "loyalty" structure to get the job done. I've already proved that isn't necessary.

[williamsiddell]

Very much appreciated RS - I think more or less says it all. And I don't want to go about changing the system files.

Manipulate the tax rate - and low tax rate increases growth.

Have a family member with very high influence - and my experience is if you leave a good general in a city it picks up negative attributes.

Let me put it this way - I'm not hopeful of finding an alternative :)

[Vincent Butler]

It seems that for a while after I eliminate a faction, the settlements I took from them get really upset. Are their spies still active, or is this just coincidence. Also, has anyone else ever had a rebel diplomat come to them and offer a ceasefire? It is not rare with me, and the rebel armies, including the brigands, leave your trade alone, and the rebels will not blockade your ports.

[ReluctantSamurai]

Are their spies still active, or is this just coincidence.

When a faction is eliminated, all of their agents go with them into obscurity. There may be some ground units, including generals, that remain and become rebel, as do any naval fleets.

Also, has anyone else ever had a rebel diplomat come to them and offer a ceasefire?

Are you kidding? On VH, for the campaign map, rebels will lay siege to your cities if you let wayward stacks consolidate into a full army, especially if there is a commanding general present. They almost always spawn right on roads between settlements, and if you let smaller fleets gather into a much larger one, they will blockade the nearest port.

So no, I've never had peaceful dealings with brigands

[Vincent Butler]

Oh, they blockade my ports and will spawn on the roads ordinarily. I have had a rebel diplomats come up and offer ceasefires multiple times, and when they do, I take it. That way, they do not interfere with my trade and they leave my ports and my armies alone. Usually the ceasefire is broken when I get kicked out of a town and it reverts to rebel. Or I decide I need one of their settlements. If at war with them, I prefer to deal with them when they pop up, sometimes I will have a cav-heavy (including worthless generals) army specifically to deal with them.