Morality

[Vincent Butler]

I discourage firearms ownership among my friends who drink, have another substance abuse problem, are hotheads, seem prone to depression. I advise anyone with children to keep firearms either out of the house or locked away like Fort Knox.

There are already laws in America involving drinking and firearms. I would say don't drink. How many crimes and accidents of all natures are alcohol-related? More children drown in the bathtub than die from accidental gunshot wounds. We need to teach responsibility, for with every right comes a responsibility. It is my right to own a gun; it is my responsibility to make sure that it functions, and that I know how to operate it safely. Also we need to teach them morality, which has been removed from the schools. If we tell them that it is wrong to do something, such as kill people, we should tell them why it is wrong. It is my right to vote; it is my responsibility to know what the candidates stand for. Especially relevant today as it is a primary election day. And please, stop talking about democracy. Democracy leads to anarchy, where everybody's rights get trampled on, and the fickle opinions of the mob hold sway. The US is a constitutional republic, governed by the rule of law, ignored as it is nowadays.

Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other. John Adams

[a completely inoffensive name]

There are already laws in America involving drinking and firearms. I would say don't drink. How many crimes and accidents of all natures are alcohol-related? More children drown in the bathtub than die from accidental gunshot wounds. We need to teach responsibility, for with every right comes a responsibility. It is my right to own a gun; it is my responsibility to make sure that it functions, and that I know how to operate it safely. Also we need to teach them morality, which has been removed from the schools. If we tell them that it is wrong to do something, such as kill people, we should tell them why it is wrong. It is my right to vote; it is my responsibility to know what the candidates stand for. Especially relevant today as it is a primary election day. And please, stop talking about democracy. Democracy leads to anarchy, where everybody's rights get trampled on, and the fickle opinions of the mob hold sway. The US is a constitutional republic, governed by the rule of law, ignored as it is nowadays.

Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other. John Adams

How do you teach morality?

[Kadagar_AV]

How do you teach morality?

Easy:
* Don't do to others what you wouldnt like people to do to you.
* Do to others what you would want them to do to you...

it's quite simple, really.

[Beskar]

Easy:
* Don't do to others what you wouldnt like people to do to you.
* Do to others what you would want them to do to you...

it's quite simple, really.

Downside is, someone in the second category forget about the first and it can really bite back hard.

[Kadagar_AV]

Downside is, someone in the second category forget about the first and it can really bite back hard.

That's why we invented absolutely awesome stuff like laws, state-monopoly-violence and prisons...

Also the international court of Haag, it's only that scumbag nations don't adhere to it. With scumbag nations I mean USA, Israel, and other warmongering nations that doesn't seem to make even a decade without war.

Silly scumbag nations.

[a completely inoffensive name]

Easy:
* Don't do to others what you wouldnt like people to do to you.
* Do to others what you would want them to do to you...

it's quite simple, really.

This is terrible logic. What if I am really into public flogging........

[Pannonian]

This is terrible logic. What if I am really into public flogging........

Then you'll have to pay for the service like everyone else. Stilettos and leather gear are extra.

[Vincent Butler]

Teaching morality requires absolutes. For me, that is the Bible. A lot of those things, do unto others as you would have done to you, and such like, are biblical principals. The problem is, with the evolutionary rotgut pervading society, there are no absolutes. It is taught that man is just an animal. Well, no wonder we see school shootings. It shows that people understand what they have been taught. And so what? If evolution is true, then what is wrong with shooting somebody on a whim? Evolution is based on survival of the fittest. There are no true rights in an evolutionary society, for there is no higher power to bestow those rights.

[HoreTore]

How do you teach morality?

Ethics lessons, behavioural training, 'learning by doing', internationalism, etc. There are many ways of teaching morality.


Including brainwashing, of course.

Also, as for the post ACIN replied to:

In order for an agent to take an action, it needs both the opportunity AND the motivation to take that action. Democracy has few safeguards against mob rule and anarchy; sure. There is plenty of opportunity to oppress within a democracy. But as Tocqueville argued, democracy also removes the motivation to oppress. That's why democracy simply will not decend into mob rule and anarchy.

[ICantSpellDawg]

I don't believe in secular "morality". To me, those are just manners, and who gives a shit about manners? There are either transcendent reasons to do or not do something, or it is up to an individual to determine If an action would benefit them more than it would hurt them and compare that consequence with their desire to do the action.

On the flip side, I believe in a secular public legal system and a minimalist State. I am perfectly happy accepting the Bible as my personal superlative; I am legally free to be a hypocrite if my will or personal reason/logic supersedes something that I read in the Bible. I am not okay with government developing laws based on the Bible/Koran/Fight Club/etc.

Down with laws, up with personal morality which is taught in the home and in communities.

[a completely inoffensive name]

Well to go back a few posts, I said it was intellectualism taken to an extreme. I also feel it deserves a name of its own, separate from anything that might confer that the ideas are smart, which they are not. As GC notes, if you go far enough in both extremes, they start to look eerily similar. As for prohibition, the government could have just made public intoxication a death sentence and it would have achieved the same goal of scaring many and driving others underground. Prohibition is still a failure because the same results could have been achieved in a less totalitarian method, unless you are the kind of person who still believes the war on drugs is still the best defense against rampant heroin addiction. Not to mention the other issues of prohibition which includes the complete destruction of american beer and spirit craftsmanship which is only in the past 15 years beginning to rebuild. And let's not talk about the oligopoly in the beer market that was unapologetically cemented into law after prohibition that suppressed small businesses and promoted government corruption.

[Rhyfelwyr]

I think that extremely stringent drinking laws would do Britain the world of good. It is staggering what alcohol-related problems cost our economy, indeed the extent of the problem is so wide and varied that it is almost incomprehensible - everything from the burden its puts on the NHS, to the prison system, to the welfare system, to days missed off work... not to mention the indirect effects it has on peoples' lives - broken marriages, spousal/child abuse, unwanted pregnancies, mental health, unemployment, etc. The drinking culture in Britain is shocking, you can't compare it to what you see in Souther Europe, or indeed most of the rest of the world. What is going on today is well beyond what is acceptable. Remember this gem?

I wouldn't go so far as to suggest outright prohibition, since that would be totalitarian. However, it is well within both the spirit and the tradition of those governments at Westminster that secured and protected our liberties for hundreds of years, to take very harsh measures against the production and distribution of alcohol.

The aim in such measures should be to foster a healthy drinking culture. To allow our small, traditional pubs to flourish, while slamming the big chain-pubs and the night-clubs which seem to be increasingly ubiquitous. Allow our small, traditional breweries to recover while slamming the big multinational corporations that have shut them down.

This would take a multi-pronged approach. A good start might be to:

1. Ban any company above a certain size from producing alcohol - this removes competition from local brewers, while also taking the cheapest alcohol (and thus the most problematic) off the market.
2. Ban chain pubs - same reasoning as above, these tend to be the sort of places where our binge drinking culture manifests itself, not the more quaint local establishments.
3. Ban certain alcohol imports - eg cheap foreign trash that fuels problem drinking, while allowing the connoisseur to get their French wines and German lagers. A simple rule to avoid red-tape would be to have a minimum retail price per unit - anything below it isn't allowed.
4. Subside alcohol advertisements - help the local brewers to get their name out and re-market alcohol as part of a different experience - not as something to be part of a 'night out', but as a traditional beverage to be enjoyed with a family meal.
5. Stop going overboard with the alcohol education in schools - seriously, its counter-productive. It makes it seem cool and risky and rebellious, and highlighting the dangers doesn't really counteract those points - kids see adults drinking it all the time so they know it won't kill them, at least not right away.

[Fragony]

Nothing of all that is going to help, the UK has a bigger problem, sadness. The UK is a truly depressing place. Not the countryside, but the city's. It sucks every bit of happiness out of your bones.

[Husar]

Nothing of all that is going to help, the UK has a bigger problem, sadness. The UK is a truly depressing place. Not the countryside, but the city's. It sucks every bit of happiness out of your bones.

Yes, most people drink because it's the only way they know to feel some kind of happiness and to forget their worries.

Don't just fight the symptoms.

[Fragony]

Good move to help my point across https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gMwzvAt84P8

Don't be put of by the violent sex in the first scene, movie is full of brilliant dialogues and observations.

But it's mostly very sad.

Well worth your time.

[Greyblades]

Nothing of all that is going to help, the UK has a bigger problem, sadness. The UK is a truly depressing place. Not the countryside, but the city's. It sucks every bit of happiness out of your bones.

'Pretty sure that's true of all large cities post recession.

[Husar]

'Pretty sure that's true of all large cities post recession.

In the UK maybe, in Germany the cities are not as sad.