Ukraine Thread

[Brenus]

“As his "Russian spring 2014" failed attempts showed,” What are you speaking about? What is actually happening is in Putin’s advantage (or Russian). Ukraine is now effectively divided in a Bosnian scenario, as I analysed it few months ago when some of us were speaking of Russian Tanks rolling to Warsaw and NATO tanks engaging the Russian ones…

“By having acted not so hastily, he could have had more than what you think he gained” At what point? Without action, he would have been entangled in negotiation and lost Crimea. In helping the rebels, just enough, he successfully put back the borders (frontlines) where they are now, at the time of some of us were speaking of Ukrainian forces “mopping up” what was left of the Rebels forces qualified as mercenaries and aliens. So, I don’t know where Putin strategy failed, but from here, I think he got quite a good position. He kept Crimea, and Russia will keep Crimea, as no Russian government will be able to give-it up.

“and he finds the Crimea more and more financially burdensome”; Well, if Russia would have allowed NATO (oops, sorry, Ukrainian Western oriented Government) to control the under see pipelines, the cost for Russia would have been much more expensive, as the loss of the Crimean ports for their fleet.

“The position is still unified since the sanctions are still there” For how long? As soon they will be lifted, and they will, Russia (Putin) wins. As long they are enforces, EU loses. And then, all work and effort will turn in order to gain Russia market again.

“So you believe that the countries you enumerated should be released from the abominable EU slavery and let go about by themselves? The moment they quit they will have jobs aplenty and economies booming? What makes you so sure it will save them from the collapse they are (as you believe) experiencing?” Who speak of beliefs? Look at the rate of unemployment in these countries. Even in UK, if you had the figures of "Zero Hours Contract", and contrary of the Tories Propaganda, the economical situation is at least fragile, with a debt increasing steadily.
There are few things I am sure: Where are the jobs now? Where is the prosperity now? Where is the protection for the poor now? Where is the voice of the populations now? Why pensions are going down now? So EU didn’t delivered what it was built for, because EU is actually under the dictatorship of an ideology where human beings are not the priority but the so-call laws of free market, which of course are not law but political implementation of absurd ideas.

“Are there any? I mean except instructors” “Yet what is left of Ukraine is relentlessly (for Putin) moving NATOwards.” You gave the answer to your question.