POTUS Election thread

[a completely inoffensive name]

Yeah I dont know who you have been talking to but most of those young liberals demonizing Hillary are actually libertarian refugees who are just anti-establishment. Such as my roommate. Who used to support Rand Paul and now is a Bernie supporter. Looking at the /r/politics sub on Reddit is not indicative of most liberals. Most actual liberals wouldnt cut off the nose just to spite the face. And the turnout for the democrats is hardly record lows. Maybe compared to 2008, but certainly not record lows. For example, turnout this year in South Carolina was much higher compared to 2004. Plus I know of a number of Republicans who would vote for Hillary over Trump. Such as my parents and some of my friends. And when you have the Senate Majority Leader saying that the GOP wont get behind Trump if he wins the nomination, its clear that they would rather torpedo Trump and have a better shot at winning 2020 (once the anti-establishment candidates have been discredited) than have Trump in the White House who could be a major disaster for the GOP.

Young people don't vote for a reason. If they are given a choice between two evils, they don't bother choosing.

Any conservative talking about choosing Hillary over Trump is venting their frustration. She has been the conservative anti-christ since the 1990s, when it comes time to make a choice, they are going to fall back on party loyalty, or they won't vote at all.

Mitch McConnell thinks the GOP can just ride out this election just because his seat is not threatened. The GOP leadership is feckless and have handled Donald Trump in the worst possible way for months now.
Their plan since 2008 has been to remove Obama and try to reverse his policies, if they concede this election then they abandon everything they have working for over the last 8 years. The liberals get their victories cemented in stone, and we get to experience a SCOTUS where up to 3 judges are nominated by President Trump. Do you not see how utterly terrible this idea is?

[Hooahguy]

Young people don't vote for a reason. If they are given a choice between two evils, they don't bother choosing.

Yes, because young people are generally naive when it comes to how politics works. Also tend to be lazy and not even register beforehand then complain when they wake up on election day and cant vote.

Any conservative talking about choosing Hillary over Trump is venting their frustration. She has been the conservative anti-christ since the 1990s, when it comes time to make a choice, they are going to fall back on party loyalty, or they won't vote at all.

We will see. Hillary in the White House is better for the GOP than Trump. According to some of my more moderate friends, Trump would not only wreck the GOP he would wreck the country. They say that at least with Hillary not only do they have a stronger shot at winning in 2020, they can shore up the base. Possibly. We will see in November.

Mitch McConnell thinks the GOP can just ride out this election just because his seat is not threatened. The GOP leadership is feckless and have handled Donald Trump in the worst possible way for months now.
Their plan since 2008 has been to remove Obama and try to reverse his policies, if they concede this election then they abandon everything they have working for over the last 8 years. The liberals get their victories cemented in stone, and we get to experience a SCOTUS where up to 3 judges are nominated by President Trump. Do you not see how utterly terrible this idea is?

They have certainly messed up with Trump, but if torpedoing him to maintain their seats and possibly have a shot for 2020 they will. Its the GOP.
An accurate cartoon of the situation:

(click to expand)

[a completely inoffensive name]

We will see. Hillary in the White House is better for the GOP than Trump.

Right, the outspoken liberal with the political clout and monetary backing of wall street is better for conservatives than Donald "Build the Wall" Trump. Again, losing an election is not a legitimate strategy towards winning another.

According to some of my more moderate friends, Trump would not only wreck the GOP he would wreck the country. They say that at least with Hillary not only do they have a stronger shot at winning in 2020, they can shore up the base. Possibly. We will see in November.

I would say your conservative friends are about as delusional as Democrats thinking that 4 years of George Bush would shore up the DMC base for 2004.

They have certainly messed up with Trump, but if torpedoing him to maintain their seats and possibly have a shot for 2020 they will. Its the GOP.

Or, you know, they could just work with him. Since he is after all, a moderate conservative. The GOP's strategy is nonsense, it's old guard with ego's too big to let another one into the club.

[Gilrandir]

In case you didn't see:
http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/20...erious-problem

[Greyblades]

...a piece of fanfiction?

[Hooahguy]

Right, the outspoken liberal with the political clout and monetary backing of wall street is better for conservatives than Donald "Build the Wall" Trump. Again, losing an election is not a legitimate strategy towards winning another.

You are thinking very short term. Yes, Clinton would be a major risk. But polling shows over a third of GOP voters say they won't vote for Trump. Whether or not that is true remains to be seen, but it is widely viewed that Trump is tearing the GOP apart. Christie's defection is further sign of this.

Besides, since their hold on Congress seems to be pretty safe, the GOP can just continue to obstruct as they always did with Obama, so not much would get done anyways.

Also both sides have the backing of Wall Street, whatever the hell that means.

I would say your conservative friends are about as delusional as Democrats thinking that 4 years of George Bush would shore up the DMC base for 2004.

The two situations are not anywhere near similar. At all. For one, the respective establishments were solidly behind their candidates. The election of either did not threaten the breakup of any party.

It makes simple sense really. HRC in the White House means the GOP can keep on the attack which has proven to be profitable for them. If Trump is in the White House they are now on the defensive with an idiot in charge.

Or, you know, they could just work with him. Since he is after all, a moderate conservative. The GOP's strategy is nonsense, it's old guard with ego's too big to let another one into the club.

Whatever the GOP strategy is, we know that they won't get behind Trump. After the 2012 election the GOP decided it needed to do more to attract minority voters. Trump is ignoring all of that and appealing solely to the base that would vote republican regardless. Doesn't bode well at all for him. I'm sure in the end the GOP would work with him, it's the extent that they would that is the question. Trump is a divisive character, the GOP needs to decide if sabotaging Trump in the hopes that the guys in the middle would accept the GOP to win future elections is worth it.

[Greyblades]

I think it will hinge on whether or not Trump "sobers" once he wins the primaries.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

Trump is an old-fashioned positional bargainer who likes to make deals. He starts at 300% of what he will settle for and then haggles until he gets something in the acceptable range. Trump supporters are currently basking in his 'no-holds-barred' rhetoric, but should he win the brass ring they will end up with governance far closer to the same-old-same-old that currently exists. THAT is when the GOP crisis peaks and we see if a party split occurs. Trump winning the nomination but losing to Hilary in the general will generate a continuance of the current state of things and will ALSO create a lesser risk of GOP break up as the Tea Party wing again feels themselves used and abused.

The only major candidate left who would truly attempt to downsize government, minimize the power of the executive, and pursue a more conservative social agenda is Ted Cruz. Unfortunately for Ted, BOTH the Dems and the GOP establishment would oppose him in a general were he to get the nomination (the establishment by damning through faint praise means).

Rather disconnected on a personal level I am. Like Cruz on downsizing government and following a more constitutional path, but do NOT want the government legislating social issues better left to the several states. Like Trump's theme of "great again" but do NOT see any substance behind him and roll my eyes at the thought of Trump v Putin at a summit. Rubio is establishment, despite his rhetoric, so we would have more of the same with him and someone who is not going to command respect among foreign leaders who will view him as an "intern."

All-in-all, we end up with another President Clinton, the Dems take bake the Senate on a 50/50 basis using the VP, the House continues as it is, and nothing definitively useful gets done for another four years. Go USA.

[Sarmatian]

So after this, it is pretty much certain it's gonna be a Trump/Clinton face off, which also pretty much makes certain another Clinton will be in the White House.

Same old, same old.